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The Traveler

Permadeath Permissions: What would have you give em someone?

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So it's your boy Traveler with yet another forum post :P

Perma Death: It's something we all take quite seriously when considering it OOC and IC... 

My question to you is, if another person asked you via // something along the lines of "//Due to X reason, my character has IC reasons to have a need to kill you, are you comfterble with a permadeath of your character? " what would the "X reason" have to be for you to be cool with it. 

Personally if it was a cool part of an arc of said executor (e.g: A long standing feud that had just had a massive crescendo of a confrontation, they need my head for a very very important bounty, part of an initiation ritual to find someone who's wronged you and end their lives ect ect) I'd be pretty chill with it :) .

So yeah... what would your "X" be? 

Edited by The Traveler

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6 minutes ago, Hebee said:

I think it would be more of a deal, such as if you were to say "//I'll stop spamming threads if you permadeath your character" I would say yes. ;)

I concur Heebs.

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I mean //permission to execute and //permission to perm you are kinda two different things. If it was a 2nd hostile encounter and followed execution rules then sure, execute me. I might perm for this if the RP is good enough. But it would take a lasting conflict and quality RP and reasoning to permadeath.

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I've only permed if the excusion played out in a sensible way. Izaak's death was a buildup of tension from all the conflict he and his group had been in that lead to him becoming paranoid and culminating with him turning on his own and paying the price. While this was pre planned, if he had been captured by any long time rival or opponent in a war I would have perma'd off that. Same applies for all my characters. 

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I wouldn't perm any of my characters because the initiator needs it for his story. I will perm my character when I think the time is right and then by someone who deserves the kill. Not a randomer

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My conduct as a roleplayer means that if I am ever in cuffs, about to be executed, that the kill is merited.  I won't lessen my quality as a roleplayer by running around looting in Stary a day later after getting my head cut off. No band-aid is going to fix that. I won't perma from a firefight, but if you legit execute me with solid realistic grounds... I am very much... dead. 

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22 minutes ago, Spartan said:

I wouldn't perm any of my characters because the initiator needs it for his story. I will perm my character when I think the time is right and then by someone who deserves the kill. Not a randomer

I get that entirely. I think the sorta example is, massive feud, guys gets dragged into it all on a trial of sorts... his test? Get the head of Enemy X? 

Now how in god's name do you get execution rights, take the bloke or lass' head to the group, and then a few days later the same group finds the guy or gal they have the head propped on a spike somewhere back at camp running around looking for loot in stary? :P

I mean if a group has gotten into so much stuff with your character that they literally have a test for a guy to get your head, would that be enough to justify a perma? 

If not, then how would you resolve the magical cloning head? I mean you can't say the dude who got the head is a liar, that's a bit unfair on the dude as he did legit manage to get the right person, ya can't say it's someone who looks , talks and acts like the person and has the same name, that's not jumping the shark, that's jumping the whole god damned ocean. 

As someone who's been around for a butt tonne of time, how;d you suggest situations like this go? :D

(As a personal note: The problem mentioned above is why I really really think execution should = perma death BUUUUUUUUT you can only execute if you get rights from the person just as how you need rights to perma death now... I mean come on now... what in the hell is the point of executing someone if they arn't gonna stay dead ---> For record that is a gripe at executioners, not at people who do not give perma death rights.) 

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The only reasons there are for me to perma kill my character is long lasting Hostile RP between me and my executer. Exemples : Marco Cappadona (First character) was perma killed by some members of the French Foreign Legion and Roger Leboria. I had a long lasting conflict with the FFL and Roger was hunting me down so I permed cause it was a good hunting. 

Michael Jobin (Second character) was permed by his old biker gang brothers, The Pagans because he left them like a coward and tried to rat the Pres to the Pres of another Biker gang, The Rough Riders. The RR's Pres told the Pagans Pres about my offer and Michael got caught by the Pagans and executed. Perfect scenario. I wasn't expecting to get tortured and killed that night. 

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Really there isn't any particular circumstances that would make me perma a character. It's all at the end of the day up to me if I wish to perma a character. If I've felt they have outlived their usefulness it's going to be hit or miss if I perma death.

I sometimes do however set very specific requirements that if met I'll perma. For instance I would have permaed my first character if I died in a firefight defending a compound to the last man. Think les mis and the barricade. That's what I had in mind.

 

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Perming is something I would do, however only when I feel my chars time is in, or if me and the person has a loooong history of encounters and I feel like I would like to perm said person.

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I've permadeathed a few characters. 

Rosy Lecter - Became infected with the virus and having Matt Brown shoot her before she attacked him.

Riviaira - A girl who finally became hearing ticks about her stockholm syndrome, tried running as far away from the person she was protecting only to crash down rocks into her death.

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I stick with the concept: I died in game? Then my character died too. No matter how he died (apart from glitches) it is game over for him. A bit like ironman mode, this in my opinion forces you to play very carefully and consider your every move thus immersing you in the character even more.

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The problem is the vast majority aren't willing to face IC consequences. If someone goes around acting hostile robbing 24/7 there is no consequence. you might get unlucky and die once in a while but it means nothing, you can just respawn and your friends will give you back your gear.

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I will permadeath 99% of the time. If it makes zero sense whatsoever then I won't, but otherwise it's the apocalypse, death is everywhere don't expect to survive.

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I personally Perma my characters just from a normal execution, I think of it as a bit of a motivation to give good RP and not be a GearRper or just an overly aggressive person (although it makes sense in certain situations). I would however prefer it be something along the lines of "You betrayed my trust and left me for dead" I don't know really, Rico doesn't have too many bounties on his head.

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Anyone can perma any of my characters at any point in time, provided they earn it with proper RP and backstory. My dream for one of my characters is killing off @Otter 's Jim Recker, but my character is also of zero import to anything on the server or Recker himself for that matter, so I wouldn't expect rights to be his end since the backstory only really exists for my character and not his; I was just another random victim he never had to bother thinking about again, but to my character he's the devil.
Twist that around and put my baby boy Coy on the other side, and I'd probably not accept a perma on my character on those grounds. However, had there been at least some IC stories on the forums that made the hatred obvious on at least an OOC level, I'd probably be fine with it.

In that same regard, my other character (who likely won't see much more playtime before the wipe) wants to wipe out @C-J for some bad blood. Say CJ found out about this IC and wanted to make sure Francis was taken out before he had the chance to snuff him out. I would agree to that in a heartbeat because it makes sense to me that their shared history can end that way.

Hell, if the story of a character grabs me enough and they catch a character of mine in-game, I'll let them gag me with a chainsaw, no problem at all.

 

tl;dr: If it makes sense to me, anyone can permakill me at any time.

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A very, very, very long and well developed story line between my character and theirs, and a very well drawn out and lengthy RP session before the permadeath.

Unless it's a throwaway character or an alt. Then I give permadeath permissions like it's free.

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Did you manage to catch me complying? Are you a good rp'er? Do I know your character and does your character know me and we have a history. Yea sure perma my ass

Edited by Undead

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I'd permakill my character only if it in the first place makes a good enough RP sense and the situation fits (I have some history with the person who is killing me and a long one), good RP and not some random hey boy I kill you now and the last would be just my decision if my chars time is done or not.

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On ‎5‎/‎24‎/‎2017 at 6:50 PM, Tony said:

My conduct as a roleplayer means that if I am ever in cuffs, about to be executed, that the kill is merited.  I won't lessen my quality as a roleplayer by running around looting in Stary a day later after getting my head cut off. No band-aid is going to fix that. I won't perma from a firefight, but if you legit execute me with solid realistic grounds... I am very much... dead. 

This is actually a very sensible approach to the whole thing in my opinion. When it comes to Execution and Perma, there seems to be a very fine line that many do not consider in terms of VoL/VFL (Value of Life/Value for Life).

More often than not, I have seen several scenarios where someone would roll into town fully geared out to the teeth and talk trash only to be run out. 15-30 minutes later they would return with below par gear than what hey originally started with and engage in a fire fight with the parties they originally had verbal disputes with and die in said showdown only to return later that day or the next day and do the entire thing over again.

I personally believe that within reason, and fair RP, that if you do something IC that the consequences of your actions would merit someone to end your life (not execute/wound you) then you have brought it on yourself.

Prime example: If you walk into say.. Elektro and encounter a group of survivors which in turn you then threaten them or wound one of their own and run off. IF you are caught (logically you would not return for some time out of fear of repercussions) and they choose to execute you, then you have brought that onto your self.

While some may see this as Power Gaming, the reaction of the aggressor could in its own way  be seen as Rule Gaming using a safety system of sorts to your advantage to be a cunt without true reason.

If you wish to destroy someone, raise a force to do so. If they have 15 allies to offer them support, you bring 30 (these are random numbers, just an example). 

 

"He was given power to make war against the Saints and to conquer them. And he was given authority over every Tribe, People, Language and Nation..." ~ Rev 13:7

 

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-User has been warned for this post-

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1 minute ago, Beni said:

Mate you're four months late. 

That may be so, but this seems to be a topic discussed quite often during server downtime among many players New and Veterans of the server from what I have seen and listened in on.

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1 hour ago, Misuteri_Hakurei said:

This is actually a very sensible approach to the whole thing in my opinion. When it comes to Execution and Perma, there seems to be a very fine line that many do not consider in terms of VoL/VFL (Value of Life/Value for Life).

More often than not, I have seen several scenarios where someone would roll into town fully geared out to the teeth and talk trash only to be run out. 15-30 minutes later they would return with below par gear than what hey originally started with and engage in a fire fight with the parties they originally had verbal disputes with and die in said showdown only to return later that day or the next day and do the entire thing over again.

I personally believe that within reason, and fair RP, that if you do something IC that the consequences of your actions would merit someone to end your life (not execute/wound you) then you have brought it on yourself.

Prime example: If you walk into say.. Elektro and encounter a group of survivors which in turn you then threaten them or wound one of their own and run off. IF you are caught (logically you would not return for some time out of fear of repercussions) and they choose to execute you, then you have brought that onto your self.

While some may see this as Power Gaming, the reaction of the aggressor could in its own way  be seen as Rule Gaming using a safety system of sorts to your advantage to be a cunt without true reason.

If you wish to destroy someone, raise a force to do so. If they have 15 allies to offer them support, you bring 30 (these are random numbers, just an example). 

 

"He was given power to make war against the Saints and to conquer them. And he was given authority over every Tribe, People, Language and Nation..." ~ Rev 13:7

 

When I said that it wasn't so much about value for life... (as there is none, you're dead lol) as it was for respect for the roleplay world, the realism and the environment other people are in.  It's putting the community immersion before yourself as a roleplayer, because honestly it doesn't take long to make up another character sheet and sure there is character attachment, but using OOC means to gain control of this attachment tarnishes the realism and credibility of not only your own roleplay conduct, but the world you are playing in itself. Bottom line, in my personal view... it cheapens the roleplay over all.

This is my personal stance, my personal view. I have a very hardcore approach that is by all accounts a learned behaviour and I am too damn old to change it now, but it's something I do not expect other people to do, but I respect the people who do it. If it makes sense... go with the flow yo.  After all , it isn't winning, it isn't losing... it's story telling, however it's shared story telling. You are not the only writer and everyone has to make it a good story. So when one persons claws in the collective rights to suit themselves... it's not a good story.  It's pure... unadulterated... cheese. 

You get my ass in handcuffs you're gonna have the best victim roleplay on your hands because I am gonna say and do anything to get out of it, without that invisible wall protecting me. It's a very... liberating play style as I feel it unshackles you and lets you play to your all. It's risk factor, a very real risk factor when you'll consent to virtually anything, with the only ground rule being that it makes sense. You give me good roleplay and I'll straight up give your free reign.  This doesn't mean submission to people going bat shit for bat shits sake to make themselves look cool... this means one credible roleplayer to another. 

Edited by Tony

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If you gat me in a firefights, I'll perm. Doesn't need to be an execution. I'll die as one of the grunts and be happy with it. As for the execution question...Sometimes you just need a person removed temporarily from a situation. An easy way this is done is through body or leg shots until they die. That way they can realistically be like "Oh yeah, I had armor on." Or "Thank the Lord those only grazed." If they perm. Neat. If not, then you can chalk it up as a random group member of theirs or that your shots were a bit off.

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