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MR Pussywhipped

Hostile RP Observations

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I mean, you really took most of my opinions and put it down well on paper. I think a really good idea for the hostile character should be to try and find a goal which hero character might find admirable, but their methods of getting to there are inhumane and evil. That's what makes a good antagonist. 

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6 minutes ago, Kain said:

I mean, you really took most of my opinions and put it down well on paper. I think a really good idea for the hostile character should be to try and find a goal which hero character might find admirable, but their methods of getting to there are inhumane and evil. That's what makes a good antagonist. 

I like that idea a lot.  It just makes sense, rarely are people just evil for the sake of being evil, they have goals that they take villainous paths to get towards.

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Posted (edited)

There's a good checklist for a good villain in novelist writing and I think this can really apply to making characters on here.

  • He’s convinced he’s the good guy
  • He has many likeable qualities
  • He’s a worthy enough opponent to make your hero look good
  • You (and your reader) like when he’s on stage
  • He’s clever and accomplished enough that people must lend him begrudging respect
  • He can’t be a fool or a bumbler
  • He has many of the same characteristics of the hero, but they’re misdirected
  • He should occasionally be kind, and not just for show
  • He can be merciless, even to the innocent
  • He’s persuasive
  • He’ll stop at nothing to get what he wants
  • He’s proud
  • He’s deceitful
  • He’s vengeful

To expand, let's look at one of my favourite villains: Handsome Jack. Firstly, he's convinced he is the good guy. Considering that he will always call the Vault Hunters greedy bandits or whatever, he truly believes that what he is doing is just and right. He wants to rid Pandora of the really horrible nature it's had since its birth. He has many likeable qualities. I always find myself laughing at his quips and I find myself occasionally liking him more because of his attitude and goals. He is worthy enough. Very much, killing him at the end of Borderlands 2 never felt so satisfying after all the loader bots. You like when he is on stage. Who the fuck didn't like it when Handsome Jack even spoke? He's clever and accomplished enough. Yeah, the leader of the Hyperion corporation and taking control of major settlements, I think he's got that checked off. He can't be a fool or a bumbler. He's not even close to that. He has many of the same characteristics of the hero, but they're misdirected. I think this is where Handsome Jack really shines. He, like the Vault Hunters, do have similar ideas about what they want. They both want Pandora to be in peace, one does it in a more diplomatic matter, while the other does it in a malicious matter. He should occasionally be kind, and not just for show. I think this one might be the only one slightly off from Handsome Jack, but his motivation from Borderlands the Pre-Sequel is more than enough reason for his mistrust and unkind nature. He can be merciless, even to the innocent. Yes, he will kill thousands just to get to what he wants, which also clues into him not stopping for anything to get what he wants. He's persuasive. Yeah, I mean really, the vault hunters weren't the greatest people ever and I wouldn't call them heroes. The Vault Hunters were really just greedy bandits and he persuaded me. He's proud. I mean, he's one of the most narcissistic characters ever, so yeah. He's deceitful. Handsome Jack has had quite a few times with tricking the vault hunters by lying, so I'd say this is a check. Finally, he's vengeful. The whole reason why Handsome Jack despises the Vault Hunters is that they betrayed him in the Pre-sequel and can only see them as that. He wants revenge against the vault hunters who destroyed his life. 

So, the moral of the story? Be more like Handsome Jack and less like Robbie Rotten if you want a compelling villain. 

Edited by Kain

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Posted (edited)

Well, this is a difficult discussion because everyone believes what they are doing is right and everyone else is wrong. Also some groups believe that their rp backstory gives them a right to go into each and every initiation treating people like garbage and providing little to no rp. This is then followed by a quick execution, or leaving the person with absolutely nothing.

Now, I will elaborate on stuff you mentioned in a bit but I wanted to mention something specific that is a pet peeve of mine.

I see most people do this, which is when they initiate on someone they tie them up or have them put their bag / equipment on the ground. Then you see two or three guys run over to the bag and stand there quietly. Obviously this is a game and there is no animation of people searching through the bag which would solve this problem. Instead its standing there silently and no roleplay provided whatsoever. This to me pulls me out of the rp, even if I am with the hostile group.

The method of fixing this is to just talk while you look through their stuff. Talking about what you find and acting like you are feeling their pockets. "Whats this a radio? Okay I see some pears in your bag, some nails, some ammo, not much value here."

Some things you have mentioned I greatly agree with and I am learning as of recently to make myself better, is to slow down. If to many people talk at once to a prisoner it makes it very difficult for the prisoner to comply with everyone or understand what is being said. Letting the prisoner speak as well is important, and being respectful of the fact they are a player and need their enjoyment of the rp matters just as much as your own does.

Beyond that, I find a good mentality to initiate on people is ensuring you have an in character reason. Yes there are times we need equipment for our members incase some of them died. So it will be a donation to the cause. But we refuse to make it that simple. We enjoy having a laid out roleplay chat with them about our rp, their rp, and what we can get in the future. In most cases we don't take their stuff at all regardless what equipment they have.

Robberies should be met with good rp into the groups reasoning and not leaving them with nothing. Initiations themselves should be lead and done because of roleplay reasons.

When I roleplay I do what I can to ensure they have a good experience as much as I do myself. I'm here to enjoy my characters story with everyone of this server. To make something of myself and have my name remembered. Being fair is a important thing, that many seem to disregard.

Rping hate against a group is good too. It is great rp and can really build a story and relations. That is unless you enter every conversation not letting them speak and yelling down at them because you have in character reason to hate them. Building a rp hate against another group who did you wrong can be great, just be careful and considerate that they are players too.

Edited by Zipcouda

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I agree especially with the losing part. Everyone should stop throwing so much ego around. Nobody is perfect OOC and they shouldn't be IC, stop trying to be Mr. or Mrs. perfect. Hurt egos from losing turn into OOC hat and toxic behaviors that nobody has time for.

Overall if people started following this and other guides to hostile RP, there would be a serious improvement of interaction. Where people are happy or pleased with the RP the recieve while being robbed or tortured. 

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The only real complaint I have in regards to hostile RP, is the process of moving the hostages from the place of the initiation to a secure location.

I've been forced to sprint without a break for 4 kilometers.

You know how many people can sprint 4 kilometers without a pause to sit down or at least a breathing break? Cause I dont know anyone who can do that personally, I am sure there are some people in better health than myself who are able to, but I think it's a stretch.

In those kind of situations I understand that you want to move the hostage from A to B, but you need to be realistic about it too.

 

And as for the counter argument of "Why dont you just fall to the ground and pretend you are about to pass out if your character is running out of breath?"

The answer to that question is, usually these people are the same people who tell you that if you stop, you will die, and so in order to at least get some RP out of it I rarely choose to drop to the ground, with the current climate of hostile RP (The Majority, not all) I would more than likely be shot for trying to roleplay being short of breath.

 

Anyway that's my two cents, all the points the OP stated were things we followed in Zbor religiously, Hostile RP is a two way street, it needs to be enjoyable for everyone.

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Posted (edited)
8 hours ago, MR Pussywhipped said:

Slow Shit Down

 

There is nothing more immersion breaking than trollish movement.  Stop it.  Just stop.  If you hold someone up, and they comply, you are in power.  You do not need to dodge and weave between your captives for any reason.  I get it... "your character is a psycho!" so make it work with what you say and not by jumping on the shoulders of your pal next to you.  

Robberies should be intense, they should make your heart race.  But if you look like jack rabbit on speed while doing so, you'll ruin the entire thing.

Here's good good example of "what NOT to do", taken from an interaction that happened just yesterday. Seriously. Those PUBG muscle reflexes need to be tamed the fuck down. If you care more about being "PvP ready" than you do about not looking like a squirrel on crack, even after the people around point out your odd behavior multiple times, then I'm sorry but no one's goIng to take your roleplay seriously.

 

Edited by OldSchoolOG

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I have to agree with the previous post above, that guy that is "tap dancing" is quite the annoying characters to bump into. You would think you had just ran into a guy that sniffed multiple lines of coke. In this situation you bring up "drugs" multiple times and its only valid because of his movements @OldSchoolOG. I also agree with everything that is said in the main section of this post, Hostile RP is always a fun and or dangerous line to play in, you couldn't have written your opinions any better! 

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5 hours ago, MR Pussywhipped said:

 

Slow Shit Down

Shut the Fuck Up

Emotes Can Be Your Friend

Don't Be Afraid to Lose

 

This here sometimes happens a lot. You get swarmed and then held up but 9 times out of 10 it will lead to this.

I get a lot of people want to rob you and everything but when you're being told to shut the fuck up on every hostility you get - it gets plain boring. I know this because people get to a point where they say it one too many times for them to sit there. Receive a story of why they were robbed for 2 minutes then to be on their merry way. Or being asked a question by one person and being to told to shut the fuck up by another which can be irritating to all hell.

I have however yet to run into a hostile situation with a detailed emote of torture or robbery. Normally it's just VOIP and taking any items you have or slicing you up with an actual blade. @Malet could perhaps back me on this when I roleplayed Diadora torturing him and how psychotic she was and her reasoning. It helped develop his storyline as Markus Letter so much.

I can say when I did a hostile character I was in a way afraid of losing because I wanted to provide Hostile RP, not hostile robbery. But people get constantly fed up of the same things stated above that they will think their predication on what happens will be. And not have any leading example of different terms of hostile rp such as ones that psychologically fuck you up, emotionally abuse you or physically torture you. But at the end of the day that is how the game works and sometimes PvP aspect should be restrained to see where the situation actually goes.

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Posted (edited)

Didn't Jackfish try posting one of these threads earlier today? Got shut down. Do you think this thread is going to be read or cared about from the people you are directing it to? Fat fucking chance. A lot of people only care about the PvP aspect at this point. They don't care about if their character is good or not. This is all that needs to be said and will let you know everything.

"Thank you for your feedback".

Edited by Zero

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Posted (edited)
31 minutes ago, Zero said:

Didn't Jackfish try posting one of these threads earlier today? Got shut down. Do you think this thread is going to be read or cared about from the people you are directing it to? Fat fucking chance. 

Literally said in the original post that I was probably preaching to the choir, doesn't mean we can't have a coversation about it.  If someone starts reading through it and gets inspiration to try something different, bonus points.  

Edited by MR Pussywhipped

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5 minutes ago, MR Pussywhipped said:

Literally said in the original post that I was probably preaching to the choir, doesn't mean we can't have a coversation about it.  If someone starts reading through it and gets inspiration to try something different, bonus points.  

I'm just saying, the people it's directed towards don't care. That behavior has been displayed numerous times.

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1 hour ago, Zero said:

I'm just saying, the people it's directed towards don't care. That behavior has been displayed numerous times.

There's a huge influx of new members to this community right now. If someone new reads it and takes some of the information to heart, then good.

It's not always about changing the mentality to those stuck in their own ways. 

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I've been having a good time with hostileRP personally, really have no complaints. I will say that when people are hostages they should give the hostage takers a chance before they start getting upset OOCly about losing their gear. 

 

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Posted (edited)
32 minutes ago, ScarRP said:

I've been having a good time with hostileRP personally, really have no complaints. I will say that when people are hostages they should give the hostage takers a chance before they start getting upset OOCly about losing their gear. 

 

For sure, I'm not saying hostile rp is awful here, there just is room to improve in some cases.

Also Agreed, having a bad hostage can ruin things in a dramatic fashion.  Anyone who is that concerned about gear is in the wrong place.  I was thinking if doing a "how to be a good hostage" follow up to this

Edit: see below for some of those tips

Edited by MR Pussywhipped

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7 hours ago, Ducky said:

The only real complaint I have in regards to hostile RP, is the process of moving the hostages from the place of the initiation to a secure location.

I've been forced to sprint without a break for 4 kilometers.

You know how many people can sprint 4 kilometers without a pause to sit down or at least a breathing break? Cause I dont know anyone who can do that personally, I am sure there are some people in better health than myself who are able to, but I think it's a stretch.

In those kind of situations I understand that you want to move the hostage from A to B, but you need to be realistic about it too.

Tbh picky ass hostages are just as bad as unoriginal hostile RPers. If that's all you can complain about out of that situation I'd say you did pretty well for yourself, unless you were taken hostage by some very bad roleplayers, but I doubt that was the case.

From the other side of the fence, as a person who hostile RPs quite regularly at this time, I can say that some hostages could definitely benefit from the following advice:

  • Get out of the "let's get this over with" mindset. Too often have I run across people I considered great RPers while on a hostile character, only for their attitude to my character and RP change from a welcoming one to one that shuts down any further progression. Its like all they want to do is have the situation be over with and then get out to go back to their little bubble where they are in complete control. This is a negative mindset to have as it makes the hostile situation unenjoyable and removes any further motivation for a hostile RPer to come for you again, because why would they waste their time with someone who isn't arsed RPing with them.
  • Build a rapport with your hostage taker. Again, more often than not, I run across people who give flat answers and project a dull persona that makes it difficult to establish chemistry in a situation. The things that make RP enjoyable for both sides is feeling like you're both giving your best, paying attention to the situation, reacting appropriately to emotions from both sides, trying to play off of each other in each other's self-interests. The rapport can be positive, negative, heated or passive, as long as there's a chemistry and flesh to someone's character, chances are you'll be considered a fun and memorable hostage.
  • Realise that everybody has an unique angle they're trying to push. I love my current character. He's fun, I've built so many stories with so many people, such as @Aiko, @Stagsview, @Kordruga and @Lyca to name but a few, but there are also antagonists in his story, such as @ScarletRose and @Kase, people who directly or indirectly oppose what he's trying to do. Their experience, to me at least, is just as important as my own and, if they were to ever have me hostage, it would be in everybody's best interest for my character to stay dead after he was executed. I do have my own angle to push, there's still so much story that I want to accomplish with Comfort, internal RP with the batteries, external conflicts with various big groups and personal storylines that have meaning to me out of character, but its all meaningless if I act in pure self-interest, rather than in the interest of everybody's story.

These are my thoughts on the current state of hostile RP. This is a good thread with useful information, thanks to OP who I can't seem to tag for making it 🙂 

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hm

 

Theres alot of new people around that leads to lower standards. People just gotta work together and help eachother 

Idk theres really no problem right now. What ive seen since I came back hostages are the biggest problem atm. Going ooc, breaking voip, NVFL, badrp and so on.

 

What hostile rp ive seen for the past month have been good 

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The whitelist really needs to prepare new people in someway for hostile rp, whether its them robbing or being robbed. A lot of clips nowadays of silly initiations that people just get blown away instantly or getting captured and not knowing how to rp it out.

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17 minutes ago, Jerry said:

The whitelist really needs to prepare new people in someway for hostile rp, whether its them robbing or being robbed. A lot of clips nowadays of silly initiations that people just get blown away instantly or getting captured and not knowing how to rp it out.

Yes. Some people join this server with the expectation of it being a non KOS server rather than an RP server. 

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Posted (edited)
1 hour ago, YNW Jasper said:

 Yes. Some people join this server with the expectation of it being a non KOS server rather than an RP server. 

Indeed some people do. I constantly see this type of stuff718611670_Schermata2019-04-28alle20_35_23.png.2f825d35b2c920c7ff50e079a86a1f4f.png

Edited by Mak

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14 hours ago, MRS Bradtica said:

There's a huge influx of new members to this community right now. If someone new reads it and takes some of the information to heart, then good.

It's not always about changing the mentality to those stuck in their own ways. 

I am one of the new members that took what he said in the original post to heart because this is how I play. With sympathy for my character. I know from experience for the Military that picking up a weapon and shooting someone with it takes a toll on the human brain. I think if people played for the emotion of the roleplay it would be so much better, because lets face it, a lot of the players here would probably freak out in real life if they either shot someone or robbed them. 

3 hours ago, Dusty said:

hm

 

Theres alot of new people around that leads to lower standards. People just gotta work together and help eachother 

Idk theres really no problem right now. What ive seen since I came back hostages are the biggest problem atm. Going ooc, breaking voip, NVFL, badrp and so on.

 

What hostile rp ive seen for the past month have been good 

Newer people does not mean that there is a lower standard, I have been playing in the "serious" roleplaying scene for a while, you might have bumped into me a couple times who knows. But the point of it, your player interactions are always going to be different, maybe there is a reason why your hostile RP has been more decent than others? 

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Great post! By reading this as a new player It feels like I learn a lot about both sides from everything that you guys write.

I appreciate threads like these. Makes it easier to get into to the server the right way instead of doing bad rp that ruins the fun for others. 

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+1

I like this, says alot and shows what some people, if not most, from what I know, are feeling rn about the state of Hostile RP. All I hear about it people just going around and constantly robbing EVERYONE. I'm not here to say that's not ok, but it's not...encouraged if you're trying to prove something.

All it does is show that you mostly like giving little to no rp, unless you're the 1% who robs constantly but somehow doesn't get killed or gives amazing RP to the hostage.

Gonna end this off with my personal opinion: Please don't flame me for this. I personally hate Hostile RP when it constantly leads to robbing and loss of gear. I used to be attached to my gear when I was a trader and it was the main catalyst of RP for people who ran into me. I traded and gave amazing deals. I then always lost my stuff to bandits who did nothing for the RP and just told me to "Shut up or die." Simply put...People need to learn there's people on the other side of that monitor that they're robbing. They should care about their RP too. When someone goes around in a big ass group, or just a 3 or less group and just constantly robs for gear over and over and over and over and over and over...It starts to get stale and people won't really take you seriously. Try to work out goals. "I want to ingrain fear into the people by constantly taking their shit." Yeah chief that's not it works. People can get annoyed more easily than feared. When you barely give off roleplay to others and just skirt around like a squirrel inhaling butane ( @YNW Jasper Butane Boys ehh?) then you aren't gonna be taken seriously. I think in the whitelist, and in the current populace, there should be like...more guides made that should be used as...well guides. How to properly be a bandit, or bandit-ish. These guides should be constantly changing with time to keep up with the server. Again...Please don't flame me for this.

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17 hours ago, ScarRP said:

I've been having a good time with hostileRP personally, really have no complaints. I will say that when people are hostages they should give the hostage takers a chance before they start getting upset OOCly about losing their gear. 

 

I need my service rifle to RP so if you rob me you are personally ruining my immersion and time on the server. 

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