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Shazzzam

Characters escaping death.

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Well I'll be straight here.

Rule

  • 11.5 When speaking with another player, you may not communicate over the radio (TeamSpeak) with your allies unless you speak over the radio and in game at the same time. Telepathic communication is not acceptable.

is more or less, based on realism. You can't speak on a radio in front of someone, without them hearing you. It's physically impossible. The sound transmitted equals to the sound made in the first place. The person near the one talking in the radio will hear the chatter almost equally as well as those who were listening on the other side of the radio. 

There is rule. It is not based on realism however so the first rule which I gave as example makes me confused. Do we value realism in roleplay or are we ready to bend realism in an impossible manner so the roleplay can be extended.

  • 9.2 When your character dies you must continue your role play as if you were wounded in the situation that lead to your death.


But this rule is flawed since there are many types of death. It is also not based on realism and I'm asking why not? 

I do understand that if this rule were to not exist, people would have to perma their characters because of even stupid glitch deaths, since we all know this game is not the most polished one in terms of bugs.

But as I said, the range of deaths varies greatly. For example you can fall off the map and die, that isn't considered really roleplay, rather than an unfortunate death to a glitch in the game. However there is also the other type of death, which is more roleplay oriented. A guy gets captured, taken hostage. He gets threatened with a shotgun shot to the face at maybe 1-2 meters distance. He fails to comply and gets a shotgun shot in the face. How is this, roleplay-wise, playable? How on Earth can you consider this good RP, to simply shrug off such severe damage to the human head, which is also justified by the roleplay example. If such a situation is played out, tell me, how must a victim explain later on that his face managed to recover the blown-off flesh, fractured and crushed jaw and bones and perhaps come out blind, because his eyes are simply obliterated, at least one of them is torn to shreds from the shotgun pellets. Not to mention brain damage. In the best surviving case the character must come out as some form of handicapped individual with a hideous facial appearance.

My suggestion for this is that perma death should not be asked for - for example | //permission for perma? | or to be possible ONLY if the character owner is willing. When the character owner is willing he may always kill his character at any time, but I think that, besides his own choice, if his permanent death is justified by roleplay, the roleplay itself should decide if the character is deemed unplayable, or at least how in another thread some dude suggested being "benched". But the idea here is, he should be unplayable not due to too many deaths, but rather because of the injuries sustained from even one conflict. 

Example: In a hostile RP some character got damaged with gun wounds and managed to survive. The character will be set as unplayable for a time frame set by the character owner, not less than 1 day, in order for the character to recover. 

Someone sustaining heavy gun injuries and simply regenerating them in a few hours is bad RP imo.

Feedback.

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Well it s alredy a thread up about radio things and a thread up about bench characters so idk

If you get an injurie you can rp out an bad injurie or an easy one. Its a game everything cant be super perfect.

You self have been gunned down by us sometimes and what "injuries" do your character have by that.:|

More strict rules would hurt. People wannt to have fun not more strict rules would hurt the player base

Edited by BorisRP

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Same goes to your group, but I'm just implying that not in all injuries, only in some cases that is understandable that the "benching" should be applied due to heavy injuries or permanent death to extreme wounds.

Here is another example:

Take the VDC which is supposed to be a lore group, right? Let's say they had a fight with some other group. Both sides took losses and some of the characters took irreparable damage to their bodies. 

Now look at how the lore would sound like with the current rule - "There where those VDC guys. They fought some hostile group for the defense of South Zagoria. Some of the VDC members got their faces blown off and one even took a grenade to the chest, point blank range, got torn to pieces. But they all managed to somehow get out of it alive and still remain there to complete their goals."

It sounds retarded. And that's how it basically is right now with all the deaths.

Edited by Shazzzam

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12 minutes ago, Shazzzam said:

Same goes to your group, but I'm just implying that not in all injuries, only in some cases that is understandable that the "benching" should be applied due to heavy injuries or permanent death to extreme wounds.

Idk if "realism" are gonna come from you to be honest trying to take out 6+ people  alone but hey what do i know. And then after go on they radio "my friends dragged me out of there so idk maybe you do some internal rp for your injuries. Oh and i still remember when you started to shoot at the hole vybor compound.

As ive alredy said its another thread about bench characters and stuff like that so go over there and have a look and look what @Rolle said.

Edited by BorisRP

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Just now, BorisRP said:

Idk if "realism" are gonna come from you to be honest trying to take out 6+ people  alone but hey what do i know. And then after go on they radio "my friends dragged me out of there so idk maybe you do some internal rp for your injuries.

As ive alredy said its another thread about bench characters and stuff like that so go over there and have a look and look what @Rolle said.

I'm playing by the current rules Boris, that's how I got dragged out of there. I respect your opinion but I await more feedback on my statements.

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tenor.gif

We have had this suggestion appear every few months for the last 3 years or so.

 

The conclusion that both I and the staff team stands on is that while yes, it's not realistic or great RP to have character that just died in game appear healthy or slightly injured just a few hours later, it is the less evil option. Allowing permadeath be done by other players opens a huge window of possibilities for abuse from hostile players, something that we want to avoid at all costs.

Instead, there was a suggestion to permadeath characters that died a lot or often (taken up in the other thread), but it turns out people don't die nearly enough for it to be effective.

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@Rolle With all due respect It seems you misunderstood what I said. I am not suggesting that the permanent death be done by other players. I suggested to be justified and done by the role play itself. Let me give you an example.

Someone taken hostage. Finds a window of opportunity to retaliate. Get's shot multiple times at point blank range and his corpse stays there for quite a bit of time. Such roleplay should suggest that the character has either survived by a thin margin, which gives him a need of a min 1 day recovery (in other words, unplayable for 1 day) or to be permanently killed due to injuries. The character himself can not be killed if he complies, so there is no abuse. It is indeed his choice if he wants to risk benching or permadeath if he chooses to retaliate or not.

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OHAYO GOZAIMASU! SUGOI KAWAII OTAKU ADMIN AIKO DESU! OGENKI DESU KA!?

I disagree with this,

For the main fact is that I enjoy playing out my injuries, and benching a character prevents me from doing some really fun medical rp. Which in turns gives you more people to rp with and progress stories with.

An it will simply lead to confusion and well very upset community members.

For example and this actually happened to me:

What if I am captured along with the random I am with and in the process of being moved to a different location, but in that time I am saved by the randoms group. A fire fight breaks out and I lay on the ground still complying and trying to say alive by staying down and gun shots ring out. 

After a few minutes the gun fight stops and everything is fine and I am released and thus saved by these random people. As I am talking to them and walking away, with no gun out and trying to process what just happened. I am shot out of no where!

Now then, this to me is rped out fine and things ended well after as well. I didnt perm but I did rp out injured. But my point is sometimes things happen that can be considered permable but its always, always going to be left to the characters choice. If someone gets shot in the head....if someone shoots themselves in the head. But want to rp it out that they didn't die. That is up to them and people can get very creative with this.

Examples:

Quote

The shot to the head missed and simply grazed their head, this happened to my last character and I did in fact shelve her for a few days.

The bullet was ruined in the gun and it went off inside the barrel causing shrapnel to fly everywhere and into the person body instead.

These are just a few examples of things that can, and have happened in rp. It creates for interesting story developments and so on. Really it depends on the character, and how THEY wanna rp it out. Its never ever up to the other person. Its the same thing with a cannibal, say they kill you legitimately and then eat your body. They run into you again a day later and say you should be dead, we cut you up and ate you....that is powergaming almost to the T. My suggestion is to work it out with the hostile party, and see what works out. If you wanna Perm they most likely will help you and give you something to remember. BUT that is my opinion!

I quiet enjoy my injured rp, and like to find doctors to help with that! ^_^

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52 minutes ago, Shazzzam said:

Someone taken hostage. Finds a window of opportunity to retaliate. Get's shot multiple times at point blank range and his corpse stays there for quite a bit of time. Such roleplay should suggest that the character has either survived by a thin margin, which gives him a need of a min 1 day recovery (in other words, unplayable for 1 day) or to be permanently killed due to injuries. The character himself can not be killed if he complies, so there is no abuse. It is indeed his choice if he wants to risk benching or permadeath if he chooses to retaliate or not.

That is a very naive way to see things, things don't always work that way in hostile situations. People get killed for a large variety of reasons and not always due to their own fault. Plus, you'd be basically punishing people who took a chance and tried to fight against hostile players. The last thing we need is to give people less ability to fight back when attacked, if anything it should those who are defending themselves that should have the upper hand somehow.

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Hm, you also make a good point and I do agree to an extend. Well you are the head admin, you have more experience than I do, so I concede the discussion. However, this leaves me to ask one more question.

You said 
The last thing we need is to give people less ability to fight back when attacked, if anything it should those who are defending themselves that should have the upper hand somehow.

But are they not prone to being reported for NVFL already if they try to retaliate against a bigger group? Mostly situations where hostile RP is initiated, the hostile group is 2-3 times larger than the person/people.

Edited by Shazzzam

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9 minutes ago, Shazzzam said:

Hm, you also make a good point and I do agree to an extend. Well you are the head admin, you have more experience than I do, so I concede the discussion. However, this leaves me to ask one more question.

You said 
The last thing we need is to give people less ability to fight back when attacked, if anything it should those who are defending themselves that should have the upper hand somehow.

But are they not prone to being reported for NVFL already if they try to retaliate against a bigger group? Mostly situations where hostile RP is initiated, the hostile group is 2-3 times larger than the person/people.

NVFL only applies to cases where you are clearly out numbered and still went down fighting.

If you manage to kill a few and run to safety your in the clear if you take on 3 hostiles kill 2 wound the third but still go down then its for the GM team to discuss. In a situation like that in the past we would let it slide as the player was unfortunate not to kill them all. Plus they have to take environment into consideration. Did the player have better cover than the hostile party etc.

Its the reason why video evidence is so important. I dont think we need to be working on when to permadeath that should be down to the character owner to choose. It may not be realistic but this is a game and there has to be a balance.

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Gunshots are survivable, even to the face. Though, the victim should get involved with some serious medical RP asap. (unless it's a real gunshot then forget RP get to a real hospital!) Glitch deaths are a tricky one. I normally pretend they didn't happen, justify my return to the coast with finding some suspicious mushrooms in the forest and eating them (even though memory loss is not part of a mushroom trip but hey) Or my guy found a stash of alcohol and decided to drink the nightmare away. 

The only example I saw that is 100% death no matter how good a surgeon may be is the grenade to the chest. An unobstructed Grenade is 100% lethal up to a distance of 5M (unless behind GOOD cover) If the initial explosion doesn't get you the shrapnel will. Not only that but the chest area contains pretty much every vital organ, besides the brain. The explosive force of a hand grenade to the chest would cause irreparable damage to the heart and lungs (you really really need these to live) the shrapnel will tear everything in the chest cavity to shreds. Death would occur instantaneously. Your ONLY chance to survive a hand grenade to the chest is if it does not explode. Then you will just get a bruise where it hit your chest. Maybe a cracked rib if it was thrown hard enough, or you landed on it too heavily. But grenades are no longer in the game so there's that. 

Personally, I have only died by another player 2 times on this character and for me that's it. Next death is a perma. My character is a loner, so my "recuperation" time is usually spent getting all the stuff I need/want for my character.

But honestly, it all depends. I have not had the opportunity to interact with another player since maybe November (even on a highly populated server I rarely find people on here) and I had to suicide from a glitch since then (logged in under the floor of a house couldn't escape so had to) if there is nobody to RP with then there is only solo rp and that's nowhere near as fun. So yeah unless I encounter anyone ( a rarity for me, like I have met maybe a dozen individual characters in my entire time on server through 3 of my own characters) I tend to just play "Walking simulator 2018" when I get on server. 

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Forcing Perma on people is just a bad, bad idea. People get attached to their characters but to allow someone else to command when and where your character dies (while unrealistic) would be easily abused. We want people to RP and make story lines and arcs with other players and to force someone to start fresh and new each time they get into hostilities is a bad idea. Realism be damned! 

Also, just like Aiko said what if the death has little to no RP in it? You get domed from afar after a hostile action was performed by you/on you and now you have to Perma but it doesn't feel like a good RP death which sucks. We want to focus on the RP element to DayZ and not so much the realism, hence why each time this is brought up it's usually met with heavy criticism. 

Even shelving the character for X amount of days puts a damper on RP. What if you're out and about, get "Killed" and now you have to shelf that character and all your friends have to awkwardly explain why your Character is not around when people ask how you're doing. Even more so, Medical and InjuryRP are still things people love to do! This gives our medicalRP focused players something to constantly work on and provide. The amount of times I've seen injured people get fantastic RP from a MedicalRPer has been amazing and countless and even more so someone providing a lovely injured emote is a RP topic for others to pick up on! These are things we want to see and want to have, and to have to shelf or perma a character due to a hostile action is just preventing this from happening. 

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You talk as if I explained nothing. I never said perma someone because he died. I said perma him if it's absolutely justified by the injuries sustained by roleplay. There is both roleplay in it and the injuries must be beyond any repair of the human body. I'm not talking about one shot, I'm taking about emptying a clip on someone's body for example. Also this is not forcing perma on someone. Neither the attacker nor the victim have a say in this. Only the roleplay may decide of the victim will get killed, mostly depending on the victim's actions. Rolle understood that and he made a fair point to which I agreed, I would ask you to not make empty arguments if you have not comprehended what I tried to say.

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... This, uh... Woulda been a good response under the "tweak it" poll option on my thread. Not mad, just like, in the future feel free to respond to other's topics with alternative suggestions, save making your own brand new one, since there's now two similar suggestions made within 11 hours of one another.

Edit: Oh right I asked people not to talk about permadeath... I'm not a hypocrite, just forgetful, honest.

Edited by Mass

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Whenever one of my characters gets severely injured, I usually bench them from 2 weeks to 2 months... 

For example, when I had a character go on a vendetta-revenge-rampage, and started shooting all the VDV who held him up for his military weapon... he waited for the right moment to quietly killed off the squad one-by-one... unfortunately after shooting first soldier (the officer), a couple minutes later, VDV spotted him with blood on his jacket not to far from the body of their VDV officer... My character was then shot unconscious during a firefight of three other VDV soldiers (whom spotted him). He was taken in by a retired doctor/surgeon who lived nearby and took 1-2 months to recover from multiple non-fatal gunshot wounds. Even after he returnedfrom being "benched" he didn't speak much and didn't go into cities anymore, like he did before. He mainly remained in the woods/traveled through dirt-roads to small vilages--- as he was re-cooperating psychologically as well, not just physically.

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