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ItzThatcher

Reinstate Older White List Application Process

Reinstate Older White List Application Process: Yea or Nay?  

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I am making this shortly after my friends suffered from a rather... taxing experience when it comes to being subjected to, in my opinion, BadRP/No Value For Roleplay or This Community. This I acknowledge. While it was unfortunate, this situation is one of many similar and dissimilar such situations over time since the recent changes. That said, this is not a post in response to the event, but rather a post for consideration into helping sort the cream from the chaff metaphorically speaking.

Now that I have that out of the way, I would like to pitch the idea to the community, that perhaps we should take... an in-depth look into how one actually finds our Community and tries to join and invest themselves in it. Being that, when I joined in the year of 2015 (Yeah I know I am younger than some of the old timers here) the application process was much more... refined in my opinion. I recall, that not only did you have to find that special code we all know, but make a character (A COMPELLING Character) that was reviewed by staff for not only your skills in English, Grammar and RP experience, but also what type of person you were trying to play, and how it might benefit the server as a whole. In fact, I even recall they asked these questions for both your character and yourself as an up and coming member of our fine Community. The process required people to take time, consideration, and effort just to apply. While I get it certainly made things more difficult for someone to even attempt to join, it helped stem the flow of people who come in simply for the sole reason of causing grief and seeking the PVP aspects of Dayz Standalone, not the Roleplay.

I am not saying it was a perfect system. It had its own issues and was changed because of said issues, among other things. What I am saying that that parts of that system, the fact you had 500-1000 WORD COUNT requirements for sections, Questions designed by Staff to test the mind and effort of Applicants and what type of Character they'd likely play during their time here. (Not saying everyone is like that. Or anyone at all, it just gives them a good insight into your creativity at that moment.) I, especially, remember that Staff contacted me about my White List, asking further questions about my Application Character, and what I thought about it, and what I planned to do in the server. What my character planned to do in the server. How they might interact with certain Archetypes or typical backgrounds. Very in-depth questions, that actually required people to take time to make an Application, and showed Staff who wanted to join for the experiences and RP, and who wanted to join for the reasons of Player Vs Player, for Gear and Avoiding RP, and most importantly, significant lack of care for the Rules, Staff, and Community.

So, that said, I would like to present three possible choices for us to consider, and of course, other suggestions/ideas/comments/plans/systems are always welcome. These choices being: 

Nay: Retain the current system and deal with its benefits and consequences.

Yea: Consider reinstating the older system, in order to help increase Quality Applications instead of Quantity of Applications.

Third Option: Consider using elements of the older system, both outlined above and not, while combining it with the newer security measures and processes of our current system.

While I have stated some of my points, above, I have not outlined the argument against it so much, but please understand while I totally get the need to have as many applicants as we can get, we also need to acknowledge that too much with lesser Quality Control/Assurance, besides curt and short questions, and a Steam Vetting Process can cause issues, not only for current standing members but also those who are coming into the community.

We are having people coming in who know about RP, who don't know about RP and want to learn, those who just don't care and are just trying to find a place away from the Public Servers, those who wish to just KoS anyone they see, and many other reasons/backgrounds of people who are applying here. Such people, more so the former than the latter, are integral to our community. They are the people who breathe life into this place, not just the individual member who has been here since 2012 to the current date, but the newer blood flowing in with fresh characters and ideas. These people, these potential characters, these potential friends/allies/acquaintances/and even rivals are what help this community continue on and keep us popular.

Their importance, while currently acknowledged, I personally feel isn't exactly controlled nor inspected as much as it could be, and should be. Right now, our population is steadily rising/retaining itself on the daily (Though that is a given from the fact it is Summer) and as such, we have a mixing pot of various people of various beliefs/ideas/goals. It is impossible to separate the good from the bad, the wanted from the unwanted because of this. But it doesn't mean we shouldn't have a more comprehensive application process, in an attempt to help lower instances of BadRP/NVFL/No Value For RP/No Value For This Community/No Value For Our Rules.

That is all I have to say, and I welcome any and all who wish to pitch their own ideas for Staff and our Community to consider.

Sincerely,

ItzThatcher

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Quality over quantity 

This is a simple +1 from me. We need to have a community that understands the rules and is here for RP rather than PVP and hiding away with gear.

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It is for so long that I wish we had the older whitelist, straight +1 from me! I dont wanna meet people that give me a "No KOS server vibes" insted of RP server and so on...

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Posted (edited)

This is what I was trying to discuss on my thread I posted yesterday before it was unjustly shut down. +1 all the way.

It wasn't about the gear at all. It was about the people involved and how we can weed those individuals out.

Edited by Shikaka

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Posted (edited)

+1

I believe Roland wrote a paragraph but in that paragraph was something along the lines of : " Bad people have always slipped through the whitelist process, it'll happen and continue to do so regardless of difficulty " (Butchered that horrendously).

However, while I agree people will slip through, increasing difficulty of the whitelist process will help filter out bad people, not rid of them completely but at least help with it. When people see little effort is needed, they'll do it and not care whether they're banned or removed otherwise. If the whitelist looks intimidating, most trolls will look the other way and not bother, those who care and wish to be here for the right reasons will put in the effort, thus resulting in hopefully more quality in RP.

Edited by CrescentGent

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1 minute ago, CrescentGent said:

+1

I believe Roland wrote a paragraph but in that paragraph was something along the lines of : " Bad people have always slipped through the whitelist process, it'll happen and continue to do so regardless of difficulty " (Butchered that horrendously).

However, while I agree people will slip through, increasing difficulty of the whitelist process will help filter out bad people, not rid of them completely but at least help with it. When people see little effort is needed, they'll do it and not care whether they're banned or removed otherwise. If the whitelist looks intimidating, most trolls will look the other way and not bother, those who care and wish to be here for the right reasons will put in the effort, thus resulting in hopefully more quality in RP.

+1 All the way. Very well said.

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3 hours ago, MajooRB said:

I dont wanna meet people that give me a "No KOS server vibes" insted of RP server and so on...

+1

8/10 encounters are a group sprinting up to me and saying "hey do you have nails (or insert item here)?", them sitting there in silence as they discuss on discord/TS and me wondering whether or not I'm about to be robbed, before them sprinting away. Don't get me wrong I have had good RP here, but those folks sure seem hard to come by.

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After reading Roland's reply to the first thread that talked about this i'm not sure a new whitelist is actually needed. People will always slip through the cracks and that doesn't matter and shouldn't effect the rest. 

Personally i've yet to met any whitenames not giving good enough RP or not knowing how to speak english or whatever. I think it's an exaggerated problem based on a few instances

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I like quality over quantity, there are a ton of new players and that is cool. I’m on either side as of now and based on the poll so far it seems like most people would like to see this implemented. 

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Don't want this to come across as throwing shade, but @Roland, the closing of the last thread I semi-understand due to circumstances, but this is an issue that a lot feel is getting outa hand to an extent mate. 

If there is a legit reason for wanting "quantity over quality" (a phrase donned by people in this thread, not me) then I am sure we would all like to hear it. But if there is no reason to keep the whitelist as is, I personally would love to see the old format reinstated. 


And yes, I know it would be taxing on staff, but I suggest a separate staff role purely for accepting applications, and I personally wouldn't mind help filling that role if it meant a better community (hell I barely get time to play anyway, might aswell make my walls of text be something useful in the form of marking applications 😉 ) 

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I joined during the current whitelist, it was daunting going from an MMO to filling out the application and assessing how I was going to work within the rules. Bit intimidating, but ultimately not as bad as I thought. That said, I didn't really have to register the rules all too much to memory to complete the application. I simply did because I am me. It's increasingly evident that newer players aren't understanding the rules or are interpreting them to fit their own agendas at times. Would like to see something done to curve the rule ignorance being presented in reports. 

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I want the whitelist from 2016 to be reintroduced if I'm honest, or at least a more difficult version of the current one. I don't mind the extra work, personally.

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i would be nice with a bit harder whitelist

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Posted (edited)

I'd like to see a new whitelist introduced that is inbetween the current whitelist and the 2015-17 one.

Edited by Saunders

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Posted (edited)

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Just to echo something I've said in a different thread:

The people plaguing the report section with the most basic of rulebreaks will be vetted out by an increase in whitelist difficulty.  They'll either be scared off my the difficulty of it, or fail miserably at it because it'll be obvious they haven't read the rules.  However, new people that actually want to roleplay and become functioning members of the community will be able to pass it all the same, just with a little more effort.

And, at the risk of sounding like a roleplay elitist, good, they should have to put the effort in.  We all should, lest we run the risk of the quality of roleplay in the community declining even further.  Quality over quantity.

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15 hours ago, Voodoo said:

Quality over quantity 

This is a simple +1 from me. We need to have a community that understands the rules and is here for RP rather than PVP and hiding away with gear.

Thanks for the support Voodoo, its good to know that you agree with this.

15 hours ago, MajooRB said:

It is for so long that I wish we had the older whitelist, straight +1 from me! I dont wanna meet people that give me a "No KOS server vibes" insted of RP server and so on...

You as well MajooRB. Both you and Voodoo are longstanding members here. I think not only newer people opinions matter, but also those who have been here and seen the multiple edits of White Lists.

13 hours ago, Shikaka said:

This is what I was trying to discuss on my thread I posted yesterday before it was unjustly shut down. +1 all the way.

It wasn't about the gear at all. It was about the people involved and how we can weed those individuals out.

Thanks, bud!

13 hours ago, CrescentGent said:

+1

I believe Roland wrote a paragraph but in that paragraph was something along the lines of : " Bad people have always slipped through the whitelist process, it'll happen and continue to do so regardless of difficulty " (Butchered that horrendously).

However, while I agree people will slip through, increasing difficulty of the whitelist process will help filter out bad people, not rid of them completely but at least help with it. When people see little effort is needed, they'll do it and not care whether they're banned or removed otherwise. If the whitelist looks intimidating, most trolls will look the other way and not bother, those who care and wish to be here for the right reasons will put in the effort, thus resulting in hopefully more quality in RP.

Yes! I totally am with you on this Crescent Gent. I am not saying that we need to build something to prevent the leaks. That is impossible. Quoting myself above "It is impossible to separate the good from the bad, the wanted from the unwanted because of this. But it doesn't mean we shouldn't have a more comprehensive application process, in an attempt to help lower instances of BadRP/NVFL/No Value For RP/No Value For This Community/No Value For Our Rules." But, we should increase the difficulty in order to help separate those who wish to put effort and time into Roleplay, from those here to find a place to play Dayz Standalone.

12 hours ago, sandbag said:

+1

8/10 encounters are a group sprinting up to me and saying "hey do you have nails (or insert item here)?", them sitting there in silence as they discuss on discord/TS and me wondering whether or not I'm about to be robbed, before them sprinting away. Don't get me wrong I have had good RP here, but those folks sure seem hard to come by.

Sandbag, I totally get you there. Even I and my friends are equally guilty of such instances. I would hazard to guess that is the case for some on this server. Those are usually during times of Server Resets, or Character Resets. But thanks to Roland, we won't have such issues these days. So it would be good to see a decrease in this, and the newer Metagaming Rule added will certainly help toward that.

12 hours ago, NozzyRP said:

After reading Roland's reply to the first thread that talked about this i'm not sure a new whitelist is actually needed. People will always slip through the cracks and that doesn't matter and shouldn't effect the rest. 

Personally i've yet to met any whitenames not giving good enough RP or not knowing how to speak english or whatever. I think it's an exaggerated problem based on a few instances

It could be NozzyRP. I am not saying it isn't. But what I am saying is that, based upon what Reports are coming in, and what rules are being strained, or disregarded, it could be a possible solution. I've only made this thread to actually get the community talking about ideas and solutions for various aspects of the issue. The White List is just where it all starts. If you have any ideas or suggestions, I would be happy to discuss with you as I am sure others in this thread would too!

9 hours ago, The Traveler said:

Don't want this to come across as throwing shade, but @Roland, the closing of the last thread I semi-understand due to circumstances, but this is an issue that a lot feel is getting outa hand to an extent mate. 

If there is a legit reason for wanting "quantity over quality" (a phrase donned by people in this thread, not me) then I am sure we would all like to hear it. But if there is no reason to keep the whitelist as is, I personally would love to see the old format reinstated. 


And yes, I know it would be taxing on staff, but I suggest a separate staff role purely for accepting applications, and I personally wouldn't mind help filling that role if it meant a better community (hell I barely get time to play anyway, might aswell make my walls of text be something useful in the form of marking applications 😉 ) 

That is a wonderful idea The Traveler! I love that and even I would be willing to volunteer for such a role being made and operated. If it can help take the load off Staff, if an increase in difficulty is implemented, then I think all of us as a Community, not just Staff should participate in such efforts!

6 hours ago, Xehara said:

I joined during the current whitelist, it was daunting going from an MMO to filling out the application and assessing how I was going to work within the rules. Bit intimidating, but ultimately not as bad as I thought. That said, I didn't really have to register the rules all too much to memory to complete the application. I simply did because I am me. It's increasingly evident that newer players aren't understanding the rules or are interpreting them to fit their own agendas at times. Would like to see something done to curve the rule ignorance being presented in reports. 

Glad that you feel that way Xehara. I'm glad to see both older and newer former White List Applicants feel that it could be done, or at least looked at. Your opinion, in my opinion, should matter the most like yourself and the other GMs are the ones who deal with the fallout of those who misunderstand or disregard our rules honestly.

4 hours ago, GreyRP said:

So sorry GreyRP! Didn't mean to step over the bounds of a thread. I did a quick search and didn't see anything too recent for it, so I made the thread. Glad to see that other threads and people feel that similar action should be taken. Thanks for your support!

4 hours ago, Peril said:

Just to echo something I've said in a different thread:

The people plaguing the report section with the most basic of rulebreaks will be vetted out by an increase in whitelist difficulty.  They'll either be scared off my the difficulty of it, or fail miserably at it because it'll be obvious they haven't read the rules.  However, new people that actually want to roleplay and become functioning members of the community will be able to pass it all the same, just with a little more effort.

And, at the risk of sounding like a roleplay elitist, good, they should have to put the effort in.  We all should, lest we run the risk of the quality of roleplay in the community declining even further.  Quality over quantity.

Indeed Peril, Quality over quantity. We need a system that shows us those who want to make quality RP and experiences for themselves, and our Community.

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Posted (edited)

I’m a bit confused here. I joined the server last week and had lots of questions about myself, a character I want to play, the secret phrase etc. I had to write 1000 characters for each section ( I actually wrote 2000 for my character but talking about myself was quite hard!)

im not sure how things were before but I found the application time consuming and only something someone who really wanted to role play would continue with. It was way more involved than any griefer would be bothered with. In that sense I think it does it’s job

as a newcomer ( but I’ve been rp’ing since 1980), I do find the voice stuff a little weird at first but I’ll get used to it with each encounter. 

All I would finish with is that one persons roleplay may not be the same ideal as another but I would expect the more experienced to plug the gap and show how to do it by leading by example, rather than trying to build the walls up higher

Edited by andysuter

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Posted (edited)

I feel terrible for the parts of the staff team that have to solve reports. So much unecessary shit, and if people really started reporting things like FailRP and BadRP, the report section would be the most active of the entire website lmao.

A new whitelisting process should definitely be introduced. I remember being accepted for the server and the whitelisting process was actually a challenge. When I was answering the questions my palms were sweaty, I was anxious to see if I would be accepted or not, and in parts I legit had to fucking study.

Now, I could hand my 8 year old brother my mouse and keyboard and he would pass like it's fucking fortnite. 

A new whitelisting process, I don't care what anyone says, would DEFINITELY increase the RP experience and make for some better interactions. It's what, the server, needs.

 

And in my opinion, maybe everyone should have to go through the new whitelisting process, if it is introduced.

Edited by GreyRP

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8 minutes ago, andysuter said:

I’m a bit confused here. I joined the server last week and had lots of questions about myself, a character I want to play, the secret phrase etc. I had to write 1000 characters for each section ( I actually wrote 2000 for my character but talking about myself was quite hard!)

im not sure how things were before but I found the application time consuming and only something someone who really wanted to role play would continue with. It was way more involved than any griefer would be bothered with. In that sense I think it does it’s job

as a newcomer ( but I’ve been rp’ing since 1980), I do find the voice stuff a little weird at first but I’ll get used to it with each encounter. 

All I would finish with is that one persons roleplay may not be the same ideal as another but I would expect the more experienced to plug the gap and show how to do it by leading by example, rather than trying to build the walls up higher

The issue being brought up is that the whitelist turned into a tick boxes application. In the past the questions were a simple: 

- Explain NLR in ... characters

- Explain and give examples of how you would gain attack rights and defence rights in ... characters

What many want is a harder whitelist in which new members have to actually write what they think is each rule with an example and for it to be properly checked rather than a tick box scheme. 

Experienced players can help but with the huge influx of new players we cant do much more to help. 

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1 minute ago, Voodoo said:

The issue being brought up is that the whitelist turned into a tick boxes application. In the past the questions were a simple: 

- Explain NLR in ... characters

- Explain and give examples of how you would gain attack rights and defence rights in ... characters

What many want is a harder whitelist in which new members have to actually write what they think is each rule with an example and for it to be properly checked rather than a tick box scheme. 

Experienced players can help but with the huge influx of new players we cant do much more to help. 

Ah ok, yes mine was multiple choice but I guess that streamlines things for the staff who I assume would rather be playing themselves than reading pages of applications. There’s got to be a balance for these guys. 

The character questions were quite involved. I wasn’t expecting to write so much but it did do the job of sending me away to think about more. I had to read the lore and see how the story in my head would fit. 

I know the system is easier now from what you’ve said but just stepping into staff shoes, I sure as hell wouldn’t want to read through 300 applications a week ( as quoted before), so anything to streamline things while balancing the control of griefers gets my vote. 

Saying that, I read through the lore but never picked up that certain bases were hazmat only areas, so things can slip through 

 

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2 hours ago, andysuter said:

I know the system is easier now from what you’ve said but just stepping into staff shoes, I sure as hell wouldn’t want to read through 300 applications a week ( as quoted before), so anything to streamline things while balancing the control of griefers gets my vote. 

Well as I stepped into staff shoes on 2 occasions the whitelist was a lot better when you had 300 apps of tough whitelists and 5 admins to sort through them. It meant an abundance of quality roleplayers rather than a quantity of players that will not understand the rules 100% or just here to seek a safe zone with rules.

Not saying all new members are terrible or just here to play the game in their own bubble as I have witnessed some great new players in the last 2 months that ive become good friends with but on the odd occasion you do meet some newer members that appear they are not here for the RP at all and as @GreyRP said above if it was flagged up a lot more staff would have a greater number of reports to look into. 

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i agree with this completely although i have only played for 8 months i have noticed a substantial amount more of badRP and people forgetting the time the server is set in. for example people started singing lil nas x old town road a song that came out earlier this year when they saw a cowboy hat. i have also noticed more people that sound under the age bracket to join the server. so i think a rework or more care when a person is accepted should definitely  happen. 

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MOSHI MOSHI OHAYOOOO!

Anyway, I have spoken up about this already a few times. I have even looked into the whitelist a bit and seeing as I have been an ex admin. I know a lot about the WL process.

Honestly I rather go back to what it was when i was an admin.

Going through the appeals i have noticed a lack of new players putting up appeals for rejected WL. Going back more I find it upsetting that there is no longer a cap on how many times you can try. 

Meaning I can just keep guessing until I get the right answers.

The character backstory isn't hard. Especially if admins aren't catching things, and looking for copy pasted. Which again, I see a lack of appeals for.

I don't think we need a full written one, I think I middle ground. A handful of multiple choice and like one or two easily written ones. That either take a sentence or less, put a cap on characters.

I even mentioned I would come back to staff, if the whitelist was revamped. Meaning I would take the time to help hash out a new one.

Because frankly I don't want to set the quality of rp drop more.

Sure the reports aren't at two pages, but what do you expect when new players run into well new players. They see what they do and think it's ok. They don't report it and thus it becomes normal. Like people taking OOC IN VOIP!

Obviously easy rules, and they get broken.

I am not an elitist, I am for teaching new players but with the influx of new players. They are going to learn from the wrong people. 

I say at least go back to giving people only 3 tries. 

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