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Lore Wipe SoonTM

Lorewipe - Yay or Nay  

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17 minutes ago, AndreyQ said:

wipe the lore and switch to miscreated

Now this I can get behind. A quality game.

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1 minute ago, Major said:

I don't know why you think things will get better. With a new story whitenames have to read.

^ This 100% 

-Group Dynamics will stay the same 100% (New names , new decals, but the players will gravitate towards the same shit pre-lore wipe let's be real here. Maybe there was a slim chance before TS went down, but now most people have private discords for just their group like @MoodyOG and co, I doubt 10000% that they'd "break up the band" as it were if a lore wipe came knocking.

-Beefs + alliances would be the same for the exact same reasoning , when everyone is in a microcosm social group, you can't expect a new story to read to change said groups. 

-Without groups pushing for lore to change, a new story aint gonna do shit for "freshness" (because I tend to agree with Rolle, Lore progression should be made by normal players, but then FACILITATED by staff: E.g: If a player group brought power back to a city, i'd expect the dev team to be like "shit cool dude! We adding a mod that makes it so within X radius of that city, you don't need power gens to power lights n shit")  

Doing a lore wipe, without players themselves nurturing the lore is like having a garden where, rather than caring for the plants and watering em and shit, you just add new plants to the garden every few months when the existing plants rot away. 

5 minutes ago, Ducky said:

Speaking of which, why the fuck did we get rid of the lore masters?

We have plenty of talented individuals who are just dying to be able to help shape things in a more official manner.

Why not let them?

Because it got to the point where players expected staff to do all the lore progression and players were just here for firefights and shit talking? ❤️ 

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Currently lore feels like a traintrack sandbox where things are already determined, whether that is due to how cemented the lore currently is - I'm unsure.

Lore needs to be less of a sandbox where players are effected by it, instead it needs to be effected by players and actions. It shouldn't be a pre-written story, instead the players should be the ones creating the story.

Now that we are no longer in 62 it gives us the ability to finally do things regarding lore, and to assist players in creating their own universe through their own actions. Previously it took well-organised groups made up of experienced players to push any form of lore, but with the tools we have, and a decent team we can change this. 

Giving the lore a fresh start creates more room for creativity. 

 

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12 minutes ago, Ducky said:

Speaking of which, why the fuck did we get rid of the lore masters?

We have plenty of talented individuals who are just dying to be able to help shape things in a more official manner.

Why not let them?

Trust me I have already fought and died on that hill.

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3 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

Because it got to the point where players expected staff to do all the lore progression and players were just here for firefights and shit talking? ❤️ 

And that problem was solved by leaving it to the players to continuously fight eachother with no end because no forced PKs, no major decisions or influence?

Nah, I'd rather staff take charge and lead a narrative, because regular people can't be trusted to let go of things.

Edited by Ducky

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5 minutes ago, Ducky said:

And that problem was solved by leaving it to the players to continuously fight eachother with no end because no forced PKs?

Nah, I'd rather staff take charge and lead a narrative, because regular people can't be trusted to let go of things.

Also true, and yet "staff" ends up mainly just being me with occasional volunteers.

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Just a little idea of mine for Lore (Going to sound bad I know) but I think having some part of Russia got hit by a nuke or something and people live down in Metro Tunnels (Yes referring to Metro I know) That way when people make characters that come from Russia this could be something they could add into there stories? They had to live down there from the radiation and watch out for Infected in the tunnels. Know it sounds kinda bad but thought I throw a little idea out there. 

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As cool as doing a 1940’s/50’s/60’s era would be, then that constricts people to only playing Russian(because cheenarus is apart of USSR at this point), few german(spies if 1940’s), few Americans(same token) and that’s it. And looking at how many people play Eastern Europeans as it currently stands, there’s gunna be wayyyyyyy too many Americans for soviet era chernarus for my liking, and I already know a lot of people aren’t not gunna put on an accent. So, as cool as it may be, Issa no from me yet again.

 

And let’s change topics here, player driven lore would be the only way this works. With no loremasters, the only way we pull anything off would be to have players push the lore, and I haven’t seen a lick of any lore push since like mid-last year. And I mean lore that’s more effective and in depth than just inner group RP, personal stories, and stuff like that.

 

I mean relevant lore. Lore that effects things outside of chernarus, as well as chernarus itself. 

 

Everyone wants ‘new and fresh’ but no one wants to put the effort in for new and fresh. A quarter of the community will maybe try and push this lore, but the rest just won’t care. 

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Personally, if I wanted people to be involved in the lore, id have em make it, through events and the such, where we know we actually made a difference. I think that lore would be the only real option to make a lore wipe happen, and to keep people involved.

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Tbh i could get behind one at the end of the year,

And honestly, i'm only on board if we can get a proper ending to it no matter how bleak or catastrophic the outcome. Give us some big events to celebrate the lore and cement the achievements of our characters, or spice things up and show us a BANG of an ending. 

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6 minutes ago, Ducky said:

And that problem was solved by leaving it to the players to continuously fight eachother with no end because no forced PKs, no major decisions or influence?

Nah, I'd rather staff take charge and lead a narrative, because regular people can't be trusted to let go of things.

There is a reason most staff apart from @Major (you fucking trooper you) burn out in the LM team. 

Noone should have the stress of progressing the lore in a way that is meaningful for the entire server... 

If the issue is the players only wanting endless firefights? Then maybe that's where the problem lies. And my question to use is, if the majority just want to shoot the shit out of each other on a non-KOS server, why in the ever living shit would anyone want to bust their arse off providing said players with amazing storylines?

Staff are not unwavering forces of good for the community. They are normal blokes and lasses like you and me, who just want the game to be fun. They get overworked,  they get stressed, and they certainly get pissed off and quit when a grand total of barely anyone gives a flying shit about lore progression that, god forbid, they themselves have to put effort into. 

1 minute ago, Para said:

Tbh i could get behind one at the end of the year,

And honestly, i'm only on board if we can get a proper ending to it no matter how bleak or catastrophic the outcome. Give us some big events to celebrate the lore and cement the achievements of our characters, or spice things up and show us a BANG of an ending. 

^Funnily enough, just before I posted Para added this, which perfectly sums up my point. This is not a completely unreasonable demand, but for 1 guy... hell a group of guys, wrapping up every group's story line would be taxing beyond belief 0_0 

Players need to pick up some of the weight. 

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A big - for setting it in the past. It would just be too restrictive and it would take a shit ton of effort to actually make a good character and RP it well and most people are not gonna spend time doing that. Push it 10, 20 maybe even 50 years into the future.

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Just now, AndreyQ said:

A big - for setting it in the past. Because how we supposed to firefight with  M1 Carbines .

*fixed ? 

 

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8 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

There is a reason most staff apart from @Major (you fucking trooper you) burn out in the LM team. 

Noone should have the stress of progressing the lore in a way that is meaningful for the entire server... 

If the issue is the players only wanting endless firefights? Then maybe that's where the problem lies. And my question to use is, if the majority just want to shoot the shit out of each other on a non-KOS server, why in the ever living shit would anyone want to bust their arse off providing said players with amazing storylines?

Staff are not unwavering forces of good for the community. They are normal blokes and lasses like you and me, who just want the game to be fun. They get overworked,  they get stressed, and they certainly get pissed off and quit when a grand total of barely anyone gives a flying shit about lore progression that, god forbid, they themselves have to put effort into. 

^Funnily enough, just before I posted Para added this, which perfectly sums up my point. This is not a completely unreasonable demand, but for 1 guy... hell a group of guys, wrapping up every group's story line would be taxing beyond belief 0_0 

Players need to pick up some of the weight. 

I want to be a pilot I have to manage prolonged stress under larger stakes.

That aside I'd really love a couple people to share the position with. Nobody and especially not me expects them to stick in forever. Give it 2 or 3 months and then leave or take a break. That'd be amazing. I don't want people feeling as if it's a job.

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1 minute ago, Major said:

I want to be a pilot I have to manage prolonged stress under larger stakes.

That aside I'd really love a couple people to share the position with. Nobody and especially not me expects them to stick in forever. Give it 2 or 3 months and then leave or take a break. That'd be amazing. I don't want people feeling as if it's a job.

If I wasn’t such a shit community member I would be down to do so. But events like summer of last year were fucking lit, and giving players choices in said event that impact lore is what makes them fun. 

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Lorewipe with permanent rain and nighttime, to give us that spooky apocalyptic feeling. Only real solution to the servers problem.

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Instead of starting all over from the beginning of the infection I would like to see a timejump into the future. Lets say the start of the lore is 5 years into the infection. This way people could already start with groups that technically can already have years of lore, standard lore factions like UN and CDF wouldnt be needed, people could keep their chars and the ruined game world would also make way more sense as it already looks like in a way that multiple years have past since the outbreak.

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IMO I really would not like this at all. 

Personally, other and myself have put more hours into our characters via research and development, than we can possibly keep any track of at this point. Just wiping all of it would make everything we’ve accomplished irrelevant and would suck. Will it eventually happen, yeah, but give us a chance to even finish this storyline.

This storyline can do better ic without being wiped, the problem is the community needs to work together OOC.

 

I’m putting in my two cents and then avoiding forums again. 

Sorry if I sound elitist, apparently sharing 15+ years of various rp experience; seeing things fail and go well, giving advice and suggestions from that, means that I’m a bitch:

 

TLDR:

Base building is still too broken

The lore mentality has absolutely nothing to do with it and a wipe will not solve all the issues of fighting

It’s a mentality that people must be able to work together and meet in the middle sort of thing

A lot of people have put a ton of time and energy into this lore and relationships etc. and while a lore wipe will come at some point, it just feels like an awful time for it

Guess what, nearly everyone ignores the day to day lore IC, even though it’s the most important aspect of the game

 

BASE BUILDING

While cool, it’s still completely unstable and with any server crash you could lose days-weeks of work instantly. It’s not reliable enough yet. Plus we have a lot of server crashes.

 

FIGHTING

This is a state of mind that simply has not been figured out how to compromise areas, and making sure you are rping with the type of people who enjoy what you do, have zones to combine stuff like hostile.

It does not matter what you do, reset the story, etc. It’s gonna happen because someone is bored and that’s how they have fun.

It does not matter if you make people and groups have goals because those goals can still be used to hate people

 

People need to be working together OOC to ensure that if they have IC conflicts or things.

That they’re actually all okay with it on an OOC basis, and that they communicate to keep things fun

Work together for ‘what do we want to accomplish and how do we help each other accomplish this’

If someone or a group really does not like something, put that into consideration, what can you do instead

This is a community of people, and working together provides better rp because it ensures people are moderately okay with what is happening

Can you still do random stuff, occasionally yes, an opportunity presents itself go for it, just make sure later things are okay or shift plans

You don’t need an IC reason to just drop something if its really upsetting someone OOC. Peoples OOC mental heath is more important than you holding a grudge because they looked at you funny IC

This is not scripted RP. It’s not. Scripted is where you literally make a script and do line for line actions. That is a prewritten story.

Having ooc communication, goals, et. Helps significantly in making sure that while IC people can hate each other, OOC they know they’re people playing a game and working to try to have fun with it. Groups and people who do this kind of thing, are usually overall a lot happier and less stressed.

 

LORE

People have largely been ignoring the lore

We’ve been told these flat out by @Major in the story lore, yet nearly everyone ignores it and then gets mad at the people who actually pay attention:

WE DO NOT LIVE IN THE WORLD WE SEE IN THE VIDEO GAME 

We are in modern settings with modern items

Homes are not covered in blood with broken glass everywhere and is not the awful state in game

The country is 2nd world, meaning go look up the Czech Republic. That’s a second world country. You have varying areas: great places with modern cities and tech, outer areas, farms, rural, etc. All kinds of things.

The world hasn’t fallen yet, its struggling, but has not fallen

People fall ill and go to full effects within 12-24 hours. Stores, hospitals, et. When they realize something is happen, overstock the hell out of everything they could possibly need in case. Plus, people turned faster than they had any chance to use the majority of the supplies

We have a ton of normal stores like wal-marts et. In towns, its not that hard to find things

While yes there was some panic, its not going to be like what people think in regards to looting etc. WHO and other guides point out that mass panic and looting are two of the hugest misconceptions to nearly everyone during disasters. People remain calm and help each other. The few cases of reported looting were more like certain people needing food and breaking into a grocery or corner store. The media loves to focus on the few instances of some people stealing electronics or something.

We pretty much got the equivalent supplies of = one person is a COSTCO or some large warehouse. Per person…. We are not out of major supplies for years…plus stuff in homes…dried/canned goods etc.

There is lore going on, there are people working with that lore to try to do things. I’m one of them.

 

LAST RESTART

It was nice without fighting for all of maybe 1 - 2 weeks. That seriously seems to be the record of people being able to not initiate on someone.

In that time though, people still caused issues

Groups did things that made no sense with their counterpart RL version causing extreme confusion

Confusion and people causing issues = people starting fights and warring

no real military or lore based repercussions for those actions because we can’t generate an npc army to be guards, et.

 

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2 hours ago, Roland said:

Any day now

MonkaS make me lore master.

jk but I would like a lorewipe. Freshens things up.

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I voted yes and for a particular reason or two.

So ultimately, the current lore is really basic, its bland and its forgettable. I'm not saying this to slight the hard work of those who created it, it is a solid piece which is expanded on plenty. However what really kills it is the game itself. The lore makes things out to be significantly more harsh then they are in game. Look in game and see the state of things, food and clean drinking water are literally falling from the sky. Ammunition and weapons can be plucked off the tree's and the environment itself is beautiful and lush....sure you have the occasional wolf pack here and there, but really are things dangerous enough to actually need to kill anyone from a realistic standpoint? no. Most if not all IG hatreds are derived from the fact that someone said something mean and the other people dident like it or someone robbed someone else and now the groups hate each other. Everything can be boiled down to a variant of one of those two situations. But in a realistic perspective, would groups be robbing each other if supplies were so plentiful? Would I need to take your beans when I have a stack to the ceiling back at my base? Would I need to take your gun or ammunition when I find more then I could ever hope to shoot and zombies are a minor threat, a moderate at worst. My point here is that the loot economy has an effect on player interaction. 

The current loot economy is flooded with weapons, ammunition and food, along with other supplies. Making interactions between other survivors safe because you know normally people wont rob you due to the amount of gear they already have. Traders are pointless because nothing has value, everything is far to common. How many times have you been moving through a RP hub and some random person comes up to you and asks if you have any 5.56 or a spare mag? Probably more then once huh? Thats how it is, why should anyone in their right mind be asking for free stuff like that and someone actually giving them anything? 'Oh its because I'm a helpful guy' yeah I doubt you'd be that helpful if you were on the brink of starvation half the time.

What I'm getting at is the loot tables need to be changed. The vast amounts of weapons can stay how it is, but ammunition should become increasingly rare as time passes. Its a finite resource and we cannot make more right now. Wolf packs should be more common and even move their roam locations into town spots as well.  Radiation/infection zones need to be added to create an environmental danger as well. This last one is the one that will ultimately make or break the next lore wipe for me as danger zones that have in game hazard are important. You put higher loot in areas that are radiated/infected and it makes them harder to access without proper gear. You wont have just anyone 'making a run' into a danger zone because you need the proper equipment to do so. It should be a thought out process that could kill you if you are not careful/aware. If all the big military area's are danger zones ( NWAF, Tizy, Kamensk Base ) it would be harder to get guns and military gear, players would have to scavenge from the small military checkpoints or Bolota or VMC to obtain the right gear to hit the big sites. Its an escalation in looting and breaks things further into tiers. You spawn in, you loot civilian stuff, you find military checkpoints, continue to loot, maybe a day later you find a gas mask, enough for a longer run inside the zone and obtain some goodies before heading back out. Perhaps you just have a bandana and attempt to get into the zone? you can only stay for a few minutes and have to make better use of your time. Zombies lock you inside a building? Time is ticking. It all adds a sense of danger, of risk and reward.

Ultimately I like lore wipes, especially when things begin to seem stale. I'm for this wipe, but only if there can be changes to the loot economy and hazard zones added.

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14 minutes ago, Hex said:

but only if there can be changes to the loot economy and hazard zones added.

Lets get some crazy shit going. Really something cool to RP with. 

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At this point I don’t think it will change literally anything. No one really pays attention to the lore other than “thar be zumbies here”. I mean the saviors were kicked out of their base in kamensk military base because it’s “radioactive”, which is silly. Just keep the lore how it is and focus on the RP you’re having over the imaginary story that really doesn’t affect your character beyond the fact that they’re in Chernarus with dead people walking around. Everything else is up to the people in game.

Edited by Squillium

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Honestly, the lore wipe won't do anything.

Last wipe there was a war that went on the entire time since I joined until the wipe, which only continued because no one wanted to perma..

Now we've got the same thing again, wipes don't change anything other than what's written on the forums unfortunately.

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30 minutes ago, Hex said:

I voted yes and for a particular reason or two.

So ultimately, the current lore is really basic, its bland and its forgettable. I'm not saying this to slight the hard work of those who created it, it is a solid piece which is expanded on plenty. However what really kills it is the game itself. The lore makes things out to be significantly more harsh then they are in game. Look in game and see the state of things, food and clean drinking water are literally falling from the sky. Ammunition and weapons can be plucked off the tree's and the environment itself is beautiful and lush....sure you have the occasional wolf pack here and there, but really are things dangerous enough to actually need to kill anyone from a realistic standpoint? no. Most if not all IG hatreds are derived from the fact that someone said something mean and the other people dident like it or someone robbed someone else and now the groups hate each other. Everything can be boiled down to a variant of one of those two situations. But in a realistic perspective, would groups be robbing each other if supplies were so plentiful? Would I need to take your beans when I have a stack to the ceiling back at my base? Would I need to take your gun or ammunition when I find more then I could ever hope to shoot and zombies are a minor threat, a moderate at worst. My point here is that the loot economy has an effect on player interaction. 

The current loot economy is flooded with weapons, ammunition and food, along with other supplies. Making interactions between other survivors safe because you know normally people wont rob you due to the amount of gear they already have. Traders are pointless because nothing has value, everything is far to common. How many times have you been moving through a RP hub and some random person comes up to you and asks if you have any 5.56 or a spare mag? Probably more then once huh? Thats how it is, why should anyone in their right mind be asking for free stuff like that and someone actually giving them anything? 'Oh its because I'm a helpful guy' yeah I doubt you'd be that helpful if you were on the brink of starvation half the time.

What I'm getting at is the loot tables need to be changed. The vast amounts of weapons can stay how it is, but ammunition should become increasingly rare as time passes. Its a finite resource and we cannot make more right now. Wolf packs should be more common and even move their roam locations into town spots as well.  Radiation/infection zones need to be added to create an environmental danger as well. This last one is the one that will ultimately make or break the next lore wipe for me as danger zones that have in game hazard are important. You put higher loot in areas that are radiated/infected and it makes them harder to access without proper gear. You wont have just anyone 'making a run' into a danger zone because you need the proper equipment to do so. It should be a thought out process that could kill you if you are not careful/aware. If all the big military area's are danger zones ( NWAF, Tizy, Kamensk Base ) it would be harder to get guns and military gear, players would have to scavenge from the small military checkpoints or Bolota or VMC to obtain the right gear to hit the big sites. Its an escalation in looting and breaks things further into tiers. You spawn in, you loot civilian stuff, you find military checkpoints, continue to loot, maybe a day later you find a gas mask, enough for a longer run inside the zone and obtain some goodies before heading back out. Perhaps you just have a bandana and attempt to get into the zone? you can only stay for a few minutes and have to make better use of your time. Zombies lock you inside a building? Time is ticking. It all adds a sense of danger, of risk and reward.

Ultimately I like lore wipes, especially when things begin to seem stale. I'm for this wipe, but only if there can be changes to the loot economy and hazard zones added.

Yeah I really wish we could edit out the current economy to have things be scare. Lore has zero to do with that.

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Just now, Major said:

Yeah I really wish we could edit out the current economy to have things be scare. Lore has zero to do with that.

Perhaps some day. Honestly one of my favorite DayZ patches was the one where food was EXTREMELY scarce. You had people robbing each other for a half full can of beans. Cannibals were a thing out of necessity not even for fun. It was hard but fun.

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