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Re-instate the LoreMasters

Re-instate Loremasters?  

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20 hours ago, Despacito2 said:

Lore definitely hasn't changed much or had too many major events that I can recall. But I think we need the right loremasters to actually push changes and big events forward. I'm talking about events that almost anyone in the server can take part in, or be involved with.

Tbh even I think we need less "pick a side events" and more things like the invasion events ( but within the limits of the currrent game) where , let's say a chopper crashes with some vital info on a stash of weapons that could change the tide of a group war... 
I'd love that event to be able to be attended (for a full grab of the prize) by groups, factions, alliances, hell even 2 scavangers and their mum who think they could pedal the goods if they found em first. 

Would be hella cool! ^_^ 

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Just gonna bump this up more, because this is becoming an even more relevant topic as time goes on. 

#GiveMeLMOrGiveMeDeath

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What a fat meme. 

90% in favor of adding back Lore Masters. But I'm sure the 10% will pull through. Just a hunch.

Add them back

Edited by -Chow-

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100% Agree, one of the biggest differences between proper RP servers and the crap ones out there is proper lore that develops over time and changes as things change in game. Otherwise the lore stagnates and it causes so much more confusion for new people who join, they have no way of knowing what has changed, what should be added to their character backstories to have it make sense. And on top of that those of us who were working with the LMs for storylines are no unable to do so and what are we supposed to do? Scrap all of the time and work that has gone into that? For some of us that is MONTHS of work pages of notes made of things that effect groups and characters is huge ways.

This isn't going to improve anything on the server, instead it is going to make things worse. Bring them back and give them proper power, let them have final say on group approval and the ability to actually do their jobs there needs to be more LMs not a removal of all of them. 

 

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2 hours ago, Karma said:

100% Agree, one of the biggest differences between proper RP servers and the crap ones out there is proper lore that develops over time and changes as things change in game. Otherwise the lore stagnates and it causes so much more confusion for new people who join, they have no way of knowing what has changed, what should be added to their character backstories to have it make sense. And on top of that those of us who were working with the LMs for storylines are no unable to do so and what are we supposed to do?

 

Apologise in advance about the colours, felt it separated the post better ^_^ 

If you wanna push lore stuff and NEED staff help, then maybe are trying push the wrong type of lore stuff. 

I always give this as an example, so apologise. But my first ever few weeks on dayzrp were as follows;

-Get on
-Find out current status quo is bunch of bandits have took the entire west side of map, main "Hunting grounds" being NWAF
-My character, kind heart, decides to start doing things for people
-Gets a decent rep, saves people from an  infection running rampant by getting a team together to get antibiotics from berenzino (When cities were actually dangerous), Picked people up along the shore and took em to the trade post, helped a bus driver fix up his bus so he can back to earning a living
-Pieces in place, start putting out feelers
-Get a merc group, bus boy, the Free Medics and a few others together
-Had enough of Bandit western fuckery
-Operation "punt the fuckers out of the west [Name pending change]" is a-go
-Plan is simple: Medics set up station at "entrance to the west" (Prud lake at the time) , Mercs take and hold one of the PCB's near NWAF as a staging ground, we set up a trade route to the Prud Lake camp to ensure logevity (This takes several weeks). 
-Big event is advetised, in game at first, but then once people had heard of the event we started putting it on the forum as an event thread
-Everyone gets on, bus boy drives entire militia we've gathered (20-30 guys) around NW patrolling
-Get to NWAF, get's stopped by the bandit boys, we fight back, get pinned into ATC tower
-Grand last stand
-We hold out, win the day
-After that the bandits IC and OCC agreed this was enough to push em out
-Trade routes set up pre battle thrive, rarer loot from North West being traded for medical goods only found near shoreline
-Bandits become more likely to set up road blocks sparsed around the common trade paths, as opposed to occupying actual territory
-In conclusion: One stupid fuck boy decides enough is enough and, after spurring other groups to action, the entire status quo of the server changes into a new dynamic, lore is progressed. 

^Didn't get a single Admin, Mod or LM to help...


Point is lore is pushed forward by players, and I 100% believe that the reason stagnation has occured is 4 factors and, relating back to my tale above, you can see exactly why these 4 factors stop people from doing what I described in the tale...: 

-Shitty loot economy that's saturated to fuck (Trade routes don't matter anymore as you can loot whereever, cities are basically fucking useless at this point, in turn settlements have no real purpose apart from being cesspool fuck around spots AKA "hubs") 

-Groups are few and far between, with either super mega groups of 20+ people (which simply do not work with the numbers we have right now, regardless of how many people are online from said group, fact is too many people from the dwindling community hang around with x ammount of people) or no groups at all (what, we have like 7 now?) 

-Noone travels anymore: Due to issues with travelling in general (Buggy vehicles, the new spring mechanic coming soon, the ridiculous size of the map they've spent so much time expanding without expanding player numbers...) people prefer these mega hubs... There is no power grab anymore... just Hubs swapping location every month or so... 

-Hostility is very difficult now: Adversity breeds change, it is true in real life, and I would say even more in DayZRP. Having the majority of the sever be these peace inclined characters is great, interesting, cool individual 1 on 1 rp... but it leaves much to be desired as far as shit to do. Imagine walking dead without any of the big bads? It'd just be building churches and shitty east enders level drama. Closest we got to lore progression was Anarchy's gun ban... say what you want about it OOC, but at least it got people fucking doing shit : Black market gun trade, rebellions etc etc


Between those 4 things, stagnation thrives... no ammount of LM's can hope to battle all that, and I seriously pitty every single one of them who were hired, and eventually fell trying to...

Saying you want an LM to do cool lore stuff, when all these blatent problems are still here, is like saying you have diseases in your garden, the water tap's broken, and the gazebo's on fire, but you want to hire someone to "make the garden look pretty"... 

Edited by The Traveler

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8 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

If you wanna push lore stuff and NEED staff help, then maybe are trying push the wrong type of lore stuff. 

I always give this as an example, so apologise. But my first ever few weeks on dayzrp were as follows;

-Get on
-Find out current status quo is bunch of bandits have took the entire west side of map, main "Hunting grounds" being NWAF
-My character, kind heart, decides to start doing things for people
-Gets a decent rep, saves people from an  infection running rampant by getting a team together to get antibiotics from berenzino (When cities were actually dangerous), Picked people up along the shore and took em to the trade post, helped a bus driver fix up his bus so he can back to earning a living
-Pieces in place, start putting out feelers
-Get a merc group, bus boy, the Free Medics and a few others together
-Had enough of Bandit western fuckery
-Operation "punt the fuckers out of the west [Name pending change]" is a-go
-Plan is simple: Medics set up station at "entrance to the west" (Prud lake at the time) , Mercs take and hold one of the PCB's near NWAF as a staging ground, we set up a trade route to the Prud Lake camp to ensure logevity (This takes several weeks). 
-Big event is advetised, in game at first, but then once people had heard of the event we started putting it on the forum as an event thread
-Everyone gets on, bus boy drives entire militia we've gathered (20-30 guys) around NW patrolling
-Get to NWAF, get's stopped by the bandit boys, we fight back, get pinned into ATC tower
-Grand last stand
-We hold out, win the day
-After that the bandits IC and OCC agreed this was enough to push em out
-Trade routes set up pre battle thrive, rarer loot from North West being traded for medical goods only found near shoreline
-Bandits become more likely to set up road blocks sparsed around the common trade paths, as opposed to occupying actual territory
-In conclusion: One stupid fuck boy decides enough is enough and, after spurring other groups to action, the entire status quo of the server changes into a new dynamic, lore is progressed. 

^Didn't get a single Admin, Mod or LM to help...

Point is lore is pushed forward by players, and I 100% believe that the reason stagnation has occured is 4 factors: 

-Shitty loot economy that's saturated to fuck (Trade routes don't matter anymore as you can loot whereever, cities are basically fucking useless at this point, in turn settlements have no real purpose apart from being cesspool fuck around spots AKA "hubs") 

-Groups are few and far between, with either super mega groups of 20+ people (which simply do not work with the numbers we have right now, regardless of how many people are online from said group, fact is too many people from the dwindling community hang around with x ammount of people) or no groups at all (what, we have like 7 now?) 

-Noone travels anymore: Due to issues with travelling in general (Buggy vehicles, the new spring mechanic coming soon, the ridiculous size of the map they've spent so much time expanding without expanding player numbers...) people prefer these mega hubs... There is no power grab anymore... just Hubs swapping location every month or so... 

-Hostility is very difficult now: Adversity breeds change, it is true in real life, and I would say even more in DayZRP. Having the majority of the sever be these peace inclined characters is great, interesting, cool individual 1 on 1 rp... but it leaves much to be desired as far as shit to do. Imagine walking dead without any of the big bads? It'd just be building churches and shitty east enders level drama. Closest we got to lore progression was Anarchy's gun ban... say what you want about it OOC, but at least it got people fucking doing shit : Black market gun trade, rebellions etc etc

Between those 4 things, stagnation thrives... no ammount of LM's can hope to battle all that, and I seriously pitty every single one of them who were hired, and eventually fell trying to...

Saying you want an LM to do cool lore stuff, when all these blatent problems are still here, is like saying you have diseases in your garden, the water tap's broken, and the gazebo's on fire, but you want to hire someone to "make the garden look pretty"... 

What you are saying is all fine and good, but with no one updating the lore than it doesn't mean shit. And we aren't talking about the other issues no one is denying there are plenty of them but thats not what this thread is about.

And some of the things being worked on I was working with the LMs on to make sure I got the information right before it effected things in game.

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20 minutes ago, Karma said:

What you are saying is all fine and good, but with no one updating the lore than it doesn't mean shit. And we aren't talking about the other issues no one is denying there are plenty of them but thats not what this thread is about.

And some of the things being worked on I was working with the LMs on to make sure I got the information right before it effected things in game.

It really does, you didn't see Tomeran writing down the lore like some sort of librarian boy. If your lore progression fades into memory with ease unless it is written down by some bloke on the forums, it wasn't that lore changing in the first place I'm afraid. 

And no, noone is denying it. But yet we're trying to get a decorator before we've dealt with the fire in the house. Someone can make your wallpaper look nice as shit, but if the whole house burns down it don't mean crap... 

Like seriously, if you need to make sure you get the information right, you're thinking to complicatedly about progressing the lore. 
Not saying your progression is like this but , in my humble opinion : 

Lore progression that is ok:
-Wanting to start a drug trade with some rare plant found in the north
-Wanting to overthrow a trade hub through political manuverings and assasination
-Wishing to an expand a small empire building in the south by setting up a "frontier camp" near the edge of the empire's northern border to allow easier loot runs into the north.

Lore progression that is iffy:
-Your contacts outside of chernarus have got some weapons they want to smuggle in to help you
-Broadcasts from the UN/ USSR/ insert faction here have been heard by your character about blah blah blah
-You've heard word of a secret military base in chernarus

Lore Progression that is ahuge fuckin no no: 

-You've heard of a nuke underneath Cherno, you wanna deactivate it
-Your character has a cartel of men outside of Chernarus who wish to smuggle in weapons to the country. 
-Anything that involves inventing some higher power n shit. 

The iffy and no no needs some sort of staff intevention / clarifying. 

I.E: Do more of the first example please, everything else needs staff and is just  a bit shitty when taking other characters into account (not everyone can get super cool shit from the LM's for their super special back stories). Make your own lore, don't relly on Staff giving you clarifications / lore for you to work with. 

With that in mind, players need to do more of the ok stuff before we even DESERVE the stuff that requires staff... ? Harsh.. but I 100% believe it to be true. 

Edited by The Traveler

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38 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

-snip-

Sorry but last time you were even in game according to your profile was THREE MONTHS ago

So please dont talk like you know the stuff that has been being worked on and is now up in the air without the LMs to help out.

I stand by what I said, the server NEEDS LMs

Edited by Karma

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6 minutes ago, Karma said:

Sorry but last time you were even in game according to your profile was THREE MONTHS ago

So please dont talk like you know the stuff that has been being worked on and is now up in the air without the LMs to help out.

I stand by what I said, the server NEEDS LMs

Oh look, the "You aint been on in X ammount of months" defence. 
Yeah the discussion is dead... 
LM's are not needed, and if people think they are a necessity, then they are part of this self inflicted stagnation issue. 
Good luck with the poll guys, im out.

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5 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

Oh look, the "You aint been on in X ammount of months" defence. 
Yeah the discussion is dead... 
LM's are not needed, and if people think they are a necessity, then they are part of this self inflicted stagnation issue. 
Good luck with the poll guys, im out.

Yes because stomping your feet like this and saying they aren't needed totally decides it right?

You may not like the whole "You havent been in in X amount of time" thing but its still the truth. I really wish polls like this were limited only to those who actually get on and know how things currently are in game.

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4 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

Oh look, the "You aint been on in X ammount of months" defence. 
Yeah the discussion is dead... 
LM's are not needed, and if people think they are a necessity, then they are part of this self inflicted stagnation issue. 
Good luck with the poll guys, im out.

As usual your posts reflect a fantasy dream land where Tomeran is still a LM, Kovars Market is still around, and we're playing the mod instead of standalone. I would have loved to put forth some of the scenarios you mentioned but with this community and this game, none of those would ever be possible. Instead we had to resort to those events which according to you are a no go. I'm sorry if it wasn't up to your hyper ideological standard but it's what we had to do and we got almost all positive feedback about it. If you had a problem with our events then you should have pushed forward an event or two of your own other than the simple 'Open Air Market at Kovars'  or post some constructive staff feedback instead of bitching after the fact. It's time to come down to reality, and if you can't then maybe you should leave, again. Because this place will never be able to satisfy you like it once did. 

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16 minutes ago, Karma said:

Yes because stomping your feet like this and saying they aren't needed totally decides it right?

You may not like the whole "You havent been in in X amount of time" thing but its still the truth. I really wish polls like this were limited only to those who actually get on and know how things currently are in game.

It's been the same shit for 2 years+, those issues have been here for 2 years+. LM's have been hired and have left the position for simmilar reasons for 2 years + . Stagnation has almost never got better on LM efforts unless an LM really busts their arse off to the point of being burned out. 

It is 100% unfair to expect LM's to solve all of your lore issues because you lot are convinced that LM's are the be all end all of lore progression and surely are needed. It has burned them out in the past, pissed em off in the past, and all in all infuriated the hell out of select people who just wanna see players get off their arses and progress the lore themselves. 

How current things are in game is the only group who's actually done shit to progress lore without LM help got bitched on from the rest of the community for "being too powerful". You literally had a angry mob against a group for being the only ones who realised you could progress lore without staff... 

 

11 minutes ago, PCJames said:

As usual your posts reflect a fantasy dream land where Tomeran is still a LM, Kovars Market is still around, and we're playing the mod instead of standalone. I would have loved to put forth some of the scenarios you mentioned but with this community and this game, none of those would ever be possible. Instead we had to resort to those events which according to you are a no go. I'm sorry if it wasn't up to your hyper ideological standard but it's what we had to do and we got almost all positive feedback about it. If you had a problem with our events then you should have pushed forward an event or two of your own other than the simple 'Open Air Market at Kovars'  or post some constructive staff feedback instead of bitching after the fact. It's time to come down to reality, and if you can't then maybe you should leave, again. Because this place will never be able to satisfy you like it once did. 

The point is that people are left in this dark place where they 100% cannot progress lore without the events you guys are / were doing. They were great, no doubt about it. Point is not everyone can do that... not everyone can get super special LM aproval to do their super sayan mega story arcs. And it is 100% unfair to favour the few over the whole. Teaching the community that shit can't be done without staff intervention . 

There aint no fantasy land mothertrucker, just a land ya'll can't be arsed to graft for. 
Personally? I'm at university, I don't have the time to be this cool ass make a group and do fun shit guy anymore. But I don't even feel like logging in most days because it's the same boring shit on a different day now. 
Seldom these LM events that you guys poured everything into, there's fuck all going on! 

And yeah , mechanics may suck , travelling is a bore, but that don't stop people grafting. People need to take back RP. We need to have the empire builders, the mad psychos, the "quest builders", the mechanics, bus drivers and that one shitter who only wears a shoe and frying pan over his crotch. 

We would LIKE an LM team... we don't NEED one. 
And don't come spouting to me about me not being satisfied. 
NO SHITTER IS SATISFIED AT THE MOMENT DUDE! 
Perhaps it's you who needs to come back to reality for a few minutes. Threads like this one about:

-Hostility restrictions
-LM's leaving
-Lore Stagnation
-Hubs being toxic
-Nothing to do
-Hard to find people 

Are a weekly occurance. To pretend me pushing out the fundemental 4 flaws we need to tackle in some shape or form is me bitching and "fantasising about a utopian server" is just me bitching is down right avoiding the problem by kidding yourself into thinking it's just how things are and will be. 

I believe in this community, when I'm back (and I'm coming back soon mark my words) I wanna be able to play with enthusiastic people who don't need no god in the sky to make lore up.

Instead I get told that, because I want to have a server founded upon self respecting RPers who don't need to be hand held to get good RP, apparently I'm some hyper inflated idealist? Get outa town with it!  

To keep this shit show on topic i'll reitterate. 

You don't NEED LM's. They are a luxury and a nice thing to have. But if you can't progress your own / other's story arcs without them, you need to seriously get on the mentor programme, as it's a fundemental skill everyone should have, but clearly struggle with or the main topic of the decade for this community wouldn't be lore stagnation. 

Edited by The Traveler

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13 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

-snip-

You are really enjoying ignoring what people are saying. People are actively trying to create things to do, I know my group is working hard on that and we have or at least had things in process to try to stir things up. However as it was lore effecting we were trying to go about it the right way. Its not about hand holding or anything even close to that so please stop saying thats what it is. Sure they aren't needed for EVERYTHING but they are still needed, and if you actually knew what not just my group was working on but other groups as well or you know got in game you might see that, but instead you get on the forums when threads like this pop up and go on about the mod and things that have next to nothing to do with this thread.

Edited by Karma

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9 minutes ago, Karma said:

You are really good at ignoring what people are saying. People are actively trying to create things to do, I know my group is working hard on that and we have or at least had things in process to try to stir things up. However as it was lore effecting we were trying to go about it the right way. Its not about hand holding or anything even close to that so please stop saying thats what it is. Sure they aren't needed for EVERYTHING but they are still needed, and if you actually knew what not just my group was working on but other groups as well or you know got in game you might see that, but instead you get on the forums when threads like this pop up and go on about the mod and things that have next to nothing to do with this thread.

You come in here large and in charge, saying you need the LM's. Well guese what bud, if you need an LM to progress your lore, then you are doing it wrong. Plain and simple. Don't need to bring up mod, don't need to talk about old situations that directly relate to progressing lore without LM's to prove you don't need em <--- which is exactly what my "mod speak" was for, so get out of here with that "nothing to do with this thread" bullshit.

I will straight out say, if half a dozen groups were planning shit that needs LM's, then those groups are 100% the problem. 

This thread being the god damn proof. Without these... what? 3 -4 staff members, you're all floundering and claiming the lore progression's doomed and we need lore masters to do shit. You may not THINK it's hand holding but it 100% is. You are wholly dependant on these 3-4 staff and frankly it's a bit depressing. 

Loremasters should not be NEEDED for ANYTHING period. You should be able to have just as much fun and freedom without them as you do with them. 
If you can't, as I have said throughout this thread, you are part of the problem and are 100% being hand held to the point of dependancy.

As said, the ONE AND ONLY group I have seen that has 100% proven you don't need LM's to lore progress was universally shat on by the community for being "too powerful" <That phrasing , that I saw many a time, sums up both your's, and the majority's opinion on how much of the lore they should be able to influence without LM's, even if you / they don't want to admit it. 

Simple as really.  Solve the real problems, stop trying to get one poor bastard / a group of them to keep the game fun whilst ignoring the glaring issues causing your dependency...

Edited by The Traveler

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18 minutes ago, The Traveler said:

Are a weekly occurance. To pretend me pushing out the fundemental 4 flaws we need to tackle in some shape or form is me bitching and "fantasising about a utopian server" is just me bitching is down right avoiding the problem by kidding yourself into thinking it's just how things are and will be. 

Hate to break it to you Traveler, but even when the server has been in a great state of RP, both in quality and quantity...you've still found your place to moan about the same things.

I mean, regarding this topic - I haven't been IG in over half a year. Yet, even when RP was truly thriving (i know I haven't seen the state of it myself, but like I'm just talking popularity...and have you seen how many people tend to populate the servers at the moment?), LM's were an essential part of keeping the world alive. I'm not too concerned for events or anything, they often feel superficial. But when it comes to further developing the world and its lore? Fuck yes, we need LM's.

Plus, as I believe @Strawberry(?) said; they were the main source of knowledge when it came to lore. 90% of our staff cannot provide an in-depth lore explanation. And I don't shun them for that, that's not their role. Hence why we need one.

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Everyone calm down for a little bit! No need to make things heated. Will open this up again in a little bit.

Keep this on topic, dont need to start roasting people.

/locked

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Reopening, please keep it civil

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I haven't been active on this community for a very long time, in game or on the forums. And for the life of me I can't think of a reason why we wouldn't need Loremasters. This server is run on roleplaying, which means lore is created, does it not stand to reason we would need staff members to further that lore and keep things going? Is there some concern that they will receive rewards and privileges without doing work, because that is nonsense. I was a terrible CH for two months and even when I was in Help Desk very few people ever needed me. I haven't read this thread in-depth so maybe people are making much more coherent points than I am. But seriously, why wouldn't there be Loremasters on an RP server? For shame ?

 

Edited by Doc Phlox
Silly inebriation

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+1 we definitely need Loremasters because there should be as much effort going into stories and what goes on in game other than just staff. 

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I'm not sure what else there is to say about this that hasn't already been said. I'm just sitting here like...

4f0d6f57e2156978cc4db782374cd448.thumb.png.d6fbb7fd6584eaf5c3df1cecb6840a3b.png

The community has clearly made it's opinion clear on this. I guess it's up to staff I guess to come together and decide what to do next.

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On 7/21/2018 at 9:02 PM, PCJames said:

As usual your posts reflect a fantasy dream land where Tomeran is still a LM, Kovars Market is still around, and we're playing the mod instead of standalone. I would have loved to put forth some of the scenarios you mentioned but with this community and this game, none of those would ever be possible. Instead we had to resort to those events which according to you are a no go. I'm sorry if it wasn't up to your hyper ideological standard but it's what we had to do and we got almost all positive feedback about it. If you had a problem with our events then you should have pushed forward an event or two of your own other than the simple 'Open Air Market at Kovars'  or post some constructive staff feedback instead of bitching after the fact. It's time to come down to reality, and if you can't then maybe you should leave, again. Because this place will never be able to satisfy you like it once did. 

I'm sorry but like 90% of events were pushed forward by community members and LM groups were considered a joke, most events were based around RP that groups like Anarchy and others started to begin with. Rest were pushed forward by Major and I don't quite remember any events after he went on break that weren't pushed forward by the community. Even though people want LMs reinstated, me and @Roland have both seen that they work hard for a month or two and then lose interest which is normal with the game's current state, hence why we aren't reinstating LMs at the moment to begin with.

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More than likely we will revisit the idea of the LM Team once .63 launches for us and we see a need/influx of Lore Progression to be added.

Until that time, there is not a direct need for the LMs just yet, though I definitely understand the want and the desire to have them back. Major bb ... pls...

Reminder; community members CAN approach Staff about Lore Progression ideas/events for the community. Just a FYI.

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4 hours ago, Brayces said:

once .63 launches

So by 2020

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18 minutes ago, Hofer said:

So by 2020

Not quite; https://forums.dayz.com/topic/238625-newsletter-registration-for-server-owners/

We've signed for the news letter for Private Servers on when .63 Option will be available for us to swap to, .63 is currently out for Official Servers on Exp Branches, Stable to come. Sadly we cannot force them to give us the option sooner. We have to wait.

I know it sucks, but we physically CANNOT swap to a version that is not released yet for our type of Server.

If Roland did not, and does not see a current need for Lore Masters then we are not going to add the position back in yet. Will they (the position) be added back in the future? Maybe. But I can bet that until a new change happens, such as the release of .63 for Private Servers, we won't revisit the idea for a LM Team.

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LoreMasters are the heroes we deserve, but not the ones we need right now. When 0.63 hits and activity picks up, then the positions should be reconsidered.

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