Born and raised in New York, Jackson had a life of entertainment lined up for him. he had lots of family in a myriad of different places, he was sure to get a job somewhere. though now... it's hard to see much of a future for him... at all. as one fateful trip to visit his family in Linovia has stranded him struggling to survive Now stuck he's looking to find a way to bring a ray of light of some kind to this bleak bleak world... but first things first... he needs to get his hands on something that can let him do that.
I'm not trying to flame anyone.
I'm trying to suggest a system that will promote people to have fun rather than worry about going through red tape and weather or not they are near where they died, instead of having a fun time role playing with their friends.
Counter point: I've said multiple times now, that you seem to have ignored. there is a thing the mods can add that gives a log if a player loots their body.
please be captain obvious and explain what aspects make it more difficult to moderate.
Red tape and information that is only revealed to you after you choose to bring it to the mods. which no one will because it's been stated that it not appealable
Not the point of the post at all.
What's the harm in looting a town you died in? and this is assuming no RP was made in this town previously, and you don't loot your body.
you cannot use "it's breaking NLR" as an excuse.
as soon as they figure out the point of the thread and stop slapping me with the same bullshit broken record excuse and give valid points against my arguments. yea sure.
As in quoting what i said. telling me why it wouldn't work, and maybe suggesting a change to it so that it might work
2: i didn't say anything about special exceptions. i laid out a different set of rules that could be followed, which would allow for players to be able to still have fun and follow NLR easily.
3: by the rules standards i did Break NLR. however nothing i did while returning to the location interfered with anyone game play or experience. and i didn't return to my body to loot it.
sigh.... I'm saying to use the new system as a tool. stop witch hunting players. yes actively monitor it, and if they spawn outside a town that just so happened to be the one they died in and they loot it for starter equipment and then leave. don't engage in RP or anything just loot, overlook their body, and be on their way, then what's the problem with it? WHERE'S THE FLAWS IN MY SUGGESTION?!
The system that was implemented has 10 minute intervals. between pings on logs. a lot can happen in that space of time to moderators then have to make judgement calls on who gets banned and who doesn't.
you still seem to miss my bloody point. Monitor it. add the mod that pings staff when players loot their body, dish out warnings and shorter bans if they actively return to a 1000 meter radius of it (the electro->chero example) and then leave the rest up to reports. don't ban people because they were having fun. use this new tool to help cross reference the things people said. they have damage logs, death logs, and now location logs. it shouldn't be used to witch hunt players who are having fun. that's an A+ way to get people to just jump to TRZ.
Loot on your body isn't important. what's wrong with nabbing starter equipment? and there is a way to prove it there's a mod that can ping the staff if a player loots their own body.
but there also being actively used to which hunt players. innocent players who have done minor things that don't impact RP at all.
NLR and firefights were handled just fine previously. however, my argument is that as long as your not actively making an attempt to return to your body and loot it, or to return to a previous area, or break someones immersion by coming back from death, then it should be waived. what's the problem in looting a town you died in RP wise? genuinely what's the problem with it? there is literately a mod that adds a log that can tell staff if a player looted their body.
Was a 3 day ban on a player with with 0 points and no option to appeal necessary though? a 12/24 hour ban sure. but 3 whole days?
Now all of a sudden i have a rap sheet.
a warning would have been a lot more proper.
Also. i can avoid it all i want but here's the issue: there's gonna be times where i'm in the town and i've forgotten, we're human, we're making mistakes, and if i'm actively worrying about where i got and constantly bouncing out of the game to contact staff, them i'm constantly being pull out of the experience.
the ways i've suggested that it be policed differently wouldn't be difficult to implement, are fairly straight forward.
And unless you can tell me what they are i refuse to believe that you actually read what they are and understand them. because if you did you'd be able to give me points on why it wouldn't properly work like an actual argument.
Tell me. what about my suggestions do you agree with, and where you find problems in with what i said in my original post?
I'm not mad that you're disagreeing with me, i'm mad because you're disagreeing with me on points i never made, which screams to me that you clearly didn't read the post.
I want there to be NLR.
But it needs to be Policed differently.
Same here. however reports have been able to handle this just fine. with the logs it should be used as a tool. not used to Witch hunt NLRs.
This something i personally... half agree with
On the right track but not exactly. I don't want people to loot their bodies period. but i also don't wanna get banned because i was near my body.
We are here to roleplay and have fun.
So, if what i do in game doesn't interfear with either of those (In general i'm not saying go loot or any of that shit) but if i loot a town and it doens't mess with someone elses fun or RP. then why am i being banned? at that stage no one did anything wrong
and you can't say "because the players need to fear death" if they don't fear death then that's Bad RP and has nothing to do with NLR.
Not the point of the this post read the damn post.
yea, a lot of things sound great on paper right? however lets think for a moment. and i'm sad i have to explain this again because i already explained it in the post that you clearly didn't read. What does is matter if no body cares? it needs to return to a primarily Report system.
If you have a perfectly adaquate town in front of you to loot, but you activly return to the town, then yea that get's hit with a ban (in my eyes it gets hit with a warning and a 12 hour ban and if you loot the body then it's a 3 hour ban)
the primary factor is.
WHAT WAS THE POINT OF IT. WHAT IS THE PLAYER BEING PUNISHED FOR, AND WHY IS THAT PUNISHMENT SIGNIFICANT WITH CONTEXT?
- snip -
yea buddy that's red tape. people aren't going to do that, and it wasn't announced ANYWHERE to ANYONE that people have that option, so only when they get hit with an NLR are they then informed that they can. which isn't fair to them
However let me add previously that this wasn't as issue before hand. Why must i now go through red tape to access information just so i can play in peace? this as well takes up Staff time. and assuming EVERYONE did this EVERY SINGLE TIME THEY DIED. they'd be overwhelmed and wouldn't be able to keep up porperly.
Look at the field example. with the current system that's in place, you'd get banned because you unknowingly watched the sun rise in a field where your dead body was. and you had no idea your dead body was there.
The point of this thread is to snuff that unjust ban, that might i remind you is UNAPPEALBLE, out.
I'm not complaining about going to get gear off a body. i even said IF YOU LOOT YOUR BODY THAT'S GROUNDS FOR A BAN. I said that. READ THE POST.
Also, if we're going to go "In character". when you die you leave all memories of your time leading up to your death. so if you spawn outside the town you died in you therefore have no memeory that you died in that town, Checkmate i don't wanna see that argument again because it doesn't add ANYTHING or even apply to what i'm trying to convey
not the point of the post.
Again... not the point of the post? you still seem to be attempting to educate me on how it works... again... which is not what i'm trying to convey... i'm trying to make changes to it so that people who accidentally enter the town without knowing, or simply want to have a fun time with friends without having to wait a whole HOUR because a Z got them are punished with a 3 day ban.
you clearly didn't read the post well enough.
If you loot your body. you break NLR. I said that multiple times.
I'm not opposed to NLR. however i believe changes need to be made in the way its handled to keep from unjust bans being dished out.
A: you came into this chat, i'm not asking you to argue, i'm asking for people to discuss.
B: this system can and will cause unjust things, and will actively make players quit if there is a 0 tolerance policy for such minor things that have 0 consequences other than the ban that is artificially placed on them
C : I understand how the rule works right now, you do not need to remind me, i'm not mis-informed or uninformed, i'm attempting to create a more balanced system players can enjoy and have fun in RP rather then getting banned for 3 whole days over something that was overall, inconsequential
I never said anything about loot being important.
I brought what you said up in the above. Red Tape, no one likes red tape, no one wants to go through red tape. and with that being said. assuming you DON'T KNOW WHAT HAPPENED AND YOU SPAWN OUTSIDE THE PLACE YOU DIED, BUT YOU DON'T KNOW THIS THEN WHY WOULDN'T YOU GO IN AND LOOT SAID TOWN HMMMMMMM... Small paradox. so if you wanna get into RP reasons then i'm gonna be real quick to shut that down,
On top of that i made it clear that what you said is not the point/reason of this post, at all.
My limits are this: If someone takes issue with the NLR, or you looted your body, or if you returned to a firefight, or something similar to along those lines, then yea, you broke NLR. other wise, it didn't effect anyone and you should be fine, however with their new system they are dishing out unjust NLRs to players who have done nothing to bring down RP
Picture if you will: You're walking Through a field to get to a town, you've got some starting equipment, a backpack, maybe a pistol lacking a clip, a hatchet. and you get jumped and killed by wolves. No one was around, just you, a field in the middle of nowhere, and now your dead body is in the middle of a field to despawn. you respawn in a random location. the night is coming to a close so you decide to get a decent vantage point to watch the sun rise. you find a field and walk into it. you walk around it a bit for, let's say you watch the whole sun rise, you're there for 20 minutes. moving around as you do so. you enjoy watching the sun rise. you head off, loot a nearby town, and log off for the day. next day you sit down to log on, and you've been banned for 3 whole days because your dead body was in that field. and you had no idea because you were watching the sunrise. and you quickly discover that upon attempting to file an appeal to give context, NLR bans are not at all appeal-able. This is what the current NLR system will do.
A few statements to keep in mind: this is a Roleplay community, and we're ultimately here to have fun. With that being said let me ask a few questions:
Who's RP experience was hindered or broken by this person returning to this random field? What was the point of the ban? was the ban ultimately worth it?
I recently purchases the Linovo DLC for Dayz and I began playing on the Linovo DayzRP server. 3 IRL days in I get killed by a Z. No issue really. so i followed a road, found a town, started looting, and got shot by a guy because i ran away. alright. no big issue. headed into a town and looted it up. and then logged off for the day.
2 days later i got banned for NLR. go to appeal, no ability to appeal. previously i thought "who reported me? and why?". upon looking at ban and reasoning, it appears they now track player potions and at the staff discretion decide who gets banned and who doesn't as they get a ping for those who break NLR. which means every 10 minutes your potion is logged and it gives a ping for those who are within 1000 meters of their body.
Let me remind everyone here: we're here to have fun. and roleplay. if you're not here for that then please tell me what the bloody hell you're doing here.
So. I'm not at all agreeing with these terms. if you die by anything for any reason what so ever, you can be banned. even if you spawn near you body. now i asked the staff about this and they told me "the options you have when you die is to either wait an hour before going anywhere, or ask an admin to figure out which direction you should go. you know what i call that? I call that RED TAPE. no one likes red tape, it's not fun, it's not necessary, and if anything it doesn't add to any sort of RP experience.
Now let's look at why NLR exists. it exists to keep people from going back to their bodies and looting them, or going back to firefights to finish the fight, or to keep people from going and saying "YOU SHOT ME!" and then opening up on that player. lemme preference by saying that i 100% whole heartedly agree that if any of the above happen, yes, you've broken NLR, you should get a 3 day ban.
HOWEVER, in a more subtle situation. lets say you're chatting with a stranger. and you die and that stranger sees you die. that person then goes on to overwatch the town and sees you looting around. This is a situation i'd personally still consider to be an NLR break.
But here's a question: who the fuck cares? did it hinder the RP experience? did it break immersion? were you actively pulled out of your character because of it? if the answer was no then the NLR doesn't matter! AT ALL.
If no RP was broken, harmed, or anything of the sort, then yea, NLR waived. a good example of this is when i ran with a group. we died every now and then, but we would break NLR and head back. we wouldn't loot our bodies or anything, we just returned and continued the RP. No body got reported for NLR, we all just had a good time and continued to RP out our characters having fun.
nobody cared. nobody had issue with it. why punish someone, for something, if it affected literally nobody?
The entire point of this post is to change the NLR rules. Previously it was just on a report system. however now the Staff are just doing it willy nilly without context as to what actually happened, they have ping markers that they get every 10 minutes that go to a log.
To be clear here is what i believe should be counted as a breaking of NLR:
Returning to a firefight/are with players that were actively hostile and re-engaging with them
Returning to an area that you had previously visited with a stranger.
LOOTING YOUR OWN BODY PERIOD
Getting shot by a player and returning to that town.
and these are situations that i would describe to be able to be waived:
Dying in a town and spawning near it, then going into town to re-loot
if in a group over radio, Breaking NLR to return to them to simply continue to RP. (unless a third party is involved.)
and those are just some examples.
Here's the thing. previously NLR got reported mostly only for like, combat scenarios, which made sense. however now people are getting banned left and right for accidental NLR. for 3 whole days, without appeal, I don't care how you swing it that ain't fair in the slightest.
Things that need to be added: Body looting. if a player loots their own body within the time span, that's NLR, and if it shows up in the log, yes ban, do it, that's fair. however, the rest of it should be via reports. If a player has taken as issue and has STOPPED HAVING FUN BECAUSE SOMEONE BROKE NLR AND IT'S ACTIVELY INHIBITING THEIR EXPERIENCE, then they should report it. if they don't that's their choice, if it doesn't actively ruin RP for someone (which might i remind you we're all here to RP and have fun) then what was the point of the punishment if, in the eyes of everyone who was actually involved with the NLR break, nothing was done wrong?
The system needs to be returned to going off of reports only. that way people who have issue with it can report it, and people who go back and loot their bodies themselves are given the ban as that shows that you had the knowledge of where you died.
Now Lemme say this. if you die in cherno, but you spawn near electro, and you go back to cherno, and you're not in a group, i believe that's susceptible for a Warning and maybe 12 hour ban. because instead of looting Electro, you for some odd reason went back to Cherno.
SO Summary of points:
Rampant NLR breaks are more common than you think, however they more often than not do not hinder the RP experience.
People who take issue with NLR, and see it should report it, if they don't that's their choice.
a log should be added to show if people loot their own bodies within the time slot, as that is clearly breaking NLR.
The new log that was made should be used as a data sheet that is accessed with an on-demand basis, it shouldn't act as a sheet of people for a judge to decide who get's bans and who doesn't.
Let me make my stance clear: I want to have fun. i don't want to go through red tape to go looting, and i definitely don't wanna have to be away from my friend in game for a whole HOUR because a wolf got me or a zombie got me. However I don't think people should return intentionally to the areas they died if one is readily available, i don't think people should loot their own bodies for ANY reason what so ever, and I ABSOLUTELY do not think you should return to an area intentionally if you were in a fire fight.
However i also believe that the mods shouldn't go off of their 10 minute ping system, as their are too many gaps in it, and a lot of the bans that come from it will be pointless and worth nothing, and will only make people like me angry mad. Go back to reports. use the ping system as a tool, not a chopping block, use it as needed to back up arguments and cross reference shit to see if it lines up.
@Roland I'd like to have a voice chat with you to discuss these points.
Argument to take away: What's the issue with it if no-one is affected by it?
Just to take down arguments before they arise: Yes they can add a log to show when people are looted and by who, i was in a chat with staff and one of them literally said "Yea that's a mod".
My argument is: if it actively goes against the "I don't know the events leading up to my death" meaning: location/cause/location of body, then yes it's a NLR break. however. as long as you don't interact or interfere with elements that lead up to your death, then you're fine.
If someone has an issue with it let them report it, otherwise a lot of unjust bans will get brought down on perfectly fine Roleplayers who've. overall done nothing wrong.
I've seen the base. If wolfpack is as big as you say it is then, yes it makes sense to have such an incredibly massive base to house all of the equipment and people there. they have the threat of having to clear out litterally ALL of the zombies whenever it goes silent. so there is always some risk with it.
While annoying that it takes up an entire town, I don't think it's unreasonable to be honest. they are a MASSIVE group. a superpower. so yea. they're gonna have one of the stronger bases in the game. that by ITSELF can initate roleplay and relationships with them.