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Spicey

S1 - Possible lack of initiation and crash abuse

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Server and location: S1 - I'd prefer to keep the location secret

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): June 3rd my time (23:## PDT) and I think June 4th server time (06:## or 07:##, 24 hour time is hard)

Your in game name: Micheal Delaney

Names of allies involved: I'm bad with names, and alot of players were around at the time. I'll be able to give better info when logs are posted

Name of suspect/s: Kirby Hammer, the rest are unknown

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): what I'm reporting is after our vehicles are being stolen, but 2 vehicles (a ADA and a Gunter) were involved prior to this

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): 

First video evidence of initiation: 

second video evidence, and the reason for the report: 

 

Detailed description of the events: 

Me and a member of my group were down in elektro getting nails when the server crashed. We logged in, and shortly after our two group members at base logged in with bugged out "noodle arms", where they cant shoot, talk in voice and their arms are limp and noodly. 3 strangers wander into our base, realize its basically undefended and take advantage of our two teammates bugged states to steal a car and possibly other things.

Because of this, we booked it to our Olga and raced home. On our way home the radiator leaked enough that we had to stop and refill it, so by the time we got there the only person there was @Kirby-KP, who we chatted with asking about the car thieves. Some time passes, more of us log on or return to base and we get the noodle arm bugs fixed with reloging, and some of us along with some allies from the stary group go hunting for these car thieves. Suddenly someone is spotted in the town our base is in and I grab a rifle and head to the watch tower, where the first video evidence takes place. In this video, I'm led to believe that Kirby is with the car thieves (only in rewatching though, at the time I was clueless) because he conveniently opens the gate to allow the car thief to attempt to leave with our second car (the ADA). I take this as initiation and, not wanting to lose another car to these thieves, dome the fucker before he makes it very far. Kirby runs off, never to be seen again as far as I'm aware and we go hunting for the other thieves since one was just spotted on the PD (though I think he logged out, hopped on S2, fled the PD and hopped on S1, because we had the lower doors of the PD locked and no one saw him leave) and someone was on the hill sniping at us (after I shot the car thief).

This is where the report begins. A large chunk of time transpires between me killing the car thief and me dying, so I'd like to know if they still had attackers rights or if they shot me with no initiation. I'd like to also comment on their taking advantage of a crash and bugged relogs when they were told in //chat that the characters were bugged.

 

If I'm lacking any info here I'd be happy to fix it, just tell me

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3 hours ago, Spicey said:

Server and location: S1 - I'd prefer to keep the location secret

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): June 3rd my time (23:## PDT) and I think June 4th server time (06:## or 07:##, 24 hour time is hard)

Your in game name: Micheal Delaney

Names of allies involved: I'm bad with names, and alot of players were around at the time. I'll be able to give better info when logs are posted

Name of suspect/s: Kirby Hammer, the rest are unknown

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): what I'm reporting is after our vehicles are being stolen, but 2 vehicles (a ADA and a Gunter) were involved prior to this

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): 

First video evidence of initiation: 

second video evidence, and the reason for the report: 

 

Detailed description of the events: 

Me and a member of my group were down in elektro getting nails when the server crashed. We logged in, and shortly after our two group members at base logged in with bugged out "noodle arms", where they cant shoot, talk in voice and their arms are limp and noodly. 3 strangers wander into our base, realize its basically undefended and take advantage of our two teammates bugged states to steal a car and possibly other things.

Because of this, we booked it to our Olga and raced home. On our way home the radiator leaked enough that we had to stop and refill it, so by the time we got there the only person there was @Kirby-KP, who we chatted with asking about the car thieves. Some time passes, more of us log on or return to base and we get the noodle arm bugs fixed with reloging, and some of us along with some allies from the stary group go hunting for these car thieves. Suddenly someone is spotted in the town our base is in and I grab a rifle and head to the watch tower, where the first video evidence takes place. In this video, I'm led to believe that Kirby is with the car thieves (only in rewatching though, at the time I was clueless) because he conveniently opens the gate to allow the car thief to attempt to leave with our second car (the ADA). I take this as initiation and, not wanting to lose another car to these thieves, dome the fucker before he makes it very far. Kirby runs off, never to be seen again as far as I'm aware and we go hunting for the other thieves since one was just spotted on the PD (though I think he logged out, hopped on S2, fled the PD and hopped on S1, because we had the lower doors of the PD locked and no one saw him leave) and someone was on the hill sniping at us (after I shot the car thief).

This is where the report begins. A large chunk of time transpires between me killing the car thief and me dying, so I'd like to know if they still had attackers rights or if they shot me with no initiation. I'd like to also comment on their taking advantage of a crash and bugged relogs when they were told in //chat that the characters were bugged.

 

If I'm lacking any info here I'd be happy to fix it, just tell me

Hi! Spicy car thief here. Not really sure why you reported this, in your own video you outright KOS'd me for driving a (second) car away. There was 0 initiation and you even say in your own video you explicitly shot me for "stealing the car again". I didn't care because its just gear and it was funny as hell, but, bro, that's kos. Idk what you're talking about with lack of initiation or crash abuse? You still had 8 people on roughly to our 5/6. Also the guy on the PD didn't log off, he's actually a professional free runner and jumped off onto a picnic umbrella and over the fence like a champ. 

Agent Bryan Ashworth's POV: I roll up to Gorka with the boys to provide overwatch for my man kirby. Kirby got wind that the people in this compound put a bounty on his head from a situation where he broke in and was rdm'd (covered in another report) Kirby tries to talk it out, we're the muscle, stuff gets boring and I convince papa to come boost me over the wall because they just have cars sitting right out in the open. I leap the wall and loot a tent for a car battery and spark plug and cruise out of the gate without a hitch, which I had @twig open for me (love you eli). I later come back after stashing the car and post up again. My ADHD kicks in for a second time and I leap back in and steal another car and get jfk'd driving down the road. ~That's all folks~ 

Allies: @Kirby-KP @PapaMeme @i am Bambi @twig @Nvllsekt

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My issue comes from the first car jacking which happened before @Kirby-KP ever tried to talk to us. He only showed up after you'd left with the Gunter. The issue is that the base had 2 people there, but both of them loaded in with menu glitches and noodle arms, told you of those noodle arms and you still stole the car, with 0 RP mind you. 

 

And the JFKing of you wasnt KoS, you'd stolen a car already and were actively driving away with our second car which is initiation on your part, to which I acted on my defender rights to kill you.

19 minutes ago, Sxcomba said:

Hi! Spicy car thief here. Not really sure why you reported this, in your own video you outright KOS'd me for driving a (second) car away. There was 0 initiation and you even say in your own video you explicitly shot me for "stealing the car again". I didn't care because its just gear and it was funny as hell, but, bro, that's kos. Idk what you're talking about with lack of initiation or crash abuse? You still had 8 people on roughly to our 5/6. Also the guy on the PD didn't log off, he's actually a professional free runner and jumped off onto a picnic umbrella and over the fence like a champ. 

Agent Bryan Ashworth's POV: I roll up to Gorka with the boys to provide overwatch for my man kirby. Kirby got wind that the people in this compound put a bounty on his head from a situation where he broke in and was rdm'd (covered in another report) Kirby tries to talk it out, we're the muscle, stuff gets boring and I convince papa to come boost me over the wall because they just have cars sitting right out in the open. I leap the wall and loot a tent for a car battery and spark plug and cruise out of the gate without a hitch, which I had @twig open for me (love you eli). I later come back after stashing the car and post up again. My ADHD kicks in for a second time and I leap back in and steal another car and get jfk'd driving down the road. ~That's all folks~ 

Allies: @Kirby-KP @PapaMeme @i am Bambi @twig @Nvllsekt

 

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Just now, Spicey said:

My issue comes from the first car jacking which happened before @Kirby-KP ever tried to talk to us. He only showed up after you'd left with the Gunter. The issue is that the base had 2 people there, but both of them loaded in with menu glitches and noodle arms, told you of those noodle arms and you still stole the car, with 0 RP mind you. 

 

And the JFKing of you wasnt KoS, you'd stolen a car already and were actively driving away with our second car which is initiation on your part, to which I acted on my defender rights to kill you.

 

Bro, go re-read the rules my guy... An initiation is me saying a demand and a consequence, I did neither. I was no where near text range and didn't know about the chicken arms, I'm sure they can look at my positioning at the time of whatever chat log mark that was. Either way, can't just murder me for stealing a car, it's already been ruled on quite recently here:

 A lot of people from your group are just outright shooting people for being in your tents or even within the walls without any initiation. I don't care that you KOS'd me, I just want you to know it's not allowed and have a better understanding of the rules.

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Actually, that ruling is because the guy "didnt know" the car was someone else's. You knew who owned the car, and even taunted verbally as you drove by, which is enough for me to shoot you. I would have told you to stop, but you drove out of our base so fast the only thing I could do was dome you. Now, this back and forth isnt going anywhere so I'll let the moderators decide.

 

On a side note, for the incident you're referring to about getting shot at while in our tents; you were in our base, specifically inside the most important and heavily guarded portion, with weapons out actively stealing from us. My base mate was fearing for his life and the life of anyone who might log on in a tent. "4.2 When your life is at risk or you are subjected to a hostile action by other players you are allowed to defend yourself."

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John Caboose here, (guy killed outside of PD) I was overwatch for kirby while he was talking to the people that might have put a bounty on his head. While we were wait for kirby I went to talk to them at the front gate, I talked to them for a bit and they told me to leave, as I was told to leave sxcomba told me over the radio to open the gate and get out of the way so I did as he wanted without asking questions. I opened the gate and walked away and as I did a car come flying out there front gate. After I walked away I went and set up on a hill close to the pd. Kirby came to the gate and rped with them about the bounty while sxcomba stashed the car and got back in there base to steal another car. Sxcomba was driving out of there base with the second car they shot him outside of there base with no initiation as seen in the ops video. Killing sxcomba gave us defensive rights and shots were taken at them. Later I came back by and was spotted outside the PD someone came up to me and did initiate on me and one of my guys shot him for that, then I was then shot from there base.

As for the rule breaks there was no hostile actions taken against you before you shot sxcomba so you had no defensive rights you also did not initiate on sxcomba which makes your kill on him and invalid kill. You also can be heard talking in your video after you died which is metagaming.

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Posted (edited)

First of all, saying I died to the guy who just watched me die isn't metagaming. Second, Sxcomba taunting as he drove away is initiation, validating my kill. I remembered what you looked like from spotting you on the PD earlier and, having taken shots immediately after killing the car thief attempted to get you into the open so we could talk, leading to my death, and subsequently yours.

 

And, if my kill really was invalid; "Kill rights gained from any rule breaks (including but not limited to baiting, invalid initiation) are considered invalid and their use will be punished in the same way as if they were not obtained at all."

Edited by Spicey

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It is a lot of work for the GM's but if you would like them to pull position logs they can I was not on top of the PD that was @Nvllsekt on top of the PD. Also The kill on you is valid because you initiated on me at the PD by pointing your gun at me and telling me to get on the ground. It's in your second video. After you died you are not suppose to say anything simulating you death which includes I am dead and shoot him.

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Alright, I'd like to drop the report. My main issue was the taking advantage of a near empty base due to a server crash, while the kill on me was more a clarification than an issue.

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1.''Hostile actions are player interactions where you or your group members lives are threatened by other players, you are forced to do something against your will under threat of violence, someone is stealing from you, etc.'' 

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2. Posted March 10, 2018

 

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''Any time someone steals anything from you when you are around, you can kill them. Stealing is considered a hostile action, just as if someone initiated on you.

So, when someone steals from you on purpose, with the knowledge that the item is someone else and the owner is around, you can kill. You can also initiate etc if you want to RP of course  

However it doesn't work when there can be doubt that the person stealing is not doing it on purpose. For example if you are away from your tents, nobody is around and someone stumbles upon them and takes something and you kill them from 200m with a sniper because "they are stealing from you". Then you can only initiate, or just ask the person nicely to put back the things because the tents are yours..''

3. Posted March 12, 2018

 

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 ''If your stuff is getting stolen, you can shoot on sight, no need for initiations  But yeah, once again, magically removing or inserting vehicle parts over distance, just like in the above example is BadRP and abuse of game mechanics.''

 

I'm just gonna leave this here.

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Kill Logs:

05:32:45 | Player "Bryan Ashworth" (DEAD) killed by Player "Micheal Delaney" with Karabiner 98K from 50.4057 meters 
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" (DEAD) killed by Player "Jacob Belfort" with Steyr AUG from 25.8479 meters 
06:18:57 | Player "John Caboose" (DEAD) killed by Player "Jackson Punnete" with M70 Tundra from 110.082 meters 

Hit logs:

05:32:45 | Player "Bryan Ashworth" hit by Player "Micheal Delaney" with Karabiner 98K from 50.4057 meters 
05:32:59 | Player "Bryan Ashworth" hit by Player "Roland Watson" with M14 Springfield from 1.98356 meters 
05:33:02 | Player "Jackson Punnete" hit by Player "Liam Reddington" with M70 Tundra from 110.12 meters 
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" hit by Player "Jacob Belfort" with Steyr AUG from 25.8479 meters 
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" hit by Player "Jacob Belfort" with Steyr AUG from 25.8479 meters 
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" hit by Player "Jacob Belfort" with Steyr AUG from 25.8479 meters 
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" hit by Player "Jacob Belfort" with Steyr AUG from 25.8479 meters 
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" hit by Player "Jacob Belfort" with Steyr AUG from 25.8898 meters 
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" hit by Player "Jacob Belfort" with Steyr AUG from 25.8898 meters
06:18:57 | Player "John Caboose" hit by Player "Jackson Punnete" with M70 Tundra from 110.082 meters 
06:19:04 | Player "John Caboose" hit by Player "Jackson Punnete" with M70 Tundra from 112.513 meters  

Connection Logs:

04:27:18 | Player "Bryan Ashworth" is connected
05:35:51 | Player "Bryan Ashworth" (DEAD) died.

05:14:03 | Player "Jackson Punnete" is connected
06:29:03 | Player "Jackson Punnete" is connected
08:28:55 | Player "Jackson Punnete" has been disconnected

04:36:59 | Player "Jacob Belfort" is connected
06:29:03 | Player "Jacob Belfort" is connected
06:45:39 | Player "Jacob Belfort" has been disconnected

04:27:16 | Player "John Caboose" is connected
06:18:57 | Player "John Caboose" (DEAD) died.

04:26:52 | Player "Liam Reddington" is connected
06:23:20 | Player "Liam Reddington" has been disconnected

04:28:40 | Player "Micheal Delaney" is connected
06:18:54 | Player "Micheal Delaney" (DEAD) died.

05:16:58 | Player "Roland Watson" is connected
06:28:39 | Player "Roland Watson" is connected
07:41:53 | Player "Roland Watson" has been disconnected

Calling in:

@Spicey - Micheal Delaney | POSTED
@Sxcomba - Bryan Ashworth | POSTED
@PapaMeme - Jacob Belfort | POSTED
@RolandTheAccuser - Roland Watson | POSTED
@GoatFyourself - Jackson Punnete | 
@twig - John Caboose | POSTED
@i am Bambi - Liam Reddington | POSTED

For their full and detailed PoV, names of present allies, and any video evidence they may have. Please refrain from any further back and forth and only post if asked to by a staff member, or if you are bringing in new evidence. Please also refrain from posting unless you were directly involved in this situation. 

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My account of the situation was shorty after the server crashed me and my "blue" were plagued with the broken arms bug which prevents any world interaction outside of voip, so unable to close the gate "blue" kept RP'ing while I re-logged so that we can gain control of the situation. perwhich the name assailent stole not 1 but 2 cars in a situation that they knew OOC that we could not interact and taunting as he did it. As he stole the second car spicy now able to interact with the world shot and killed him prevent another stolen vehicle. I Witnessed this first hand in game and over discord. @ me if any other statement is needed.

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POV - I was there as an overwatch to assist and i helped him get over the wall by boosting him twice both times including theft of a car the second time we were escaping with a car when they killed our guy so I backed off to get in a safe spot because i assumed we were at war now. I went back to the town later to investigate then I noticed my friend getting initiated on thats when I popped out from behind the wall I was behind and one tapped @Spicey to get my friend to safety then they killed him @twig . While he was trying to comply.

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@PapaMeme were you RPing with @twig prior to the encounter, and do you have any video evidence?

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@Xehara Yes, we had been RPing for hours prior to this encounter, and sorry but I do not have video evidence of this event.

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POV - Was called in for overwatch to check on a good friend who had a bounty put on his head by people living in Gorka.  Was there for safety purposes if something went south and had their backs if needed.  One of the boys jumped in from the back of the compound and drove out with a car then went back again since nothing was done about it and once he was shot dead I took one shot at the man who shot him when driving out.  After the shot went off I saw people start to run towards my position so I booked it.  Circled round after no one saw where I went, to check on the situation and be there if it went south again, blending in as a civilian.

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Posted (edited)

I'd like to point out that none of our group put a bounty on @Kirby-KP prior to this incident, whoever told you that was either lying or mistook us for the Time.

I'd also like to add that something was done about it; we reported 3 descriptions of the car thieves to our allies in stary and a team was sent over to assist, visible near the police station immediately following my shooting of the car thief. I'm actually quite curious as to why your group would steal cars from people while also trying to resolve a supposed bounty allegedly set by said people.

Edited by Spicey

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@Spicey just to be clear, you mentioned above you wanted to drop the report and then proceeded to add on to the evidence. Do you still want this dropped or do you want the report to continue to a verdict?

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4 minutes ago, Xehara said:

@Spicey just to be clear, you mentioned above you wanted to drop the report and then proceeded to add on to the evidence. Do you still want this dropped or do you want the report to continue to a verdict?

I want to drop the report. They were trying to turn this on me with threats in discord about how I was gonna get banned because my "kill was invalid", so I threw up evidence to revoke that claim. 

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Staff has reviewed this report, and while we are okay closing it we do need to stress a few things.

While the posts from @Roland regarding base raiding and defense is still his stance, this is a more current reference of the guidelines we are currently following:

Furthermore, it is clear on both sides that there is a misunderstanding of our rule set. Because none of you are in an approved group, there is no such thing as taking "Sniper point". You must all drop separate initiations on your targets, ensuring the initiation is all encompassing to those in your vicinity or individually on each person present. You are a dynamic, so please familiarize yourself with dynamic rights. 

It is also vastly important that you all familiarize yourself with rule 2.3, as if this behavior of the back and forth at the current rate continues, you will be in direct violation of that rule.

With that said, this report is closed.

//closed

Signed: @Zanaan and @Xehara

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