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Roland

Make DayZRP great again

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@Rolle 

My two cents on some other things.  

Eliminating Dynamic groups.  I don't like this one bit,  it seems like some unnecessarily rule play  and to quote the reason behind it

"used by official group members who go on alts to escape repercussions to their main characters or group and by groups of friends who play together all the time, but do not wish to go through the quality assurance step of creating an official group.
Now, to prevent this I believe that dynamic groups should be removed to prevent this kind of abuse"

Was this really that big of an issue?  Maybe I've been away for too long but that just seems like rules based on a select few instances.  Thumbs down, as dynamic groups are fun.

Require a character page for all characters

I like.  Very nice.  This will get people to think about their characters more +1

***Categorize and balance groups***

-snip- A good decision was made.

Eliminate TS metagaming

Interesting but very very difficult to enforce.  

I would suggest adding if talking on the radio to friends in team speak you also have to use the ingame push to talk so anyone in the surronding area could also hear it.  But yeah if everyone just complied to this it would be a very immersive experience, but they probably won't.

Make dying actually matter

An interesting idea, not sure if it will change how people play, but any consequences surrounding death in my mind is a good idea.

 

 

Edited by Brad

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@Brad things have already been decided after some discussions, see page 4 for the post. I also merged it into the OP for people who don't read the whole thread.

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3 minutes ago, Rolle said:

@Brad things have already been decided after some discussions, see page for for the post. I also merged it into the OP for people who don't read the whole thread.

Would you believe I was actually reading page 4 when I wrote this and just didn't make it to your post?  Well played, and looks like some good decisions!

 

tenor.gif [/spoiler} 

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I went through and decided to do a recount. . . not counting those whom may have spoken directly to El Presidente himself, these are the numbers. 

Rule 1: Remove dynamic groups  

(Ruling based on number of people for or against the rule before the decision made by Rolle on page 4, not including votes afterward)

(Those who only pitched in for one or two aside the main topic of this post or were speaking of other things were left undecided and not counted)

Yay? - 16 votes

Nay! - 38 votes

. . . .is this. . . is this for real? I can't even begin to think. . . I'll let everyone else pitch in however they'd like.

Edited by Pinkerton
My final comment was very unprofessional. I apologize

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More rules limit RP. That's all this really is. Some of these are good ideas, but in the end they really limit RP in a negative way, some worse than the others.

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Guest Roach

@Rolle

After talking with @Pinkerton I've come to realize something.

Dynamic groups.

I am okay with this (have no choice even if I hate it and makes no sense for a dynamic player like myself but I get it), my only issue is Sibling/Family Members. I get that if I find random people that stroll along with me they can't just kill the hostile player holding me up. But what about official siblings or family members? It's kinda stupid if I have to initiate again cause a guy is holding up my brother giving the hostile player a HUGE advantage to my position and most likely will end up killing my brother before I kill the man or he gets to kill me too. And for the slightest of realism sake, I think it would be good to allow this...

So perhaps make an exception to this rule. Siblings/Family members would be allowed to have kill rights, provided they are official (mentioned in the character pages that they are related).

Thoughts?

 

Edited by Roach

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2 minutes ago, Roach said:

@Rolle

After talking with @Pinkerton I've come to realize something.

Dynamic groups.

I am okay with this (have no choice even if I hate it and makes no sense for a dynamic player like myself but I get it), my only issue is Sibling/Family Members. I get that if I find random people that stroll along with me they can't just kill the hostile player holding me up. But what about official siblings or family members? It's kinda stupid if I have to initiate again cause a guy is holding up my brother giving the hostile player a HUGE advantage to my position and most likely will end up killing my brother before I kill the man or he gets to kill me too. And for the slightest of realism sake, I think it would be good to allow this...

So perhaps make an exception to this rule. Siblings/Family members would be allowed to have kill rights, provided they are official (mentioned in the character pages that they are related).

Thoughts?

 

We would then have big, big families rolling around Chernarus :D

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Guest Roach
5 minutes ago, Rolle said:

We would then have big, big families rolling around Chernarus :D

Well had a feeling this would also get shut down... just saying man this rule is not good at all and making me and many others doubt our ability to RP in these situations. I play dynamic and hate groups. But if I cannot even protect my brother in the appropriate manner, I dunno man. think of the hardcore RPers her dude. Siblings should be an exception no matter of the hole loopers. I mean damn, don't us RPers who care get anything?

Basically it's a subtle way for everyone to be forced to join a group :(

Edited by Roach

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3 minutes ago, Roach said:

Well had a feeling this would also get shut down... just saying man this rule is not good at all and making me and many others doubt our ability to RP in these situations. I play dynamic and hate groups. But if I cannot even protect my brother in the appropriate manner, I dunno man. think of the hardcore RPers her dude. Siblings should be an exception no matter of the hole loopers. I mean damn, don't us RPers who care get anything?

Basically it's a subtle way for everyone to be forced to join a group :(

Siblings, friends, long time work associates who brought in donuts for everyone... there is no way you are not going to try and help people like this. Cards on the table, blunt honesty... the rule is a farce on quality RP. It literally shits on it, but it's dumping on it  with good intention to control all the 'shooty shooty bang bang' people. More so it forces you to play outside your character. Now a lot of rules do this, like KOS... (BUT I R A CEREAL KILLER!), but where this rule is concerned, it can literally apply to frickin everyone.

You want good realistic RP? No rule will achieve this, no rule... the only thing that will achieve this is like minded, experienced roleplayers, roleplaying together. For that they need to be taught with the training wheels -off-.

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Guest Roach
Just now, Tony said:

Siblings, friends, long time work associates who brought in donuts for everyone... there is no way you are not going to try and help people like this. Cards on the table, blunt honesty... the rule is a farce on quality RP. It literally shits on it, but it's dumping on it  with good intention to control all the 'shooty shooty bang bang' people. More so it forces you to play outside your character. Now a lot of rules do this, like KOS... (BUT I R A CEREAL KILLER!), but where this rule is concerned, it can literally apply to frickin everyone.

You want good realistic RP? No rule will achieve this, no rule... the only thing that will achieve this is like minded, experienced roleplayers, roleplaying together. For that they need to be taught with the training wheels -off-.

I just feel like this rule will keep all the "campfire RPers" as they are known, even more hidden... I am really starting to feel off with some of the new rules and as much as I am creative, it's putting too many sticks in my wheels. With most of the rules we have in place now (which almost requires a lawyer to look through now) I cannot see myself making seasons here anymore and that is what saddens me the most. I loved making them here, just too many rules (that would get me and has banned some main character of the show in the past) now that come in the way of the RP as I have experienced especially in the prior season. And with my next season being a straight up bad guy, I can just see how it'll end up and how impossible it'll be to do. I will always still play here regardless, cause I love the people and I love RP but my seasons from this point on have to be filmed on a private server due to all the limitations I've had and keep on having. I know some people won't give 2 shits about this, but I care.

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I mean, we don't HAVE TO implement that rule. I don't need it to do what I want to do, I already have rule 4 to remove anyone at anytime who I feel doesn't care about RP. But I thought it would be a nice incentive to push people towards groups. Without this rule change it makes absolutely no sense to go through the effort and create an official group, aside from getting a logo on the website. So the entire group system rests upon the idea that people will want to create groups, which is what this rule would accomplish. You want to get rid of that rule because you won't be able to instantly shoot someone in the face without saying a word, a logic which I feel does not make sense coming from people who care about RP.

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1 minute ago, Rolle said:

I mean, we don't HAVE TO implement that rule. I don't need it to do what I want to do, I already have rule 4 to remove anyone at anytime who I feel doesn't care about RP. But I thought it would be a nice incentive to push people towards groups. Without this rule change it makes absolutely no sense to go through the effort and create an official group, aside from getting a logo on the website. So the entire group system rests upon the idea that people will want to create groups, which is what this rule would accomplish. You want to get rid of that rule because you won't be able to instantly shoot someone in the face without saying a word, a logic which I feel does not make sense coming from people who care about RP.

I have to disagree, Rolle.  Being a group puts you in the official living canon of the community.  Your actions and events have meaning and will be recorded by the Lore Masters.  Plus, you get private comms, visibility, and organization.  This rule was always, for me, a way of eliminating the benefits that alts have.  Looking at the grievances of many dynamic players, though, I can see how it extends beyond that.

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4 minutes ago, Rolle said:

I mean, we don't HAVE TO implement that rule. I don't need it to do what I want to do, I already have rule 4 to remove anyone at anytime who I feel doesn't care about RP. But I thought it would be a nice incentive to push people towards groups. Without this rule change it makes absolutely no sense to go through the effort and create an official group, aside from getting a logo on the website. So the entire group system rests upon the idea that people will want to create groups, which is what this rule would accomplish. You want to get rid of that rule because you won't be able to instantly shoot someone in the face without saying a word, a logic which I feel does not make sense coming from people who care about RP.

Everyone's gonna have different opinions. I am giving a big +1 to removing dynamic groups as it was suggested multiple times by @Voodoo in the past.

However, I am gonna lay down a huge -1 for forcing permadeaths onto people. It will only restrict the RP'ers that care about their character development, planning on keeping their character  for the next god knows how many months & years and it will not at the slightest decrease the PVP rate since those players will be able to create new characters that aren't fleshed out to continue PVP'ing.

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1 minute ago, Rolle said:

I mean, we don't HAVE TO implement that rule. I don't need it to do what I want to do, I already have rule 4 to remove anyone at anytime who I feel doesn't care about RP. But I thought it would be a nice incentive to push people towards groups. Without this rule change it makes absolutely no sense to go through the effort and create an official group, aside from getting a logo on the website. So the entire group system rests upon the idea that people will want to create groups, which is what this rule would accomplish. You want to get rid of that rule because you won't be able to instantly shoot someone in the face without saying a word, a logic which I feel does not make sense coming from people who care about RP.

Rolle you do great things here. That telepathy radio abolishing... I girl screamed, in a good way, a way a man is never supposed to yet it still feels so right.

But this rule is just... out there man. Now I've been in these situations and what I tend to do is move to the side and point a gun at the person and I do not shoot them, I warn them. It's happened more times than I can count and they've dropped the weapon every single time. But that's me. If someone is gonna hold you up and threaten your life, 1 to 2... then it makes perfect sense to shoot them. All it takes is a pull of the trigger and someone is dead, it's that quick. Do you want to take that gamble when it's the life of a brother? A best friend? That hot teacher you've somehow found yourself travelling with you never had a chance with, but now because it's the apocalypse you maybe just might possibly? You're gonna want to eliminate the threat as soon as possible.

I'll milk it for RP if I feel it is safe to, but I can also understand why others would want to be able to save someone they care about. I mean why wouldn't you? Because of an invisible wall? 

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Guest Roach
3 minutes ago, Rolle said:

I mean, we don't HAVE TO implement that rule. I don't need it to do what I want to do, I already have rule 4 to remove anyone at anytime who I feel doesn't care about RP. But I thought it would be a nice incentive to push people towards groups. Without this rule change it makes absolutely no sense to go through the effort and create an official group, aside from getting a logo on the website. So the entire group system rests upon the idea that people will want to create groups, which is what this rule would accomplish. You want to get rid of that rule because you won't be able to instantly shoot someone in the face without saying a word, a logic which I feel does not make sense coming from people who care about RP.

Dude you know you're talking to me, right? You understand I am RP above all thing? It's not about shooting straight up. I RP before anything but if I feel there would be no way to achieve this with the hostile player, I don't wanna have to sit there and watch or initiate and get my family member killed. You know? I get it though Rolle, I totally do. I know why you are doing this on all angles, but it still affects some of us greatly and well that sucks for us. We RP man, we want the RP, but unfortunately, some hostile player MAY not give a shit about "me" wanting the RP.

Anyways, you do what you want man guess we gotta try before we knock it ;) But I dunno about filming at all anymore tho :( 

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Forgive me, but sitting here reading through all of these "adjustments" - I'm finding it incredibly difficult to imagine how I'm supposed to properly immerse myself into any form of role play when we have all of these rule technicalities imprinted in the backs of our minds.

On 7/11/2017 at 10:12 AM, Rolle said:

Now, to prevent this I believe that dynamic groups should be removed to prevent this kind of abuse.

If i am traveling together with a guy for several weeks through great natural RP interaction; then out of nowhere that same guy suddenly gets a gun pointed in his face and my first instinctual reaction is to raise a gun in his defense, why on earth would I not do everything in my power to save his life or not BE ALLOWED to try and save his life? Why should there be some magical outside force to prevent me from acting on this hostility? I don't call that "abuse" at all whatsoever; I call it role play. I've developed actual friendship and attachment to this person and care for his survival. The only abuse I see is in the fact that I have to stand there and allow it to happen.

On 7/11/2017 at 10:12 AM, Rolle said:

I know that this may create situations where a random you met in game and befriended gets initiated on and you can do nothing about it but to initiate back, however I believe that this is the lesser evil than keeping the dynamic groups as they are.

I honestly think you overestimate the power that established groups have in this community and UNDERESTIMATE how many people roll around dynamically LOOKING for dynamic interaction. I personally do not enjoy groups; they tend to be 90% drama and 10% role play. Ergo, I much prefer rolling dynamic with a few close friends where it's all strictly in character interaction and nothing to do with the forums. Removing dynamics isn't the lesser of two evils; it's a full on jab of diminishing role play itself.

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3 hours ago, Buddy said:

Forgive me, but sitting here reading through all of these "adjustments" - I'm finding it incredibly difficult to imagine how I'm supposed to properly immerse myself into any form of role play when we have all of these rule technicalities imprinted in the backs of our minds.

If i am traveling together with a guy for several weeks through great natural RP interaction; then out of nowhere that same guy suddenly gets a gun pointed in his face and my first instinctual reaction is to raise a gun in his defense, why on earth would I not do everything in my power to save his life or not BE ALLOWED to try and save his life? Why should there be some magical outside force to prevent me from acting on this hostility? I don't call that "abuse" at all whatsoever; I call it role play. I've developed actual friendship and attachment to this person and care for his survival. The only abuse I see is in the fact that I have to stand there and allow it to happen.

I honestly think you overestimate the power that established groups have in this community and UNDERESTIMATE how many people roll around dynamically LOOKING for dynamic interaction. I personally do not enjoy groups; they tend to be 90% drama and 10% role play. Ergo, I much prefer rolling dynamic with a few close friends where it's all strictly in character interaction and nothing to do with the forums. Removing dynamics isn't the lesser of two evils; it's a full on jab of diminishing role play itself.

Dynamics are a standard of this community and the few (a small minority of interactions at best) bad uses of dynamic rules a week are worth the other interactions. Compared to 100's of interactions other than the bad ones that create plenty of good RP that makes sense.

What Buddy said for once I could not have said any better. @Rolle do not make these changes to dynamic groups. If you do YOU will be the only one behind these changes and THAT is what I see here and everywhere else.

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No, no no, no, and no.  I agree with some of these things like making dying matter, and having to get groups approved, but having to have your character be apart of a group?  Naw.  Also the dynamic part.  Say we make a character that is the brother of another character, if we're just rolling around the two of us, and one gets held up or attacked, common sense would dictate that the brother would do whatever it took to save his brother's life.  So thus being said, I don't want to have to be apart of a group just for my character to help his brother out if he is attacked.  Just my two cents.

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I think I've seen the outcome of what most everybody wants. So I guess I can say that if between the time (if it's even being thought about) this rule is taken out, or even if it's kept. You may see me in the report thread for . . . I'm guessing the title of the report would be "Brother shoots me because I put a gun to his brother and didn't say anything before he shot me" Server time and the man's allies to follow. . .

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I dislike all of these rules,  especially 4. having a bunch of oligarchs decide if me robbing someone is "appropriate" has never sat well with me and never will. 

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Very late to this thread but yeah, not entirely sure about removing dynamic groups, but I'm definitely against the permadeathing rule. Phoenix p.much sums most of my argument up, I don't wanna be forced to permadeath a character especially when there's development to be had. The other thing for me is that when I play on a pub server or something, I ran from Elektro to Cherno and died of hunger in 40 minutes of gameplay, seems a bit harsh to be kicked if this happened in the RP server, there's just still the element of accidental/non-rp deaths.

Having said that I kinda see where you're coming from with that rule idea, not naming names but I remember seeing certain characters missing like 2 limbs and having loads of scars and injuries but somehow they're still alive

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So, @Rolle, if we're getting rid of dynamic groups are we also getting rid of the ability for others to abuse them? I feel like your use of the word abuse only applied to the dynamic itself and not to the groups who have used a dynamic to kill individuals in the nearby area of effective roleplay based on an assumption. I've never even heard of this being abused, to be honest. A person who is an unknown factor in a dynamic or official group should be able to rescue someone based on the care for that person who has been initiated on. Especially if we're going to start encouraging and enforcing the use of IC radios to the extent of actually searching people for them. Say you know someone in the area and you've been rolling around with them for a sense of security, friend and companion, family member or other form of dynamic, you'll rescue them, right? Would you really be so cold-hearted as to leave your friend to bite the bullet of what's been dealt? I think what you're assuming here is that a dynamic abuse is 15-20 people rolling around and calling themselves a dynamic instead of registering as a group. That's not what I'm talking about. I'm talking about 2-5 friends who decide they have a really good time together, don't really jive with larger groups or large numbers of people, but still have the warm-blooded sense and sizable enough heart to say, "Holy shit, my friend is in danger. I'm going to help him!"

There are quite a number of people, as shown in the number of people who were counted out as being the overwhelming majority of votes against it (being over 2/3 majority 38-16), who enjoy this form of RP and I guarantee that no one just rolls around saying "Well shit, let's not become official so we can fuck people over in a firefight via rule play".

As for the IC radio use, if they don't surrender the item in game and it's later discovered that they have one on their person can they then be dealt with as non-compliant? This, of course, is assuming that roleplay is no longer an option and they've summoned a force to be reckoned with to aid them either via metagaming inaudible messages or just leaving their mics open and dropping subtle hints so they can be followed and you're already taking shots from said group.

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Let me play this scenario out so you can see why this is a little bit silly

"Hey friend, we've been traveling together for weeks and have been growing close to one another...I consider you my brother in this harsh wasteland, you ever need anything come and ask m-"

Friend gets gun pointed in his face by a bandit.

"Oh lordy jesus if only someone could help me! IF ONLY SOMEONE WHO HAD A PERSONAL INVESTMENT IN ME AS A HUMAN BEING WHOM I HAVE FORGED A BOND WITH COULD SAVE ME FROM THIS MORTAL COIL. ALAS, SUCH IS NOT THE WAY OF THE WORLD."

You then proceed to abandon that guy, because dynamic groups have been shagged to the shadow realm. 

Realism at it's finest right?

 

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On 7/24/2017 at 10:00 AM, Rolle said:

You want to get rid of that rule because you won't be able to instantly shoot someone in the face without saying a word, a logic which I feel does not make sense coming from people who care about RP.

Its sillier for you to not shoot the people trying to rob your friends in a rp sense. 

 

You merely adopted the anime, I was born and molded by it, also you have shit taste.

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On 25-7-2017 at 11:56 AM, LewellynMoss said:

Let me play this scenario out so you can see why this is a little bit silly

"Hey friend, we've been traveling together for weeks and have been growing close to one another...I consider you my brother in this harsh wasteland, you ever need anything come and ask m-"

Friend gets gun pointed in his face by a bandit.

"Oh lordy jesus if only someone could help me! IF ONLY SOMEONE WHO HAD A PERSONAL INVESTMENT IN ME AS A HUMAN BEING WHOM I HAVE FORGED A BOND WITH COULD SAVE ME FROM THIS MORTAL COIL. ALAS, SUCH IS NOT THE WAY OF THE WORLD."

You then proceed to abandon that guy, because dynamic groups have been shagged to the shadow realm. 

Realism at it's finest right?

 

I have been thinking about this situation for the last couple of days.

What is stopping you (in this particular case) from initiating on the bandit in question?
You have a valid reason as well, someone is threatening the life of your buddy. Sure, you don't get to gun down said person on the spot. You should however be allowed to initiate back.

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