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HDragon

S1 - Tisy - Invalid Kill

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Server and location: S1 Tisy

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): 2019-09-11, 02:50 

Your in game name: Vali Kuznestov

Names of allies involved: @Jsesse White @RiZStream @ImNovaaa @Lorcan @Fae @Willow

Name of suspect/s: Dalton's Gang

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): N/A

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): @RiZStream and @Jsesse White got some

Detailed description of the events: We were big chillin at our new base in Tisy and we decided to embrace our Russian pride since we were so close to the Russian border. I played the Russian National Anthem and saluted with the boys. I faded out the music and began to talk about how happy I was about the move when @Lorcan ran over to us and says something like "We are about to get fucked run". I see the homies run off so I join them only about 5 meters behind them. There were about 4 people who stayed at the entrance of our base when I guess Dalton's Gang initiated? I was hella confused and saw the people behind us with their hands up once we were like 50+ meters away. I asked on Discord what was happening because I was so confused. We then start to hear gun shots at which point I am tapped and fall dead. Confused as hell I said something like "I'm dead what the fuck just happened why the hell was I shot" because I am mad confused.

 

EDIT: Our situation is the beginning of @Mia's reported situation.

Edited by HDragon
I just noticed this..

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Copied my POV from the other report as it covers all I saw during this event.

--------


I was here for this messy situation - myself, @HDragon, @RiZStream, @Fae and I believe another were gathered around before the 'gunfight/hostage situation'. We were having some RP at the bottom of one of those concrete towers in Tisy when @Lorcan ran past saying "People need to run" or something along those lines - which confused us, so @RiZStreamand myself ran down the road a bit before being shot in the back. I didn't hear an initiation (unfortunately I didn't record this bit, however due what I believed to be a rulebreak I started recording when I was clear, to capture if anything else happened) and that began the confusion - as I didn't even know of anyone else being nearby - let alone who was actively shooting and killing people in our camp.

After retreating east and healing up a bit - @RiZStreamand myself decided we would loop around and see if we could decipher what in the hell was happening. There we had an altercation with someone on a hill - before I AFK'd in a bush and enabled my recording as the 'gang' was apparently moving out and done with the quick robbery of the hostages;

(Apologies for the loud/peaking microphone. I hadn't set up any audio settings in this software.)



The entire situation was just confusing. I didn't know who was attacking, or why, or when. I didn't hear an initiation, just got shot in the back. Then seeing an unarmed hostage get shot on the ramp after being told they were 'free to go'. If it was a miss ID, it's a severe lack of communication from the people who just released these hostages to their 'overwatch'.

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Kill Logs:

02:37:15 | Player "Anthony Torrez" (DEAD) killed by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 4.99925 meters 
02:38:02 | Player "Vali Kuznetsov" (DEAD) killed by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 96.7105 meters 
02:42:12 | Player "Tyler Lorenze" (DEAD) killed by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 20.662 meters 
02:42:14 | Player "Jake Powers" (DEAD) killed by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 13.0457 meters 
02:42:20 | Player "Lorcan Smith" (DEAD) killed by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 173.97 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" (DEAD) killed by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.1105 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" (DEAD) killed by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.10805 meters 
02:52:47 | Player "Radoslav Zdenek" (DEAD) killed by Player "Arthur Milton" with MP-133 from 0.956337 meters
02:54:47 | Player "Bela Kovar" (DEAD) killed by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 92.9843 meters 

Hit Logs:

Spoiler

02:37:15 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 4.99925 meters 
02:37:15 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 4.97926 meters 
02:37:15 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Luke Runningham" with AKM from 6.95268 meters 
02:37:15 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Luke Runningham" with AKM from 6.95268 meters 
02:37:15 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Luke Runningham" with AKM from 6.95268 meters 
02:37:15 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 5.0091 meters 
02:37:16 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Luke Runningham" with AKM from 7.4567 meters 
02:37:16 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 5.29246 meters 
02:37:16 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 5.43018 meters 
02:37:16 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 5.45136 meters 
02:37:16 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 5.60019 meters 
02:37:16 | Player "Anthony Torrez" hit by Player "Tyler Lorenze" with FN SCAR-L from 5.60019 meters

02:37:57 | Player "Lawrence Pierce" hit by Player "Jake Powers" with AK-74 from 152.945 meters 

02:38:02 | Player "Vali Kuznetsov" hit by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 96.7105 meters 
02:38:02 | Player "Vali Kuznetsov" hit by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 96.7105 meters

02:42:05 | Player "Jake Powers" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with AK-74 from 49.1943 meters 
02:42:05 | Player "Tyler Lorenze" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with AK-74 from 60.244 meters 
02:42:12 | Player "Tyler Lorenze" hit by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 20.6636 meters 
02:42:12 | Player "Tyler Lorenze" hit by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 20.6636 meters 
02:42:12 | Player "Tyler Lorenze" hit by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 20.662 meters 
02:42:12 | Player "Jake Powers" hit by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 11.6901 meters 
02:42:14 | Player "Jake Powers" hit by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 13.0457 meters 
02:42:14 | Player "Lorcan Smith" hit by Player "Jake Powers" with AK-74 from 13.0444 meters 
02:42:14 | Player "Lorcan Smith" hit by Player "Jake Powers" with AK-74 from 13.0444 meters 
02:42:14 | Player "Lorcan Smith" hit by Player "Jake Powers" with AK-74 from 13.0444 meters 
02:42:14 | Player "Lorcan Smith" hit by Player "Jake Powers" with AK-74 from 13.0444 meters 
02:42:14 | Player "Jake Powers" hit by Player "Lorcan Smith" with M1A SOCOM from 13.1029 meters 
02:42:20 | Player "Lorcan Smith" hit by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 173.97 meters 
02:42:20 | Player "Lorcan Smith" hit by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 173.97 meters 

02:50:53 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 4.12587 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.19113 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.11541 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.11541 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.11411 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.11411 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.1105 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.1105 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.1105 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.1105 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.1105 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.1105 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.10805 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.10805 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.10094 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.10094 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.10094 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Arri Graham" hit by Player "Bobby Kalo" with AKM from 3.10094 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.09721 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.09721 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.09721 meters 
02:50:54 | Player "Bobby Kalo" hit by Player "Arri Graham" with M4A1 from 3.09721 meters 

02:54:47 | Player "Bela Kovar" hit by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 92.9843 meters 
02:54:47 | Player "Bela Kovar" hit by Player "Tyler Pearce" with AWM from 92.9843 meters 

Chat Logs:

Spoiler

02:36:47 | Chat("Vali Kuznetsov"): *Thinks the british woman is plotting against the Russians
02:36:53 | Chat("Lawrence Pierce"): *His eyes would well up with pride, and hayfever*
02:37:07 | Chat("Lawrence Pierce"): *mostly hayfever*
02:41:04 | Chat("Bobby Kalo"): *FRISKS FOR ALL RAIDOS*//DO I FIND ANY?
02:41:19 | Chat("Willow Paden"): //NO
02:43:11 | Chat("Bobby Kalo"): *he grabs her hair*
02:43:17 | Chat("Bobby Kalo"): *HE DRAGS her*
02:43:40 | Chat("Bobby Kalo"): *HE THROWS her into the fence*
02:43:54 | Chat("Bobby Kalo"): *he kicks her legs, making her to her knees

Connection Logs:

Spoiler

02:18:10 | Player "Anthony Torrez" is connected
02:41:29 | Player "Anthony Torrez" has been disconnected
 
02:05:50 | Player "Tyler Lorenze" is connected
02:42:24 | Player "Tyler Lorenze" has been disconnected

02:05:25 | Player "Tyler Pearce" is connected
03:07:21 | Player "Tyler Pearce" has been disconnected

02:05:21 | Player "Jake Powers" is connected
02:42:35 | Player "Jake Powers" has been disconnected

02:03:32 | Player "Lorcan Smith" is connected
02:48:49 | Player "Lorcan Smith" has been disconnected
02:49:03 | Player "Lorcan Smith" is connected
04:12:49 | Player "Lorcan Smith" has been disconnected

02:11:40 | Player "Arri Graham" is connected
02:51:32 | Player "Arri Graham" has been disconnected

02:04:43 | Player "Bobby Kalo" is connected
02:53:25 | Player "Bobby Kalo" has been disconnected

02:14:11 | Player "Luke Runningham" is connected
03:29:18 | Player "Luke Runningham" has been disconnected

02:04:30 | Player "Bela Kovar" is connected
03:40:24 | Player "Bela Kovar" has been disconnected

Calling in the following people to post their point of views and any un-edited video evidence they may have:

 @HDragon | Vali Kuznestov | OP
 @hAwkzyyRP | Anthony Torrez | POSTED
 @OpticVC | Tyler Lorenze | POSTED
 @DannickVC | Tyler Pearce | POSTED
 @Powerjake | Jake Powers | POSTED
 @Lorcan | Lorcan Smith | POSTED
 @NorwayRP | Arri Graham | POSTED
 @MouseWB | Bobby Kalo | POSTED
 @tossVC | Luke Runningham | POSTED
 @Willow | Willow Paden | POSTED
 @Mia | Bela Kovar | POSTED IN THE OTHER REPORT - NO POST NECESSARY

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Anthony Torrez POV:

I was hanging out talking with some of the people at their base location at Tisy Military. I asked them if they possibly had any form of belt I could trade for or be given, but they said no so I decided to go search around the military area for this specific item. I went towards the tent area at the military base and I ran into two men which were heavily armed, I said "Hello" to both of them in a friendly tone. In return I was told to put my hands up by the individuall called Luke Runningham, which lead to me attempting to take the individuall out by shooting at him. I don't exactly recall what the intiation was word by word since the situation seemed completely valid in my opinion so I didn't bother saving a recording of this situation.
 

Edited by hAwkzyyRP

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Tyler Lorenze POV:

Myself and @tossVC (Luke Runningham) moved into the tents where we spotted @hAwkzyyRP. Following an exchange of greetings, both myself and Toss initiated on @hAwkzyyRP. Hawkzy did not comply, and after a brief exchange of gunfire we moved towards the heli pads. (He was not in the wrong at all to do this.) After this, myself and Toss moved to the heli pads to back to up other members of our group who were attempting to capture hostages. I was shot and killed after initiating on a man in the woods, but following our brief exchange of gunfire with @hAwkzyyRP, I did not fire another bullet.

Edited by OpticVC

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Tyler Pearce’s POV: @MouseWB and I were split up from from Optic and Toss. We were at the bunkers just near the heli pads, we saw people down there so we ran up and considering we already shot someone and we knew that we dropped our initiation in which people started running away after we did so, we followed the people that ran and one of the boys kept a gun on the hostages that stayed there. I followed one of the guys who had his gun out and was running away but looping around one of the heli pads, considering he did not stop even after pot shots were taken at him and he heard the initial initiation, I shot him with my AWM. After this I retreated back to the heli back to help the boys with the hostages in which @Powerjake and @OpticVC initiated on a guy down in the trees, I covered them with the AWM from up on the heli pads, after that a random dude opened fire and killed powerjake then the hostage put his hands down and killed @OpticVC

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POV: myself and a lot of Dalton’s gang begin to make our way into Tisy before me and @OpticVC split off, we run into @hAwkzyyRP exchange a few words before I initiate on him due to my in-character knowledge of the man’s past, he does not comply and is taken down. Myself and @OpticVC then make our way to the ramp where I handle the main group of hostages, roleplaying with them while the rest of the boys including @MouseWB @DannickVC @OpticVC go outside and clear the rest out. I’m not aware of how the OP died specifically.

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POV: So I was one of the hostages taken with @Mia & the other girl at the bottom of the ramp. Their initiation on us three was valid because we could hear them, but @HDragon & the rest of everyone (other than @hAwkzyyRP 's situation) were WELL out of voip range hence they ran away 10 seconds before they even initiated as I believe @Lorcan saw a good amount of people starting to show up. As you can see, @HDragon is almost 100 meters away when shot & that's quite out of voip range if you ask me. Their initiation on the 5 hostages that were on the ramp that you can see in @Mia 's video was valid, we all heard, and we complied. The rest of everyone did not hear, making @HDragon 's death invalid.

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POV: Running around Tisy military i see a bunch of random dudes running towards us so i slowly back off a few seconds later i see some people with hands up so now i know what is happening running around 2 men run up to me and tell me to put my hands up so i did moments later they take shots from the woods they both turn as soon as this happens i lower my hands pull my gun and gun them down moments later i get dropped by a sniper a few yards out. 

END POV:

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Hutch's POV: Was RPing in Tisy with a bunch of people. Heard some gun shots. @Lorcan wanted to chat with me. As I get over to him, he yells that we're fucked. I was confused as to why. I turned around and saw a few people. We kept running, shots were flying towards all of us. @Jsesse White is hit by one of the shots. @HDragon is killed in one shot. None of us heard an initiation and had any clue who was even shooting at us. @Jsesse White and I got away, went back to help the hostages. Ran into @NorwayRP which I let down in the fight (sorry buddy). Hostages were released and I was radioed a direction of where they went. @ImNovaaa was released and we pursued further.

Here's the clip of what lead up to this:

 

Edited by RiZStream
Clip

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Willow Paden's POV:

It was a dull cloudy day at Tisy and I was looking forward to sitting down and having some food after the long walk me and @Lorcan just had. I was alone on the platform where @RiZStream and his friends had built walls and somewhat of a structure. I wanted to use the campfire that was placed in the middle of the platform to cook some meat. Soon after that I walked to the rear of the helipad near the covered area to organize my bag and do some yoga when I was rudely interrupted by screaming men which I identified to be Daltons gang telling me to put my hands up and radio down. So I complied considering I didn't think it would be smart defend myself only having meat in my hand. I followed the demands of the men and was drug across the platform by my hair and beaten. Soon after that the men took me to a barn destination where I was tortured for about an hour. Not knowing any whereabouts of anyone or anything considering I lost my radio very early in the mess. 

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I was walking around just booling up at Tisy looting around, went over to the platforms saw some dudes getting shot, one of the rounds went over my head and damn near killed me. I walked over to the other platform met up with Lorcan, we ran around to try and get a shot. Lorcan gets initiated on we gas two I shoot at a sniper, run around to the north side. Find Hutch, Bobby runs up on my flank and Hutch lets me get shot, I trade with Bobby and die. That's about it, I saw the initiation and everything seemed valid to me. I was 50m away and I knew exactly what was going on and after watching through the twitch from Hutch's POV I think it's pretty clear everyone knew what was going on. And I was fighting with the OP's allies, on their side, after reading through Mia's report I can say that her side of the story was completely valid and understandable but I don't feel the same about this one. I was maybe 20m's away from the initiation I heard the tail end of it and chose to non-comply even though I wasn't a direct target, but everyone there knew exactly what was going down.

In my honest opinion it comes down to this, If you know an initiation is coming and you sprint away so you are just out of VOIP range so the initiation "technically" doesn't effect you in the manner that you have been initiated on but you would've or did come back and attempt to use your dynamic rights that's ruleplay, which is exactly what HDragon, would've done and exactly what Riz was attempting to do. However, because I got re-initiated on before Riz ever shot he got another set of rights before attempting to do what I pointed out above.

 

To some it up more cohesively,

A. The OP's dynamic knew they were about to be initiated on, half attempted to run away and stay in the area knowing that if they aggressing side had shot them they would through up a report as a result. Even though they knew they barely skirted off and got away from an initiation and were attempting to use their dynamic rights.

B. Following the initiation dropping, all those who were able to get out of VOIP range so the initiation didn't apply to them, came back and attempted to fight. And after 30 minutes or so claimed invalid kill when they were killed for attempting to rescue hostages.

C. Everyone from the OP's side who escaped the initiation or were not directly involved in that initiation but gained dynamic rights through the multiple re-initiations, including myself attempted to re-enter the situation using "Dynamic Rights" even though they are claiming they had "No Clue What Was Going On" as Riz said " None of us heard an initiation and had any clue who was even shooting at us" this is false seeing as Lorcan a member of Riz's and Hdragon's dynamic told me it was Dalton's gang 20 seconds after the initiation. Along with that in the clip Riz posted, 5 seconds before any shots you can hear a member of his group say "I got my Hands up." along with HDragon saying "We are getting shot from behind" on top of that HDragon says "I just got killed"

D. Following the 15 seconds after the initiation is where Riz and Lawerence attempt to flank around the South side of Tisy to re-engage and begin shooting at the aggressors showing clear knowledge they knew exactly what was going on. If HDragon Riz and Jssesse had the intention of RPing, and not fighting what would've happened is instead of running they would've stayed and complied or instead of running back and attempting to fight running away and staying safe.

So in conclusion, from the defenders side (The side that was being initiated on which I was on and present for) I do not feel this report to be at all valid and a clear attempt at Ruleplay/Meta from the OPs side.

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POV: Initiated on a guy, he put his hands up, I turned around for 1 second and he shot and killed optic and then me cause the ak74 bullets are trash. He got me fair and square, I had nothing to do with the invalid kills.

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1 hour ago, NorwayRP said:

To some it up more cohesively,

A. The OP's dynamic knew they were about to be initiated on, half attempted to run away and stay in the area knowing that if they aggressing side had shot them they would through up a report as a result. Even though they knew they barely skirted off and got away from an initiation and were attempting to use their dynamic rights.

B. Following the initiation dropping, all those who were able to get out of VOIP range so the initiation didn't apply to them, came back and attempted to fight. And after 30 minutes or so claimed invalid kill when they were killed for attempting to rescue hostages.

C. Everyone from the OP's side who escaped the initiation or were not directly involved in that initiation but gained dynamic rights through the multiple re-initiations, including myself attempted to re-enter the situation using "Dynamic Rights" even though they are claiming they had "No Clue What Was Going On" as Riz said " None of us heard an initiation and had any clue who was even shooting at us" this is false seeing as Lorcan a member of Riz's and Hdragon's dynamic told me it was Dalton's gang 20 seconds after the initiation. Along with that in the clip Riz posted, 5 seconds before any shots you can hear a member of his group say "I got my Hands up." along with HDragon saying "We are getting shot from behind" on top of that HDragon says "I just got killed"

D. Following the 15 seconds after the initiation is where Riz and Lawerence attempt to flank around the South side of Tisy to re-engage and begin shooting at the aggressors showing clear knowledge they knew exactly what was going on. If HDragon Riz and Jssesse had the intention of RPing, and not fighting what would've happened is instead of running they would've stayed and complied or instead of running back and attempting to fight running away and staying safe.

So in conclusion, from the defenders side (The side that was being initiated on which I was on and present for) I do not feel this report to be at all valid and a clear attempt at Ruleplay/Meta from the OPs side.

I'd like to respond to some of these accusations. We were fleeing in hopes of not getting into a gunfight. We had no idea at the time who was the aggressor, how many there were or what they wanted. We heard "we are so fucked" and we all ran. As we ran, people took shots at @HDragon and @Jsesse White when none of us actually heard any kind of initiation. That is what this report is about.

@Lorcan was not in our comms at the time if I recall correctly. He was in separate comms with @Willow I believe. We didn't know who the aggressors were until @ImNovaaa got done with the hostage situation and radioed to us it was Dalton's Gang from what I can remember.

After @HDragon drops, and @Jsesse White and I get to a safe area, we decide to try to go back and rescue hostages, using the dynamic rights we did gain from the situation. We didn't have any intentions of any kind of ruleplay. If you watch the VOD we were all confused as to what just happened. We were roleplaying at the base, ran due to the "we are so fucked" statement and were shot at. 

As for the situation in Novaya that you're referring to 30 minutes later, that wasn't even in my POV, as I wasn't reporting anything in regards to that situation. I knew what I was getting into and died fair and square trying to rescue @Willow.

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@MouseWB will be temp banned until he provides his POV and any un-edited video evidence he has.

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POV: We go up to tisy where we the all the people standing by the helipads. I hear over radio two of my boys tell someone to put his hands up, as they say he did not comply. I run up and scream to everyone to put their hands up as most did, yet three ran away. We take the hostages to the helipad as I go with, and not worry about the three that left. I talk with the hostages for a bit then go off hearing that we took some shots. I run around a bit until running and seeing someone aim their gun at the helipads. I tell him to put his hands up, as he shoots I fire back, this is when I am killed.

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@MouseWB You're Temp ban has been lifted

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Verdict:

Due to the only video evidence provided by @RiZStream regarding the initiation, we can not determine if the entire group was or was not in voip range of the initiation, and therefore we will have to mark this as inconclusive.

However @HDragon we hear you call your death over voice but as we are not sure what is said after we will let you go with your FINAL verbal warning in the regard of calling out deaths, please in the future keep it to yourself or leave the call with your friends until the situation is over!

 

Result:

Invalid kill (Dalton gang) - Inconclusive 

Metagaming - ( @HDragon) - VERBAL WARNING

 

Signed: @Realize & @Samti + notes

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