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Server time: 2019-04-19, 15:23
Colman

Thoughts on the Current State of Base Defense/Raiding?

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As offline raiding continues to be an unavoidable damper on the experience of laying stake to any given area for role play.  

Will this system continue to be 80 seconds per wall with no real struggle in technicality or rarity of raiding tools found? 

What are the current community thoughts of base building, base defense, raiding tools vs. rarity and offline raiding?

I'd love to hear your thoughts! 🤩🤩🤩

We can talk in discord also 😁

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It's five minutes to break down a single panel of a wall. Panel being Upper and Lower. To my knowledge wood and metal break the same, which is the main issue I personally see.

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You only have to break the bottom panels, then you just crawl through and repeat.

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I think the idea, I believe @Roland had, of a designated raid time would be beneficial to stop offline raids.
You can argue "realism" being that you'd be asleep in your base when you're being raided. But overall I think it'd be a step in the right direction.

Overall I definitely think offline raiding needs to be looked over, because it's an incessant issue if you want to have a base, but not have someone online 24/7, because nobody has time for that.

Like you've said it really puts a damper on whatever you're trying to accomplish with the base RP wise. It's all about quality of life and should be improved to benefit the defender/owner.
If you put about a month worth of time into a base, as we have, you shouldn't be punished for hard and diligent work, because someone can break in within 5min. 

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15 minutes ago, Mugin said:

I think the idea, I believe @Roland had, of a designated raid time would be beneficial to stop offline raids.
You can argue "realism" being that you'd be asleep in your base when you're being raided. But overall I think it'd be a step in the right direction.

Overall I definitely think offline raiding needs to be looked over, because it's an incessant issue if you want to have a base, but not have someone online 24/7, because nobody has time for that.

Like you've said it really puts a damper on whatever you're trying to accomplish with the base RP wise. It's all about quality of life and should be improved to benefit the defender/owner.
If you put about a month worth of time into a base, as we have, you shouldn't be punished for hard and diligent work, because someone can break in within 5min. 

My thoughts exactly, the balance of raid time and rarity of items needed to raid is very unbalanced for the amount of work the one defending put in.

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4 hours ago, Mugin said:

I think the idea, I believe @Roland had, of a designated raid time would be beneficial to stop offline raids.
You can argue "realism" being that you'd be asleep in your base when you're being raided. But overall I think it'd be a step in the right direction.

Overall I definitely think offline raiding needs to be looked over, because it's an incessant issue if you want to have a base, but not have someone online 24/7, because nobody has time for that.

Like you've said it really puts a damper on whatever you're trying to accomplish with the base RP wise. It's all about quality of life and should be improved to benefit the defender/owner.
If you put about a month worth of time into a base, as we have, you shouldn't be punished for hard and diligent work, because someone can break in within 5min. 

I concur with this point.

However if this can't be implemented, I would recommend massively, MASSIVELY increasing the destruction time. Maybe to 20-30 minutes/per panel. It would serve to realism (good luck chopping down a fence with a hatchet in under 2 minutes) and it would make the time investment to be taken into consideration when breaking into the base. Do I risk sitting here for 20 minutes, defenseless, with a button clicked just to get into this base? Or do I stalk it out and maybe initiate when the people come in, etc.

Of course, dismantling time should be kept the same.

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Posted (edited)

I don’t personally think any changes need to be made. While basebuilding is cool and adds an extra element to the game, that shouldn’t be your focus in the server. I also think making a specific time when you can raid a base is a bad idea and just adds more OOC restrictions. 

The less magical restrictions, the better. Just gotta understand that if you make a base, someone is going to break in. Also, breaking a panel can be pretty frustrating at the moment; if you look away from the wall, for even a second, it will cancel the progress you’ve made and you have to restart. So I don’t think upping the time needed to dismantle a panel is the right idea either.

Edited by YNW Dusty

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3 minutes ago, YNW Dusty said:

I don’t personally think any changes need to be made. While basebuilding is cool and adds an extra element to the game, that shouldn’t be your focus in the server. I also don’t think making a specific time when you can raid a base is a bad idea and just adds more OOC restrictions. 

The less magical restrictions, the better. Just gotta understand that if you make a base, someone is going to break in. Also, breaking a panel can be pretty frustrating at the moment; if you look away from the wall, for even a second, it will cancel the progress you’ve made and you have to restart. So I don’t think upping the time needed to dismantle a panel is the right idea either.

Fair, but the current system hinders certain characters achievements. I can't remember the amount of player run & protected shops/markets/stores I've been inside of playing a character and loving those experiences. I think it's a pretty sad thought to never see any of that again, I feel it's a common goal of any large active group.

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51 minutes ago, darczon69 said:

I concur with this point.

However if this can't be implemented, I would recommend massively, MASSIVELY increasing the destruction time. Maybe to 20-30 minutes/per panel. It would serve to realism (good luck chopping down a fence with a hatchet in under 2 minutes) and it would make the time investment to be taken into consideration when breaking into the base. Do I risk sitting here for 20 minutes, defenseless, with a button clicked just to get into this base? Or do I stalk it out and maybe initiate when the people come in, etc.

Of course, dismantling time should be kept the same.

Definitely some promising mods we could implement.  

These are some of the ones I think could work as a stand alone or as a combination.

Base Raiding Mods:

Complete Immunity: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1648571306&searchtext=Raiding 

Destruction time is 15 Minutes per base piece: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1705741403&searchtext=Raiding 

New Items and Loot Table for Raid Items: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1707041975&searchtext=Raiding 

Disables All Tool Damage except Sledgehammers to walls: https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1611450782&searchtext=Raiding 

Base Raid can only be Done with C4 Explosives (Mod Includes): https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1560235670&searchtext=Raiding 

400% Increase Raid Time, Use 80% of the Tool.  https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=1602898310 

and many more...

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This server isnt about base building, its about roleplay. and with that said, my roleplay shouldent be interrupted by you not being home right now. 

Griefing is reportable and you should report it if it happened but not every broken wall is a reason to post one. you build a base knowing that it might get raided so dont act like you should get immunity ingame or a rule OOCly to "protect" your base. 

if you want to build undisturbed there PVE servers and private hives you can move unto. 

 

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Posted (edited)

I have no issues with my base being raided. I just want the raider to spent at least a fraction of the time I spent building my base to raid it, not be done in 15 minutes flat.

 

I disagree with base immunity though.

Edited by darczon69

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Posted (edited)
2 hours ago, Pep said:

This server isnt about base building, its about roleplay. and with that said, my roleplay shouldent be interrupted by you not being home right now. 

Griefing is reportable and you should report it if it happened but not every broken wall is a reason to post one. you build a base knowing that it might get raided so dont act like you should get immunity ingame or a rule OOCly to "protect" your base. 

if you want to build undisturbed there PVE servers and private hives you can move unto. 

 

Sounds like you're a little caught up in your own opinion, it's just casual conversation about what could be implemented from just a simple increase of time to raid, to an entirely new raiding system.

2 hours ago, Pep said:

you build a base knowing that it might get raided so dont act like you should get immunity ingame or a rule OOCly to "protect" your base. 

Absolutely! the defense does not forget it's role, without offense would be pointless.  No one is looking for immunity, we only seek a balance of time spent building vs raiding. Does it make much sense to search for hours for all tools and components to build a base and then get raided in 4 minutes?

Edited by Colman

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Posted (edited)

Personally I think it’s cancer that offline base raiding is even a thing. We switch out guard shifts but since we are all Americans I can’t do shit against EU players attacking and raiding my base.

If they know my time zone then they’re free to do whatever the fuck they want without any repercussions. My base has been wiped clean because people know when my group is not online and the shit has pushed me to giving up on the base. The thing about my base is it’s open to travelers, but now it’s just going to be abandoned after we spent an entire month working on it. 

There needs to be a balance of quality of life type modifications and realism. A certain time where base raiding is open would be much better than anything else. 

The issue I see with increasing the break down time of base parts is the base destruction isn’t a “mouse click” and wait. You have to hold that bitch down and even with the current times to break down panels your hand starts to hurt. Now imagine doing that for 30 minutes lmao. 

Also it’s easy for other people to say they don’t want restrictions on raiding because they don’t spend the time or effort actually doing anything related to the subject and if they have it’s usually because they have some other player build for them and aren’t really invested in the whole thing. 

Edited by Zero
I

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5 hours ago, Pep said:

This server isnt about base building, its about roleplay. and with that said, my roleplay shouldent be interrupted by you not being home right now. 

Griefing is reportable and you should report it if it happened but not every broken wall is a reason to post one. you build a base knowing that it might get raided so dont act like you should get immunity ingame or a rule OOCly to "protect" your base. 

if you want to build undisturbed there PVE servers and private hives you can move unto. 

 

But base building benefits roleplay? Building a base in a hotspot (or anywhere at all) could provide a lot more RP than not having a base at all. Just look at the one in Severograd. 

What roleplay is being interrupted by offline raiding not being a thing? Since it's an "offline" raid that means that nobody is logged from that group, meaning there is no RP to begin with. I fail to see how this ruins your roleplay so if you could explain that further i'd be happy. 

Yes people build bases knowing it will be raided but those people stop doing just that after they find out the offline raiding is too much. I don't see the problem with raiding their base if their people are actually on the server but what we're talking about here is offline raiding. There is talk of "immunity" from people's bases getting raided. You can go to someones base and raid it when their group members are on. 

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It takes even less time to saw off a combo lock.  (Which aren't even working properly at the moment  due to the devs messing up, last I checked. They sometimes won't fit into the gate, they reset the numbers on occasion etc.)

I think the end goal should be:

"Balance the needed time to raid vs the needed time to build to be somewhat close to each other, until the game actually introduces raiding tools and more creative ways to break into bases that add roleplay/immersion as well, instead of just using 2 minutes to saw off a combolock or bang a wall like a bongodrum with a sharp object until it breaks for several minutes."


Until that arrives, I suggest just thinking of bases as roleplay dwellings where you store your roleplay gear your character might need / trade, not places to actually store anything important for you in. 

And if someone raids it without following rules or griefs it, report it. Logs should be working now, no?


 

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4 hours ago, Zero said:

Personally I think it’s cancer that offline base raiding is even a thing. We switch out guard shifts but since we are all Americans I can’t do shit against EU players attacking and raiding my base.

If they know my time zone then they’re free to do whatever the fuck they want without any repercussions. My base has been wiped clean because people know when my group is not online and the shit has pushed me to giving up on the base. The thing about my base is it’s open to travelers, but now it’s just going to be abandoned after we spent an entire month working on it. 

There needs to be a balance of quality of life type modifications and realism. A certain time where base raiding is open would be much better than anything else. 

The issue I see with increasing the break down time of base parts is the base destruction isn’t a “mouse click” and wait. You have to hold that bitch down and even with the current times to break down panels your hand starts to hurt. Now imagine doing that for 30 minutes lmao. 

Also it’s easy for other people to say they don’t want restrictions on raiding because they don’t spend the time or effort actually doing anything related to the subject and if they have it’s usually because they have some other player build for them and aren’t really invested in the whole thing. 

The click and hold needs to be changed too in all honesty.

Increase time, but have the damage accumulate over time. If I am removing panels with a crowbar I'm not gonna put them back if I release my mouse button. Makes no sense...

 

I don't think the time needs to be balanced in all fairness. Just more means to prevent offline raids should be prioritized given how broken the base building mechanics are currently.

Combo locks bug

Click and hold (maybe make it a mini game idk lol)

Metal v. Wood destruct time

Others?

 

Edited by Mugin
Mobile..

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7 hours ago, YNW Dusty said:

I don’t personally think any changes need to be made. While basebuilding is cool and adds an extra element to the game, that shouldn’t be your focus in the server. I also don’t think making a specific time when you can raid a base is a bad idea and just adds more OOC restrictions. 

The less magical restrictions, the better. Just gotta understand that if you make a base, someone is going to break in. Also, breaking a panel can be pretty frustrating at the moment; if you look away from the wall, for even a second, it will cancel the progress you’ve made and you have to restart. So I don’t think upping the time needed to dismantle a panel is the right idea either.

^This: 
As long as some scummy shit isn't taking down more than 1 wall piece (E.g: if somone went in to "raid" a base and took down like 4-5 seperate walls whilst there) then there shouldn't be any repercussions. 

Back in the day Bases never used to be a place to store gear, they were there for RP. People need to realise having a  big walled and locked off base with nice shit inside is like getting into the Tiger cage after oiling yourself up in BBQ sauce 0_0 

Edited by The Traveler

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I personally think we need some rules to protect people from offline raiding or something like that sort, Maybe a cooldown but that's hard to keep track off

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I mean if you don't wanna take the risk the best option is to simply not build and just carry what you need?

I mean GenZ have been doing alright we just use barrels we've stashed all over the place and move around a lot. You don't need to start building walls to keep items safe.

 

The server doesn't need a raid time it just needs common sense. If you have a group and you don't cover a 24 hour shift pattern then why did you make a base and then moan that it was raided? If people see walls then they will think there is loot, so either make a base with absolutely nothing inside (meaning its there simply for RP with no benefits of raiding) or just don't build any walls and play dayz like it was a few years back and hide the stuff in locations that no one will likely look or just keep what you need and let the loot tables still respawn stuff for others.

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49 minutes ago, Samti said:

I personally think we need some rules to protect people from offline raiding or something like that sort, Maybe a cooldown but that's hard to keep track off

What! No that’s stupid, offline base raiding rule, makes no sense at all so I have to sit and wait around all day to see if anyone comes or goes to attack or raid, stupid idea 

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1 hour ago, The Traveler said:

^This: 
As long as some scummy shit isn't taking down more than 1 wall piece (E.g: if somone went in to "raid" a base and took down like 4-5 seperate walls whilst there) then there shouldn't be any repercussions. 

Back in the day Bases never used to be a place to store gear, they were there for RP. People need to realise having a  big walled and locked off base with nice shit inside is like getting into the Tiger cage after oiling yourself up in BBQ sauce 0_0 

Well that’s what we used our base for. The thing is I didn’t really care about the tents or barrels, but we had floodlights and generators go missing. Yeah it’s a game I don’t mind being robbed, but cmon. Also the tents and barrels we did have were used for storing tools and gardening supplies for the most part. Storage is kind of needed for bases. The tents really were just there to RP a spot to sleep. People raided us for our storage items, didn’t really take anything else.

18 minutes ago, neom said:

What! No that’s stupid, offline base raiding rule, makes no sense at all so I have to sit and wait around all day to see if anyone comes or goes to attack or raid, stupid idea 

Na. What’s stupid is the fact that you can just run into an open base when realistically it would be protected. When my group is online there is always someone there. But guess what, we are all Americans and we have jobs and need to sleep. This is a game. Games need balancing.

What people fail to realize is that the community and the rules are a two way street. People should be able to do whatever they want that’s within reason but we also need to realize in fairness. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with having some protections in place. It’s no different then the no KOS rule. 

Edited by Zero

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Don't want your stuff stolen? Don't build a base! 

In all seriousness, building a base right now to store your things is risky. If you know it's so easy to get raided, why store all your stuff there? Why hoard a load of gear in an easily spotted place? Build it for RP and RP a raid. Use it for your own benefit.

Raiding is a great new aspect brought along with base building, let it be.

I'm applying these questions to all bases, not anyone in particular. 😁

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6 minutes ago, Zero said:

Well that’s what we used our base for. The thing is I didn’t really care about the tents or barrels, but we had floodlights and generators go missing. Yeah it’s a game I don’t mind being robbed, but cmon. Also the tents and barrels we did have were used for storing tools and gardening supplies for the most part. Storage is kind of needed for bases. The tents really were just there to RP a spot to sleep. 

Na. What’s stupid is the fact that you can just run into an open base when realistically it would be protected. When my group is online there is always someone there. But guess what, we are all Americans and we have jobs and need to sleep. This is a game. Games need balancing.

What people fail to realize is that the community and the rules are a two way street. People should be able to do whatever they want that’s within reason but we also need to realize in fairness. There’s absolutely nothing wrong with having some protections in place. It’s no different then the no KOS rule. 

I have no issue with a rule in place, but an offline rule is not a good idea, grieffing rule yes but an offline raiding rule no.

If I see a camp and I want to break in then why can’t I smash my way in (within reason) take what I want and dip, 

If this was out in the real world are you going to sit around outside a camp and wait for said group to come back and inform them of your plans NO. Get real 

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1 minute ago, neom said:

I have no issue with a rule in place, but an offline rule is not a good idea, grieffing rule yes but an offline raiding rule no.

If I see a camp and I want to break in then why can’t I smash my way in (within reason) take what I want and dip, 

If this was out in the real world are you going to sit around outside a camp and wait for said group to come back and inform them of your plans NO. Get real 

Theres two sides to it. It doesn't make sense that'd you'd be waiting outside, of course. Then again, does it make sense the camp would be completely deserted? No.

It's a two way street that I think most of are in agreement needs to be balanced.

Perhaps a set time isn't the best plan. However what other options are there?

Increase break time?

Fix combo locks?

I'm just repeating myself, but you gotta see it from both sides. Base buildings broke, like most the game. We just wanna see it working in a balanced and well thought manner.

DayZ Devs didnt have RP in mind when creating base building or much forethought really when making the game lol. Its our job to try to implement something that'll work for all us.

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I do not agree with the idea of making a rule to prevent offline raiding. We have players from all over the world so it would limit EU from raiding a base just because its owner is American and so on. Also, homes get broken into when people are asleep or out of town, which is the same concept of breaking into a base when people are offline. If more than ... two walls are broken in the process then I'd find that excessive and consider it griefing. Maybe the first wall break was to get in and check things out, and the second wall break was to get out or a logistical break to better loot said base.  

The only change I see needing to be a thing is metal walls should take longer to break into than wood ones or require different tools. 

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