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BreadERP

Flaming and hypersensitivity

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This has been a recurring problem for a while in DayzRP, and I wanted to start a discussion about it. I'm sure we can all agree that it's not okay to flame somebody or call somebody an idiot, but I feel like we've become too sensitive. When you invite a punishment because someone was speaking their mind, it only discourages others to do so. Getting banned for criticizing specific staff members and calling community members out on their bullshit may work in Authoritarian states, but not here. There's a sizable line between flaming somebody and speaking with a reason. Maintaining a 'Nice guy' exterior, by disallowing anybody from saying anything bad about anybody else, only breeds further discontent deeper down. Insulting somebody shouldn't always end with points, it's a human thing. However, if it's extensive and completely blown out of proportion, then sure, it deserves points. But, not every single action needs to be policed. If we had an opportunity to vent our problems without worrying about repercussions, we'd solve a lot of our problems.

I'm only saying this because of a few situations that have been unraveling as of late, and I wanted to get some input on it. Are we becoming too sensitive, or is this just normal?

 

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Posted (edited)

+1 A little bit of flame should be allowed but not too excessive. Getting 15 points for flaming I find ridiculous for 3 posts. I believe if the community is going to stay the way it is regarding flaming, I suggest not giving points for the first offence(s) and just giving moderated action/posts (needs moderator + approval on being able to post).

Edited by NikoteenRP

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Honestly? I can't comment on situations that you noticed because I don't know anything about them. My opinion would be worthless. I think that a right to your own opinion, even if that opinion is targeted towards somebody, is something that every one of us should be entitled too. I disagree with you, OP, on a stance that line between flaming and genuine opinion is sizeable. I think its thin. It all comes down to interpretation. Sadly, one group of people might read your post (not this one) and consider it a well thought argument with valid points and intention to better something for the future. Another group might see it as you being salty. It's just how the world works. How it always worked. It's just more... I don't know, visible? Everything and everyone is connected now. Its easy to notice certain behaviours on daily basis now. 

All in all, I think everyone has the right to their opinion. Sadly the line between flaming and honest opinion is thin. Why do I think that? From my own knowledge, flaming is an interaction with others that involves insults and intention to call someone names just for the sake of it. I say it thin because it all depends on interpretion. You say something, you don't consider it an insult. Someone else might have different view on that matter. 

I'll say this, which I think I said in convo with someone else here, to finish up my rant - communication is a key. It's more than important especially in our community. 

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I don't think I've ever seen anyone actually take points for coming off genuinely respectfully, while openly showing criticism at the same time.

but then again i've never really seen the latter so dont crucify me

inactivenate for a reason

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Posted (edited)

Meh.  I think staff do a decent job staying out of a lot of conversations.  Sometimes shit gets heated and they give it a cool off. Other times it's too heated and people get points.

Maybe people are too sensitive at times, and that sucks.  But it just comes with the territory.

I'm not sure what you are suggesting we do differently as a community with this thread?  What do you want to see change?

Edited by MR Pussywhipped

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You can articulate things in a way that allows it to be critical of someone without being a complete dick about it.  Obviously, this situation breeds from something I don't completely understand because I don't know the intricate details of what exactly happened earlier in the day, but I know plenty of people that have worded things in certain ways, myself included, that have gotten the point across without having to cross that boundary of flame.  I also personally feel it's not so much about whether people are too sensitive or not, but more about just not wanting shit-spewing in the community in general.  I see no issue with that.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, BreadERP said:

I'm sure we can all agree that it's not okay to flame somebody or call somebody an idiot, but I feel like we've become too sensitive.

Now while you may have had specific scenarios (here) in mind when posting this thread, I want to, for a moment, break-away from this forum here. With this post and content I mean. And away from staff punishments, too. So basically point to something more general.

Now I do agree, often the issue is the tone, not so much what you say. Feedback to something, for example, can be done constructively or not. While saying "You're a complete fucking moron" to someone as you complain about something that happened and that the person did is actually (negative) feedback, too, it is not constructive and an attack on a personal or emotional level.

Yet and to get to the core message of this post, I think that people on average might have become more (or too) sensitive compared to prior generations. I made the observations elsewhere and if it is indeed true on an abstract or average level, then why should this community be different? Could be (bad?) parenting, different way of how society works and influences people, entertainment focus on society, or simply more stress. Dunno, could be many reasons. Obviously that doesn't mean everyone is affected, but more people will be affected by this compared to prior generations, I mean.

 

Long story short, think on how you articulate feedback if you genuinely want things to change, but at the same time if you get criticized within the tolerable levels and rules, consider whether you should actually feel offended or escalate it. Sometimes a thick(er) skin is all you need, and sometimes you need to tone down your .... tone when you want to get something across to someone else.

 

Obviously since it's a general debate and not referring to a specific situation I can only really keep it basic or general here, but I'm sure if people are aware of this, less shit or issues will arise. Goes for both sides, the one side complaining or raising awareness on an issue and the side being criticized.

 

I feel, and this goes for myself in other areas of life, that we (to those it may concern) need to man the fuck up at times and move on from things instead of throwing a sissy fit, and that if we want to point out things, we should not expect to be heard or be taken serious if we just throw random insults at the person or group or whatever.

 

Edited by Combine

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The place use to be pretty friendly and banter to an extent was allowed as long as you didn't call someone an idiot, dumbass, fucktard, etc. I think sometimes the ban-hammer is too happy to start swinging.

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, MR Pussywhipped said:

Meh.  I think staff do a decent job staying out of a lot of conversations.  Sometimes shit gets heated and they give it a cool off. Other times it's too heated and people get points.

Maybe people are too sensitive at times, and that sucks.  But it just comes with the territory.

I'm not sure what you are suggesting we do differently as a community with this thread?  What do you want to see change?

Honestly, the thing I’m advocating for is for people to get thicker skin. Whenever someone insults somebody else, there’s an underlying problem that’s not being identified, and just banning the other person silences their opinion, leaving their thoughts to stew in their head, without the opportunity to talk about it. 

Instead of swinging points around, I’d like to see more open discussion, where people talk genuinely about their problems with certain people / groups, because right now, many people have opinions they are afraid of sharing, lest they get warning points for it.

Edited by BreadERP

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Posted (edited)

People need to stop being sensitive little children and learn how not to care. Grow a healthy dose of self confidence and learn how to move on in their life. 

If you start to care about a couple hundred pixels generated by some angry kid on the otherside of the world, you're gonna have a pretty though life...

On the otherside there's nothing wrong with a little banter as long as it stays within the lines of 'politeness' and as long as you don't straight up insult the individual.

 

Edited by Dr Willsky

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- USER WAS WARNED FOR THIS POST -

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The problem isn’t thin skin. The problem is petty people willing to capitalize on staff members that will ban/point over private conversations.

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Posted (edited)

I must say that I have no idea what the recent situations have been as I have not been particularly active on the forums so I'll base what I'm going to say on what I have seen over my time in this community.

This subject has come up in the past and there is always a biased view on this from whatever side of the 'offense line' you fall on. I actually agree with some of what is being said about people being over sensitive (OOC stuffs gets in way sometimes which can cloud judgement), I have always advocated for educating someone over punishing them (for at least the first offence) however: 

The problem I see regularly on the forums and it's something I don't like is people saying stuff like get a thicker skin, stop acting like a child, it's just banter etc. Telling some people to get a thicker skin is like telling some people to grow another arm, it's not as easy as that. Some of the people I work with IRL do not have the ability or confidence to take so called banter very well, I always thought banter was meant to between friends who you knew rather than someone who you have never really talked to before so you cannot have any idea how they will react.

You can easily make your point/give your opinion without the need to use potentially offensive content. Remember it's only 'friendly banter' when all parties involved at least know each other a bit and are comfortable taking it and dishing it out. Again everyone is different and will react differently so people need to respect that, how can you expect someone to react a certain way to what you're saying without really knowing them? If you don't care how you act and who you offend then you should be comfortable with the potential consequences of that because everyone is not the same. Being offended is about personal perspective, you cannot tell someone that they should react in a certain way (it's just banter etc.) and then you yourself become offended by the response you get when you don't really know them.

It's not about maintaining a nice guy exterior either as @BreadERP put it or putting up a false version of yourself but it's about knowing when to use said banter, for example I act differently with people at work (being professional) then I do with my friends because I know the boundaries of the relationship between the two sets of people is different. If I acted the same at work as I did with my friends then I wouldn't be in a job right now and that is not about me being false it's about me being realistic.

It's not really about what you say but it's about how you say it, if I turn round to a friend and say "you're and idiot" then they know I'm more than likely saying it in a jokey way but if I say the same thing to a random person or someone I have never really talked to then I'll more than likely get a different, possibly negative response. Fortunately we live in a world where people will not react in the same way because if we did then it would be a boring place.

tl:dr - Apologies for the wall of text above (I did try to break it up a bit), all I'll say is before you hit that post button re-read what you have written and take a few seconds to think about if you really want to post it, and if you do then all I can say is don't be surprised if the response isn't a good one. You have to ask yourself if you want to place yourself in a potentially provocative situation with what you are saying. People need to stop and think before they act/type and that goes for whatever side of the discussion you fall under, knee jerk reactions don't tend to end well. 

No matter what comes up in this thread or what I have said above will ultimately is not likely make a difference unless people see start to see both sides of the argument but as we know and have seen that's a very difficult thing to accomplish.

 

Edited by Samaritan

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1 hour ago, Bot Elmo said:

The problem isn’t thin skin. The problem is petty people willing to capitalize on staff members that will ban/point over private conversations.

I couldn't agree more. 

4 hours ago, BreadERP said:

Authoritarian states, but not here.

This is an authoritarian community and I'm saying that without judging that as either good or bad. It's just how it is. 

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Posted (edited)

Just don't be a dick and stick to the community rules. Imo, it is not that hard. You can call out bullshit or someone being in the wrong without flaming him.

I agree that it is questionable what is defined flaming by staff in some cases but it mostly has been solved over appeals - if it was discussed. Mods & Co have to work out a feel for it. It always depends on who is part of the discussion. You can only gain experience discussing and working it out.

Some decisions may seem point hungry but as a Mod you are told to moderate the forums , if you have the feeling someone is going too far, it is you fucking job to deal with that post - also if you are alone and no one is there to discuss. If others decide it is not point worthy - that is fine , we got the appeal section for that - but in such a case a Mod did his/her job.

Handling of third party conversations, screenshots, & spontaneous rule 4's are a different topic, imo.

Edited by Ron

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Posted (edited)
9 minutes ago, AndreyQ said:

You gotta uphold the core values of the community somehow. It wouldn't be DayZRP without someone screenshotting a private conversation and sending it to the staff in order to get you banned.

It is a shitty thing to do but nothing is truly private on the internet, so I say tread carefully due to this kind of thing happening before. I would however prefer the chance of the accused party to talk to the person that it is directed at. We all say things in the heat of the moment and having the chance to apologise is surely better than a straight up ban without having that chance to at least explain it. However if it's a repeated action then what do people expect?

Edited by Samaritan

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2 hours ago, Bot Elmo said:

The problem isn’t thin skin. The problem is petty people willing to capitalize on staff members that will ban/point over private conversations.

Yep, used to be a time that members could be respectful and take criticism now it just comes down to running to staff over the smallest of things (or runnng to a staff member that is a friend and guarenteed to enforce punishment).

guess i better stop before this post gets taken to a higher authority 😄

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Posted (edited)

IMO staff shouldn't take action against things said in the heat of the moment outside of the official forums and discord.

I've had multiple people flame me in private chat and separate discords, and although I maybe didn't like some of those guys, and I could've easily gotten them perm'd, I didn't. Do you know why I didn't? 'Cause I'm not a fuckin' child, and I am not bothered an internet person calling me names. 

Edited by Mak

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Some people just get triggered way too quickly, it's an online forum about a video game. If you are getting triggered to the point where you feel like it's necessary to go out of your way and flame/insult someone, take a break lmao. If you are getting heated and call someone a 'swear-word' because you're upset, fine, happens to the best of us. But going out of your way and insulting, bullying and making fun of other people is something middle-schoolers do and is quite literally the most childish thing you can do.

The solution to the problem:

  • Don't be childish.
  • If you are getting triggered, take a break.

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When people get triggered over something said on the internet 

image.png.b8b892486ff25afa7d093d0802a70c49.png

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Posted (edited)

It seems to me that "flaming" is just used as an excuse to get people that you don't like points and get them banned on purpose cause you didn't like something they did. It's more obvious in some cases more than others of course. I just find it very petty that you are willing to permanently remove someone because they did one thing that you didn't like. This becomes even more obvious when people who are not sensitive at all report stuff for "flaming" 

Edited by NozzyRP

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+1 For me here many times has there been situations were people have baited "flaming" out of other people just to get that certain person points, It has become way to sensitive with what can and can't be said, However i do understand there is a huge difference between polite disagreement and flame. But calling someone an idiot in my eyes is in no way deserving of such points nor do i even class it as flame. If you think someone is saying something to aggressive or you don't like what they have said and feel offended just turn your monitor off g its not that deep. Also taking dm's from people to get them banned you are an OP.

nick-young-confused-face-300x256-nqlyaa.jpg

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Mate staff hand out flaming/irrelevant post points so frequently I’m surprised you don’t get pointed for speaking your opinions anymore. 

 

People cant take any form of friction. Me side stepping flame by taking cheeky shit should be allowe, straight up flaming a group of people by name in a status update by calling names and talking shit, now that I understand.

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I mean the discussion here is fine but the people it's directed to aren't going to understand it's about them.

We unfortunately aren't going to cure someone's hyper-sensitvity from a forum post.  Maybe talking things out, having discussions with people who are reacting this way would work (discord can be a teaching tool if used correctly).  But at the end of the day, there are people who are naturally able to brush things off and those who...just...aren't.  People who just aren't at a point in life to let shit go (and maybe never will be?).

So I agree, people can be too damn sensitive, but some people also need to recognize that and not keep digging/posting when they know it's going to get a reaction.

Sometimes being the bigger person and walking away from a conversation where shit can hit the fan will also speak volumes.

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