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JamesRP

Punching

Punching  

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Just curious as to what the community thinks about the "punching or hitting someone being an invalid initiation". Personally I think punching somebody one time should not be an invalid initiation nor should it be an attempted invalid kill, simply because it is 1 punch, it is not a threat to someones life, maybe if someone punches you and keeps punching you, then it could be considered invalid initiation or attempted invalid kill. I also think punching somebody 1 time should not give the other person kill rights on the person who punches.

I think its silly that punching someone gives other people rights and the fact it can be considered an invalid initiation, or even an attempted invalid kill.

What are your thoughts?

 

Edited by JamesRP

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Roland clarifies here a bit how it works.

 

Its my personal stance that if its done for roleplay, and done well, its great. I've been punched more then a few times by other characters, and I've never considered reporting it as it fit the mood and motion of the scenario.

 

That being said, I've also seen people get punched and immediately killed. Whether it was an accident or not, it sucks hard for the person that got killed and I wouldn't at all be surprised if they reported it. 

 

 

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Just now, Rover said:

That being said, I've also seen people get punched and immediately killed. Whether it was an accident or not, it sucks hard for the person that got killed and I wouldn't at all be surprised if they reported it. 

Im not sure if thats a bug or an actual in game mechanic, getting killed in one punch. I can understand if someone dies from one punch and they want to report it. I just think it shouldnt be reported, it was an accident they obviously didnt mean to kill them from one punch.

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1 minute ago, JamesRP said:

Im not sure if thats a bug or an actual in game mechanic, getting killed in one punch. I can understand if someone dies from one punch and they want to report it. I just think it shouldnt be reported, it was an accident they obviously didnt mean to kill them from one punch.

 

I think it has something to do with bone health or something of the sort. Not the most familiar with the mechanics. 

 

I can respect not wanting to report it. But at the same time, it is an invalid kill, no different then shooting someone in the leg and having them die from it. DayZ is a buggy game, so the safest route would be emoting it... But it just doesn't have the same impact as thwacking someone upside the head.

 

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From how I understood it from what Rolle said on eagles question thread (o7) is that invalid initiation is not a rule break but that it will lead to more rulebreak(s) like invalid kill which are the bannable things.

In the past, punching is a tool used heavily by groups of people trying to further RP, possibly you know punching someone to knock some sense into them if they're being rude or talking a lot, a punch isnt going to kill anyone but most of the time further the RP because it wasn't a gunshot and they aren't dead so the rp has already improved. 

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I just don't understand why have we suddenly started punishing people for it. Many reports had people punching others yet literally in none of them are they getting punished for it. The one thing we were missing is restricting the roleplay even more.

Edited by AndreyQ

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End of the day

People across all groups want interesting and diverse hostile RP. If the only way I can be hostile with you, other than tone of voice, is to just initiate, shit gets old fast and people start accusing groups of being "bread and butter hostile RP'ers". 

Stop banning for a mere punch. It's that simple. if it results in a kill, sure, hit them with invalid kill. it's a risk that makes hostile RP so much more entertaining and diverse.

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People are always so worried about kill rights. Just focus on the RP. 

If a punch fits into the RP then people shouldn't consider it initiation. But people seem to focus on whether they can kill, they don't stop to think if they should kill or actually RP. 

There has been only a handful of times on this server where I actually killed someone because even if I have kill rights it doesn't further that storyline if I actually kill the person. So I don't think a single punch should be an initiation because people would just want to shoot if that's the case and that doesn't further RP. 

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Shouldn’t be an attempted invalid kill, a fist isn’t a weapon. 

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5 minutes ago, APositiveElmo said:

Shouldn’t be an attempted invalid kill, a fist isn’t a weapon. 

giphy.webp

 

Well to my knowledge punching was something community did despite rules... same as shooting hostage in the leg. It was a RISK we took KNOWINGLY, over time normalized by the community that it was ok to do that. Even though Rolle always disagreed.

Edited by Shanoby

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A single punch shouldn't be considered anything. It's a punch, a punch could be used for anything from: stopping the progress of someone dismantling your base or  challenging some to a fist fight.

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3 minutes ago, Finn said:

A single punch shouldn't be considered anything. It's a punch, a punch could be used for anything from: stopping the progress of someone dismantling your base or  challenging some to a fist fight.

Or killing them. People have killed with a single punch before, isn't that right @Imation11  ? 😄 

 

You are right though Finn. Its my personal stance that punches aren't a big deal, especially when used to interrupt things. However it is clear that you can get killed by a punch (even one), and it has always been a stance held here that you have a right to defend yourself from any hostile action. Punches have been deemed to be a hostile action.

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8 minutes ago, Rover said:

Or killing them. People have killed with a single punch before, isn't that right @Imation11  ? 😄 

 

You are right though Finn. Its my personal stance that punches aren't a big deal, especially when used to interrupt things. However it is clear that you can get killed by a punch (even one), and it has always been a stance held here that you have a right to defend yourself from any hostile action. Punches have been deemed to be a hostile action.

Just call me one punch! I’m a hero for fun 

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Personally I think punching somebody should not be considered as an initiation unless the player/person throwing the punch intends to cause harm in that current scenario, If the attacker throws more then one punch and delivers damage with each hit its possible they could knock you out or kill you, IRL you would consider this an initiation of conflict and defend yourself or at least attempt to.

 

Edited by Frenchie

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It's all about intent. I say avoid punching people because the game is buggy. If the intent was to have a little boxing match in the yard to let off some steam or mess around, then I'm all for it. But if you're robbing someone and you just straight up punch them and you end up killing them, you're better off talking it over with group OOC and try to revive the RP, rewind a minute and try again. That's what I'd like to see. Sadly some players will take advantage and loot your body and get away with it. 

You're better off just typing it out if you want to punch a prisoner/captive in the gut to get compliance just due to the buggy nature of the game. But talk it out in OOC first before reports start flying. Especially if the intent was not to one hit kill you. 

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I personally think that punches are all part of RP and should be treated as such.

But punching an armed man isn't very intelligent and should be dealt with accordingly. 

If you were to punch someone IRL a fight would ensue most likely, but if you were to punch an armed individual IRL, it probably wouldnt end well for you. 

But in the end, it's all an opinion.

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From my own experience, punching seems to have been used to bait an initiation more than anything else.  If punching people isn't an initiation, you can just punch anyone with your crew waiting for a poor soul to say the words that will seal his fate. With a punch being an initiation, this gives proper defense rights to the victim instead of putting him in a situation where his only resort to stop hostilities is to put his life on the line and initiate, which is very backwards on a RP server, because we all know that as soon as the guy who got punched initiates, he'll be gunned down.

Seems like an "easy loot" loop mentality, as demonstrated by this scientifically supported demonstration of a sample chain of events.

1-Punch random geared people who you'd like to loot.

2-Do it until that person initiates.

3-Have your crew gun him down.

4-??

5-Profit

Edited by OldSchool

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5 minutes ago, OldSchool said:

From my own experience, punching seems to have been used to bait an initiation more than anything else.  If punching people isn't an initiation, you can just punch anyone with your crew waiting for a poor soul to say the words that will seal his fate. With a punch being an initiation, this gives proper defense rights to the victim instead of putting him in a situation where his only resort to stop hostilities is to put his life on the line and initiate, which is very backwards on a RP server, because we all know that as soon as the guy who got punched initiates, he'll be gunned down.

Which I why I am asking about ONE punch, if someone punched you once I do not think it should grant the victim kill rights, if they punch more then 2-3 times then I believe it should be treated as attempted invalid kill and grant the victim defender rights.

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6 hours ago, Gaden said:

I personally think that punches are all part of RP and should be treated as such.

But punching an armed man isn't very intelligent and should be dealt with accordingly. 

If you were to punch someone IRL a fight would ensue most likely, but if you were to punch an armed individual IRL, it probably wouldnt end well for you. 

But in the end, it's all an opinion.

 I personally think it's a two way street I myself have been punched for a "proper rp" reason and I didn't feel as if I was being initiated on I could of easily returned said punch and even though the individuals allies were there I never felt as if I was getting baited into a situation. I also want to say I was armed when I was punched unless Im actively threatening people I have no reason to open fire on them for punching me so long as they have a "proper reasoning" if someone is just walking up to me to punch my character for the hell of it... yeah I would pull my gun on them and initiate. A single punch does not mean anything especially if it's rp'd well and if people are using it to get all your gear or to just kill you based on your reaction then you should report it as baiting not invalid initiation. If you want to RP a fight then do so, but if you want to rob the guy then just upright and do it rather then waiting for them to have a negative reaction to what you are doing. 

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You can effectively be killed by a single punch even at full health because dayz is dayz I got one tapped by my friend while we were killing a zombie full hour,blood, helmet and ballistic mask I got 1 tapped by the god fist 

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4 hours ago, Elijah Johnson said:

You can effectively be killed by a single punch even at full health because dayz is dayz I got one tapped by my friend while we were killing a zombie full hour,blood, helmet and ballistic mask I got 1 tapped by the god fist 

Yes, but it still should be valid pretty much universally in RP situations. 

I don't think that staff should punish if someone was one hit falcon punched if it wasn't done on purpose for the kill but for RP. 

Which then only leads to people that would claim "I didn't know that would happen" etc. 

I don't know honestly, which is exactly why we leave it up to Ol Rolle'. He might not be able to fly a plane effectively, but he can get the rules right.

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punching someone should not be invalid initiation.

 

But the rules dosent make sense enymore and staff change the verdicts all the time after thier feelings so idk a punch is nothing lmao

 

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Rules have been shit ever since we lost dynamics. Punching rules are dumb as fuck and in my opinion this just becomes someone prioritizing rules over the roleplay. 

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