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Server time: 2018-08-15, 04:54 WE ARE RECRUITING

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Viking

What has this come to?

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2 minutes ago, Brad said:

The way to move forward from this is indeed for staff to change.

But not with the whole team being replaced but with a new mindset.

Did people go over the top?  Yes.  In same cases it was pretty fucking shameful.

But at the end of the day tensions hit a boiling point where a great deal of the people who were banned could not see improvement for months and months on end.

And then there was a chicken nugget.  That took out a community member who had been an admin, who had spent time dedicating his fucking life to this server.  Had he earned some points in the past?  Yep.  But at the end of the day a decision was made where instead of staff asking him to knock it off, to take the joke and say, "stop or youre out", to give him a chance, they removed him.  

What followed was a list of people who no longer want to play on a server where the tolerance level is quite frankly zero.  

Does the community as a whole have some growing up to do?  Yes.  Is staff work difficult?  Fuck yes.

But my direct and honest feedback to the staff team right now is, you are the weakest this community has even seen.  Not only in knowledge for the game but also for you understanding of what this community is.  This community needs leadership and in its current state, this staff team has failed.

Take that as offensively as you want.  After all if you dont believe it, thats your opinion.   But at the end of the day it's a fucking challenge.  To do better.  To be better.

If you lead by example the community will be bettered.  If we continue on this current course, quite frankly we're screwed.  

People have said multiple times "this is the cycle" this is how it happens.  Lets break from this cycle and do what this community was meant for.  

Have a little fun.

Otherwise that cycle is going to make us extinct.

I don't agree with all said here, but do agree with a good portion of it. The parts about staff, yeah, could be true. We ain't perfect.

But, in respect to this particular situation and others, a member was placed on final warning, which is typically that "knock it off" message. We are all adults and responsible for our own actions, whatever those actions may be.

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13 minutes ago, shookyaaa said:

I'd rather you not use the lord's name in vain please. Please learn how to articulate better and refrain from using that sort of vocabulary since it does offend people

I am offended by people believing in a fairytale. Anyway Hail Satan and Hebi is right, language policing has to stop.

About the new staff team: Would be a bad idea imo, but I agree that it would help to switch out a few. It is no secret that some are more active than others, but getting a new one entirely seems like you grab a bunch of people and throw them into the cold water. 

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1 minute ago, Brad said:

There.

Right there. Is the problem.

Please for the love of all that is holy.  Sit back and think about what you just said.

If you can't think outside the box.  If you can't think about the people who play here as anything more that numbers in the server code.  Then you are not a leader.  You are a drone.

 

Taking it a little bit far there, imo.  Do you honestly expect every rule break to involve a sit down and a chat?  That has never been the way it works.  Sometimes staff give the opportunity of a verbal warning or an actual talking to.  Could they give more of those opportunities?  Sure.  They could, but why only recently in my 4 years of being here is it now a problem that staff be a tad bit more compassionate when it comes to upholding the forum rules, and start granting people more verbals and talks.  You read the rules when you join this community.  It is up to staff to inform the community of any rule changes, otherwise, you are expected to know the rules of the community that you are apart of.

People know better.

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Just now, Oliv said:

Rule breaks have always been handled the following way:

  1. The possible rule break is spotted by staff or reported to staff.
  2. The possible rule break is discussed.
  3. If found to be a rule break, it is pointed.

There is rarely times where we talk to the person who has broken said rule, whatever it may be. This is the way it works.

if you're discussing giving someone points because what they said is in a grey area, why not discuss it with that community member? A swift poke in ts, or PM on the forums. Just ask said community member to re-word their post, or they will receive points.

If someone does a clear as day, intentional flame, then point the person. But if it's in a grey area, why not just discuss it with the community member? If that had happened with Echo, perhaps the community would have 100 more members then it does today.

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If the situation is a straight forward 'this person is flaming' scenario, then of course, you don't have to talk to the person. But if there is more too it, It can be helpful to talk to those involved first in order to avoid unnecessary points and bans. Echo was on a final, yes. He posted something that resembled a penis, yes. But you could have simply messaged him and warned him that he's crossing the line a little. I'm sure he would have stopped. I know you have to follow protocol and all that, but its always best to be a human rather than a robot.

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1 minute ago, Oliv said:

I don't agree with all said here, but do agree with a good portion of it. The parts about staff, yeah, could be true. We ain't perfect.

But, in respect to this particular situation and others, a member was placed on final warning, which is typically that "knock it off" message. We are all adults and responsible for our own actions, whatever those actions may be.

I'm perfectly aware of what a final warning means.

And im perfectly aware that in the past when someone has been on a final warning we take that into account as "is this deserving of final removal from this community"  

You've snipped things before that were borderline and this chicken nugget was the VERY definition of borderline.  But frankly whats done is done we could argue that until we're blue in the face.

My point in this is show some heart.  The last thing you want is people giving staff the reputation of a police state rather than a group of leaders who teach by example and hand out punishments to those who can't learn from their mistakes.

 

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2 minutes ago, Brad said:

I'm perfectly aware of what a final warning means.

And im perfectly aware that in the past when someone has been on a final warning we take that into account as "is this deserving of final removal from this community"  

You've snipped things before that were borderline and this chicken nugget was the VERY definition of borderline.  But frankly whats done is done we could argue that until we're blue in the face.

My point in this is show some heart.  The last thing you want is people giving staff the reputation of a police state rather than a group of leaders who teach by example and hand out punishments to those who can't learn from their mistakes.

 

I'm not going to argue that either, or if it was or wasn't worth the points. Besides points for fried chicken, as I've said in other threads, everything else that followed can't be undone and I think we both agree on that.

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8 minutes ago, Cid said:

Taking it a little bit far there, imo.  Do you honestly expect every rule break to involve a sit down and a chat?  That has never been the way it works.  Sometimes staff give the opportunity of a verbal warning or an actual talking to.  Could they give more of those opportunities?  Sure.  They could, but why only recently in my 4 years of being here is it now a problem that staff be a tad bit more compassionate when it comes to upholding the forum rules, and start granting people more verbals and talks.  You read the rules when you join this community.  It is up to staff to inform the community of any rule changes, otherwise, you are expected to know the rules of the community that you are apart of.

People know better.

Maybe that was never they way YOU worked Cid.  But I know plenty of previous staff members who have worked in that way.

Things aren't cut and dry.  The rules are there but when you get into grey areas of chicken nuggets, you simply CANNOT tell me a little bit of discussion isn't warranted.

 

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Just now, Cid said:

Taking it a little bit far there, imo.  Do you honestly expect every rule break to involve a sit down and a chat?  That has never been the way it works.  Sometimes staff give the opportunity of a verbal warning or an actual talking to.  Could they give more of those opportunities?  Sure.  They could, but why only recently in my 4 years of being here is it now a problem that staff be a tad bit more compassionate when it comes to upholding the forum rules, and start granting people more verbals and talks.  You read the rules when you join this community.  It is up to staff to inform the community of any rule changes, otherwise, you are expected to know the rules of the community that you are apart of.

People know better.

stop living in the past

this community needs to change, that's what the threads about.

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Just now, Oliv said:

I'm not going to argue that either, or if it was or wasn't worth the points. Besides points for fried chicken, as I've said in other threads, everything else that followed can't be undone and I think we both agree on that.

Yes.

My only hope is that staff doesn shrug this off as another "cycle" . 

Over 100 people is not just another cycle.  What if next time is 200? 1000?  Where does this become unacceptable

Staff needs to take this is a failure and not solely on their part but as , what can we do to improve scenerio.  

 

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1 minute ago, Brad said:

Maybe that was never they way YOU worked Cid.  But I know plenty of previous staff members who have worked in that way.

Things aren't cut and dry.  The rules are there but when you get into grey areas of chicken nuggets, you simply CANNOT tell me a little bit of discussion isn't warranted.

 

There is a difference between a chicken nugget and a chicken nugget in the shape of genitals.  Believe it or not there are places in this world where that would be deemed as NSFW.

I'm not questioning whether or not there have been staff members that talk to people about warnings, I was just stating that it has never been the way it worked regarding to all warnings, which is the way it seems like a lot of people want it to work.  It is the community members responsibility to know and understand the rules.  Rule 1.5 covers NSFW content, and yes, there are work places that would consider something penis shaped - whether it was a chicken nugget or something else, NSFW.

Echo has common sense, he understood the rules, and he was on final warning.  He should have known better, as should any other community member who is looking to post something penis shaped.  That's simply my opinion on it.  I don't believe this was something that warranted a simple snip and a shame on you.  He was on a final warning.  He already got his shame on you.

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3 minutes ago, Brad said:

Yes.

My only hope is that staff doesn shrug this off as another "cycle" . 

Over 100 people is not just another cycle.  What if next time is 200? 1000?  Where does this become unacceptable

Staff needs to take this is a failure and not solely on their part but as , what can we do to improve scenerio.  

 

I can't speak for all staff, but for me this isn't another cycle. This is fucking shit is what it is.

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22 minutes ago, Cid said:

There is a difference between a chicken nugget and a chicken nugget in the shape of genitals

Not true

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1 minute ago, Castiel said:

Not true

I agree, it depends on how dirty your mind is. 

I mean even if it was a nugget in the form of genitals... everyone has seen a penis or a vagina in his life ( whether it's a real one, a pornstar's or your precious pocket pussy) . Getting punished for posting a picture of a phallic/genitalia shaped chicken nugget is kinda ridiculous imo...

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25 minutes ago, Cid said:

Echo has common sense, he understood the rules, and he was on final warning.  He should have known better, as should any other community member who is looking to post something penis shaped.

 
 

Everyone with common sense can realise that a chicken nugget in form of a penis is not NSFW.

Also, this is the chicken nugget that got Echo the 3 points. Open the spoiler at your own discretion.

Spoiler

3319F4P.png

 

 

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46 minutes ago, Cid said:

Echo has common sense, he understood the rules, and he was on final warning.  He should have known better, as should any other community member who is looking to post something penis shaped.  That's simply my opinion on it.  I don't believe this was something that warranted a simple snip and a shame on you.  He was on a final warning.  He already got his shame on you.

'The rules should be followed regardless of context, meaning, logic or reason. I don't even know the meaning of the rules anymore, I just enforce them because I'm some kind of rollebot.' 

That post you made sucked up more to staff than a cheap hooker on a Friday night, definitely more any post I've ever seen in my time here. It's like you think they can do literally no wrong.

Maybe... and this is a pretty radical idea, staff should like... look at things and consider them and talk to the offender, maybe the offended party too (oh wait there was none), rather than blindly enforcing the rules. But hey like 'others' have said, I've barely been here anyway so what do I know.

Edited by Rabbit
wasn't harsh enough... could probably do better... that's a bit better still

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24 minutes ago, Cid said:

There is a difference between a chicken nugget and a chicken nugget in the shape of genitals.  Believe it or not there are places in this world where that would be deemed as NSFW.

I'm not questioning whether or not there have been staff members that talk to people about warnings, I was just stating that it has never been the way it worked regarding to all warnings, which is the way it seems like a lot of people want it to work.  It is the community members responsibility to know and understand the rules.  Rule 1.5 covers NSFW content, and yes, there are work places that would consider something penis shaped - whether it was a chicken nugget or something else, NSFW.

Echo has common sense, he understood the rules, and he was on final warning.  He should have known better, as should any other community member who is looking to post something penis shaped.  That's simply my opinion on it.  I don't believe this was something that warranted a simple snip and a shame on you.  He was on a final warning.  He already got his shame on you.

Jesus fucking christ (By the way I'm fucking Catholic so fuck a jesus christ) Cid, It's a fucking nugget.  This is supposed to be a GAMING community where people come to have FUN and play FUCKING video games.  Stop being a goddamn Rollebot and think - was anyone actually being harmed? The site? A jab at some person? Idk man - I'm shocked that you think someone should getting permd for a fucking chicken nugget in the shape of a penis. 

As another note:

I think a lot of the problems would go away if people were forced to talk to one another. The attitude of - if you think something is wrong, report it is the exact problem people are facing.  Force people to talk and communicate with eachother.  When Staff gives out warnings or drops a final warning; ask to speak with them in TS about the final warning and try to get to the heart of the issue. The rules should be placeholders, judged with human insight; not an eternal law itself.  This mentality is what's gotten the community in the state it is.

But what can I say, @Rolle doesn't see it as a problem, so why should we?  He's led the community this long and if he says he knows what is just and holy, we should be inclined tto believe him.  

Hopefully one day we can just play video games, and stay away from the bitter-sweet demon known as drama.  

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I agree with Oliv on this. It isn't just another cycle that will be shrugged off in a few months.

 Take a look at the forums, reports thrown up  for simple things that are easy to talk out. Insults thrown through out the community at different members for whatever reason, and groups who have taken things too far. Who cant differentiate between IC and OOC  leading to a mass amounts of OOC hate. 

I've been here since 2014 and if i'm one hundred percent honest, we've lost the "Community" feeling. Its easy to just lay all the blame on the staff team and don't get me wrong there are things we have done wrong and we do have to fix. But we aren't solely responsible. If we are to pull through this then everyone needs to grow up, take responsibility, and work in an attempt to fix the problems. 

That means don't point fingers, work things out by talking rather then just throwing up a report and just bickering for 20+ pages straight. Start acting like a fucking community for the first time in awhile. We will work on our end to fix what we can but you all need to work on yours. That's the only way we will get past this in my opinion. 

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11 minutes ago, Ark said:

That means don't point fingers, work things out by talking rather then just throwing up a report and just bickering for 20+ pages straight. Start acting like a fucking community for the first time in awhile. We will work on our end to fix what we can but you all need to work on yours. That's the only way we will get past this in my opinion. 

The thing is Ark.  It starts with staff.  The community isn't going to organize a "lets become a community again party" 

It begins with you.  You guys cant be over there "fixing things" hoping the community will sort itself out (and I realize I'm exaggerating but you know what I mean)

Don't get me wrong your points regarding talking it out, and not putting 20 pages up is super valid.  But people need to be encouraged to do that.  

And I'm not talking about babysitting but I am talking about a friendly "have you guys chatted in TS about this yet?" could go along way.

Anyways, you guys need to lead by example to pull this thing out of a nosedive.

People will latch on to that and you'll see a change.

Whats that saying? Be the change you want to see? (Anyone else miss Terra Ban Appeal quotes?)

Know what I mean?

Edited by Brad

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13 minutes ago, Volke said:

But what can I say, @Rolle doesn't see it as a problem, so why should we?  He's led the community this long and if he says he knows what is just and holy, we should be inclined tto believe him.  

The captain isn't jumping off the ship so why should we?

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2 minutes ago, Major Tom said:

The captain isn't jumping off the ship so why should we?

Because there are Somalian pirates on the horizon.

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11 minutes ago, Volke said:

Because there are Somalian pirates on the horizon.

ocpsHUT.gif

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16 minutes ago, Volke said:

Because there are Somalian pirates on the horizon.

Did you even watch Captain Phillips? The captain kicked everyone else the fuck off the boat and stayed. 

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4 minutes ago, Andrey said:

ocpsHUT.gif

Jesus fucking christ

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3 minutes ago, Brad said:

The thing is Ark.  It starts with staff.  The community isn't going to organize a "lets become a community again party" 

It begins with you.  You guys cant be over there "fixing things" hoping the community will sort itself out (and I realize I'm exaggerating but you know what I mean)

Don't get me wrong your points regarding talking it out, and not putting 20 pages up is super valid.  But people need to be encouraged to do that.  

And I'm not talking about babysitting but I am talking about a friendly "have you guys chatted in TS about this yet?" could go along way.

Anyways, you guys need to lead by example to pull this thing out of a nosedive.

People will latch on to that and you'll see a change.

Whats that saying? Be the change you want to see?

Know what I mean

I know what you mean Brad.

It isnt just going to start off on its own, and we will have to be the ones who start everything off for the most part. But there is only so much we can do, the rest falls to the community. Whenever a report gets thrown up or someone comes to ts looking for who killed them, its up to us to point them in the right direction like you said and encourage them to work things out on their own.

However after that there is little we can do. in the end its a you can bring a horse to water but you cant make it drink moment. If everyone placed themselves in the other parties shoes before making a report, there would be a lot less. Just a simple "if i were on the other side in this situation how would i react, would i do the same thing?" goes along way. 

In the end i know what your saying we need to step up and be the leaders and start this. But people also need to learn how to let things go, and realize its easy to make a mistake and we all do.

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