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Something that been bothering me recently with hostilities

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Post    0

"If your friends shoot at us we're going to kill you."

This sentence. I just can't get behind this logic from a roleplay standpoint or real-world. I think this is properly the worst approach to roleplay of anything because it's essentially protecting you from also forces despite wrongdoing, but worse than that it's literally incriminating someone's capabilities and roleplay based purely on the actions' of others. Now don't get wrong! I agree if your friends care, they should work it out, but lately everything has seem to fall into this routine, and every hostility is almost a painful routine of redundancy.

"Hands up!"

*takes radio*

"Tell your friends if we take fire you're dead."

I understand it from a realistic point, but honestly I feel it's putting the hostage at a lose lose situation. No matter how good this person's victim roleplay is, it's essentially going to be voided by the fact someone else acted upon breaking those agreements, but that person who is hostage is going to be punished for it? I'm okay if people say it, but really it should be a very last option, it shouldn't be done at the first impact of a bullet hitting the building. Even realistically you lose ALL your leverage killing a hostage, and then it becomes a free-for-all. I just never understand it honestly. It seems like a total excuse to eliminate other's from attempting to save a friend.

In a real situation you wouldn't just kill the only leverage you have to stay protected, and from a roleplay standpoint you shouldn't ruin someone else's experience and judge their fate off others. They are only capable of so much in that position, and just ending them because of others is not mindful at all of their enjoyment of the situation and roleplay. 

It's just happening a lot lately, and it's to the point it seems so routine and stupid. I get it, but really please don't be that fast to end someone else's roleplay because of others.

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Cole    10

-User has been warned for this post-

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Bran    0

An easy workaround to this is to just say

Everytime they shoot at us, we will cut off/scar a part on your body

I know most/all won't do it this way, but this is how I would do it

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Thumper    0

Agreed. Saying 'tell your friends to stop shooting or your dead' like, how the fuck am I responsible for the actions of others? Thats never been a good offense or defense. I cant control them yet, if they shoot I get killed for it? I'd honestly just think removing the 'dont shoot the hostage' is a better option. I think thats more realistic then getting shot for the actions of others. You run risks by taking hostages, you cannot kill unarmed or complying individuals but you can shoot a hostage for someone elses actions?

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Dustin    0

It comes down to the hostage rule deal they added bout a year ago. It gave the people who initiated safe passage to the hostage, and to negotiate which I have only seen done very very little.

It's always the same thing Hands up, tell your friends that if we take shots you are dead. Shitty RP, they let you go. The end.

I don't like when the party who initiated tell the hostage to tell their friends to not shot. No you decided to take me hostage I aint doing shit, you want them to stop shooting you tell them yourself

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Nihoolious    1248

The way I see it, the whole demands thing started as a response to the changes in the rules regarding hostages. It got to the point where taking hostages was not worth the trouble OOC and IC so a solution had to be made. It worked great until people started getting bored, giving less of a fuck and this practice became more common and more rushed.

I don't think there is anything wrong with this practice, in fact I think it should exist to balance things out. What should happen is people should not be so quick to either pull the trigger on the hostage takers, or so quick to give the demands. I know we in New Moon don't immediately kill hostages unless the situation is too dangerous to keep hostages alive.

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Rampage    0

I remember as an admin helping construct this rule. It was kind of inspired by B-17 from something they used to do in game. The purpose of this rule is to get groups to RP with one another during a hostage situation. It was supposed to look like this. Group A kidnapped member from Group B. Group B starts taking shots at Group A. Group A asks hostage to radio friends and get them to stop firing in which would begin negotiations for stuff like supplies in exchange for release. Or to negotiate some sort of truce or whatnot. It was supposed to provide more options other than just PvP.

It never was supposed to be used as the first thing during a hostage situation. It was never meant to get people to stop firing so you can take the hostage away and torture them.

It is quiet annoying and in my opinion bad RP when the first thing someone says after an initiation is "tell your friends not shoot at us or you die."

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Aiko    649

I agree that is has become somewhat of a normal thing, and not interesting at all.

I do remember when its been used, and fun with honestly. It got things interesting and just really great IMO. Though, it has changed drastically from what it used to be to now. Where people use it to be able to execute someone, which I always think killing should be the last possible solution to anything. It should be rped out completely, and not just a get out of jail free for being shot at.

Perhaps a rewrite of it, that be nice. Something along the lines of you can kill a hostage, only if demands are not meet and it is rped out properly. Maybe more than just, dont shoot or we kill. It should have more substance than that, ask for something else as well. Heck even saying the hostage takers are the ones who have to be on the radio making demands.

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DeadKiller    0

I remember as an admin helping construct this rule.  It was kind of inspired by B-17 from something they used to do in game.  The purpose of this rule is to get groups to RP with one another during a hostage situation.  It was supposed to look like this.  Group A kidnapped member from Group B.  Group B starts taking shots at Group A.  Group A asks hostage to radio friends and get them to stop firing in which would begin negotiations for stuff like supplies in exchange for release.  Or to negotiate some sort of truce or whatnot.  It was supposed to provide more options other than just PvP.

It never was supposed to be used as the first thing during a hostage situation.  It was never meant to get people to stop firing so you can take the hostage away and torture them.  

It is quiet annoying and in my opinion bad RP when the first thing someone says after an initiation is "tell your friends not shoot at us or you die."

This Right here hits the nail on the head.

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I agree that is has become somewhat of a normal thing, and not interesting at all.

I do remember when its been used, and fun with honestly. It got things interesting and just really great IMO. Though, it has changed drastically from what it used to be to now. Where people use it to be able to execute someone, which I always think killing should be the last possible solution to anything. It should be rped out completely, and not just a get out of jail free for being shot at.

Perhaps a rewrite of it, that be nice. Something along the lines of you can kill a hostage, only if demands are not meet and it is rped out properly. Maybe more than just, dont shoot or we kill. It should have more substance than that, ask for something else as well. Heck even saying the hostage takers are the ones who have to be on the radio making demands.

Well said.... It would definitely drive both parties to much more interesting RP.  Problem now is most demands will be something totally stupid like "You group must leave XXXX area for good" or  something equally un-imaginative.

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Dishes    159

Yeah I agree 100%, I've really noticed lately that's how hostage situations seem to go anymore. Like Rampage said, it wasn't supposed to have been used how it is nowadays. I like the idea of trying to get groups to RP with each other in these situations rather than just running in shooting, so I think it would be great if it could be rewritten. I like Aiko's suggestion, something along the lines of there needing more substance rather than just immediately going to that threat.

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Aiko    649

Well said.... It would definitely drive both parties to much more interesting RP.  Problem now is most demands will be something totally stupid like "You group must leave XXXX area for good" or  something equally un-imaginative.

I disagree a little on this, but I can see where you are coming from.

Leaving a area can be interesting, and bring rp around still. The group that has to leave could have their home taken from them this way, imagine people fighting over the territory until one is more superior than the other. I can see people striking deals like this, using IG negotiations or even TS to do it. Heck, even having a OOC agreement of Kill rights on the people who agree to the negotiations of not returning. Which is allowed if done right, but there is so much you can do with hostages that I just dont think is being thought of.

I remember one time we got a hostage from the Cedaki and Exiled, back in the day and they were looking everywhere for us. We got the hostage away from them, and we had great negotiation in TS. As they tried desperately to get this hostage out of our hands. I think some people here remember that, and I think that is what hostage negotiation should be.

So I think the rule should have more context, other demands besides dont shoot or the hostage dies.

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Hollows    453

Honestly, I can agree with you on this. But, the issue for me, personally, is the hostage takers don't really want to negotiate. When we send a mediator over to try and get demands, we usually get," You need to have EVERYONE surrender to us, or we'll kill the hostage!" or the typical," Leave us alone, or we'll kill the hostage!" Nobody wants to receive anything or do anything as compensation to release the hostage, it seems. It's either stupidly unreasonable demands, or them just annoyed they got caught out with their pants down and they cannot rob/torture/kill the person they've captured without worry of their friends retaliating.

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SweetJoe    390

"If your friends shoot at us we're going to kill you."

This sentence. I just can't get behind this logic from a roleplay standpoint or real-world. I think this is properly the worst approach to roleplay of anything because it's essentially protecting you from also forces despite wrongdoing, but worse than that it's literally incriminating someone's capabilities and roleplay based purely on the actions' of others. Now don't get wrong! I agree if your friends care, they should work it out, but lately everything has seem to fall into this routine, and every hostility is almost a painful routine of redundancy.

"Hands up!"

*takes radio*

"Tell your friends if we take fire you're dead."

I understand it from a realistic point, but honestly I feel it's putting the hostage at a lose lose situation. No matter how good this person's victim roleplay is, it's essentially going to be voided by the fact someone else acted upon breaking those agreements, but that person who is hostage is going to be punished for it? I'm okay if people say it, but really it should be a very last option, it shouldn't be done at the first impact of a bullet hitting the building. Even realistically you lose ALL your leverage killing a hostage, and then it becomes a free-for-all. I just never understand it honestly. It seems like a total excuse to eliminate other's from attempting to save a friend.

In a real situation you wouldn't just kill the only leverage you have to stay protected, and from a roleplay standpoint you shouldn't ruin someone else's experience and judge their fate off others. They are only capable of so much in that position, and just ending them because of others is not mindful at all of their enjoyment of the situation and roleplay. 

It's just happening a lot lately, and it's to the point it seems so routine and stupid. I get it, but really please don't be that fast to end someone else's roleplay because of others.

I don't feel like typing today so in short...

If they rob me and I use my kos rights later while they have hostages, they will break the rules and execute the hostages.

also it abuses and bends the following rule so they don't have to negotiate.

7d5803f5df.png

Edit: Hostages may be killed if rescuers don't STOP shooting, which means the rule implies that you must first have a threat of rescuers in order to use this, not broadly using it even on solo players so you don't have to negotiate with any potential rescuers that show up. Also it states a reasonable amount of time must elapse in order for you to kill the hostage, you force upon them that any hostility that may occur will end in their death. This includes unaffiliated parties.

For clarity, The hostage takers only make the hostage say allowed into their "radio" the demand, The Hostage Takers don't actually talk to any of these "friends" over the "radio".

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Rampage    0

The purpose of this rule is to encourage interaction between two groups. Its not designed so the hostage takers get free reign to move the hostage and do what they wish with the hostage. This rule's purpose is to give value to the hostage in order for the hostage takers to demand something from the hostages party in return for said hostage. This is what this rule is all about. The people who are attempting rescue should be available to speak on radio (ts) with the hostage takers and role play via radio. Hostage takers need to actually be fired upon before they can do this.


Honestly, I can agree with you on this. But, the issue for me, personally, is the hostage takers don't really want to negotiate. When we send a mediator over to try and get demands, we usually get," You need to have EVERYONE surrender to us, or we'll kill the hostage!" or the typical," Leave us alone, or we'll kill the hostage!" Nobody wants to receive anything or do anything as compensation to release the hostage, it seems. It's either stupidly unreasonable demands, or them just annoyed they got caught out with their pants down and they cannot rob/torture/kill the person they've captured without worry of their friends retaliating.

If the hostage takers do not want to RP and just want to be left alone so they can have free reign on the hostage then that is badrp and people can be punished for such.  Hostile RP needs to stop being so one dimensional because right now it is.

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Kanen    108

I honestly think people should not be able to do this all together. Don't get me wrong I have done this before and will again most likely but I think it would be nice to see an adjustment to the rule to maybe stop this more. I am a firm believer that if you take an hostage, you should be willing to take the consequences that follow it. Aka if you get shot at.

Just because you took the hostage and stuff, shouldn't mean he/she grants you immunity from being shot by his or her friends because you will kill them. I dunno I just dont think its the hostage's fault if they get captured so they shouldn't be able to take a bullet if there friends try to rescue them.

But still throw out demands and make them interesting and you will have some great RP.

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   723

It's not just hostage RP. Here's my issue right here, my little bone to pick. This is a roleplay community yes? Good, glad we got that clarified. What I want to know is why so god damn many people are PVP oriented over RP? Hell during my time here I've even been made aware that PvP experience is a desired requirement for certain settlements recruitment. They might not say it, because who wants to be that guy right? But you can't keep dirty laundry hidden in a laundromat, it's not frickin possible. Priority numbero uno at ever single point, should be the roleplay.

The report threads are absolutely bombarded and I mean full of incidents where people got trigger happy. Oh I know why you did it. 'I was scared, intimidated, felt threatened, had beef with the guy/girl' bla bla bla bla bla... bollocks. You did it because you wanted to kill someone. It's that simple. Why waste time with a hostile roleplay experience when you could just run around going 'PEW PEW PEW'. Because that right there is what it takes to make you a badass. It's ego, pure and simple. "I dropped this guy and that guy and the guys mother and look at me... look at how great a roleplayer I am!" Only it's not you being a badass, no one is a badass. These are characters. What you are is an effective PvP'er.

But it gets punished, and rules come up and with that people start playing around the rules. A hostile situation comes up and immediately you're on that radio alerting people about how you got initiated on at this exact spot yadayada... RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE CAPTOR. In a Teamspeak! Why in all realistic sense can they not hear you do this? So you lose the radio, but not before the word is out. And lets face it, not all of you are honest, some will slip that little bit of unwarranted detail even without the IC means. So long as no one knows right? You'll make an excuse, it's cool right... word vs word, report closed.

You will recruit anyone, literally anyone so long as it helps you win. Numbers, guns, who cares. Only this isn't a game that you can win, we're story tellers and that should include all of us. And before anyone posts to this thinking I am singularly speaking to you or your settlement or whatever, look at the wider picture. There are a hell of a lot of people doing this. And the thing is, most of you are good RP'ers... when you want to be, but you keep not doing it.

And all this causes is a split in the community, bad mouthing in segregated groups and even worse... people not wanting to roleplay because someone shit all over their day and fired that magic coastal teleportation gun, because they breathed the wrong way.

Now hostilities are awesome when done right. Value for life, back and forth banter. Hell even a hostage situation over radio would be AMAZING... if anyone actually did it. But nah, you don't. You take the captives radio and just ignore it, like it wasn't even there. What stops you speaking to the captives friends? And a fire fight can be a good thing, a fun thing... but every single day is more or less a fire fight.

The human beings number one instinct should always be survival. This is a damned fact. Now with that little bit of knowledge, why in the hell would people want to risk their lives for a PvP match, rather than politics!? It's that big old safety net of extra lives isn't it? Christ knows a lot of people only make reports because their precious gear is gone. 'I hate gear', I do. I wish this was like Fallout where we all had pipe pistols that hurt like BB guns. I hate gear because there's times I feel it takes focus over the RP itself.

And people have great examples of what it means to be a high class roleplayer. I am not going to mention a bunch of people, but I'll name two. Roach and Clownshoe. Their videos are a prime example of what it means to be an effective roleplayer. Not once in any video did I see them throw the roleplay to the side for PvP. It was always Story first. Not just your story, but the community story.

When a server is populated 50% or more, purely with your people and your soul purpose is to go out there and dominate, not provide great RP, but literally just dominate, then let me stress something very clear. You are hurting the community. And again let me stress this isn't specifically targeting anyone, what I am talking about is spread out over the months I've kept tabs on things and I've seen it time and time again.

Hell I won't even go near Kabanino most days because my subconscious is convinced someones gonna drop a grenade for the lol factor.

What's my point to all this? We can do better. Focus more on what made you take up roleplay to begin with... the roleplay itself and never ever put it secondary to gear, kill counts or ego.

And this is from a guy who will literally let you do whatever the hell you please if it makes sense. I do not require consent... just a damn good RP out of ya (=

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Shanoby    63

"Tell your friends to drop their weapons, disband their group, take down their camp and not shoot at us or we kill you" GG

On serious note, agreed, I have seen that now in some report videos... seems an issue indeed. I hope this trend will disappear, it is bad RP.

Also, the more I read about bandit RP, the more I'm interested to try it our myself eventually :) Just to challenge myself and try to come up with something new...

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Doc Holiday    170

So I agree with most people on here and that is that it ruins RP. The problem is it ruins it for the hostage as they lose a sense of being rescued, for they know as soon as the hostage takers get shot at they are going to spin around and dome you. In theory the rule should only come into effect after they begin to take shots so it can lead to actual negotiations, like ammo, food or even a person in exchange. The problem is, none of this happens as the hostage takers want the RP to go their way, and as they planned it. For the rescuers, they are helpless, because even if negotiations happen they might be something stupid and unreasonable, such as everyone surrendering. Who in their mind would surrender to it, because then all that's going to happen is everyone gets captured and tortured instead of one or two. Also, with these negotiations, if the other party doesn't agree to the demands of the hostage takers two things will happen; the hostage will die/be executed because of the unreasonable demands or; the group will not be able to negotiate and cannot rescue their friend as it has been stated that anymore shots and the hostage will die. Win-Win for the hostage takers, lose-lose for the rescuers.

IMO the rule should be modified so that negotiations have to occur if the other party wants to talk. Therefore, a sense of fairness is created for everyone.

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The Buddha    24

In my last community, everyone in game was required to have team speak MUTED while playing. Team speak (and Dart) was a tool used by staff to readily get in touch with members or parties on issues, not for people to communicate with each other. We have actual radios in game for that.

If that rule was implemented here, then radios wouldn't be just a prop, carried around with no use at all, basically wasting valuable item slots. Radios, and encounters regarding them, would be a lot more important than they are. Hostage takers could communicate with the victims friends PERSONALLY, issue demands for their hostages safe release ect. No hostage taker would risk it all by giving the hostage free reign in what to say to their potential rescuers, without them knowing what is being said. Hell it's essentially like a kidnapper giving their victim a mobile phone and saying "Don't tell anyone where you are" then leaving them to their own devices... No Hostages basically only ever speak to their friends and family as PROVE PROOF OF LIFE.

Generally they get to say a few words over the radio to a) prove to the relevant people the kidnappers HAVE the person in their possession and b) to prove that they are still alive in order for demands to be met. All other communications are done BY THE KIDNAPPERS not the victim.

The fact that, far too much happens OOC in teamspeak in this community (which would be like telepathy if it was real life which NO ONE HAS!!!!) is, to me, what is the main problem here. You cannot stand in front of me and communicate with your friends without me hearing or seeing you do something, so how can our in game characters do the it while tied up and watched by 2+ armed people LOOKING OUT FOR THAT KIND OF SHIT. You also cannot communicate without speaking (I know, sign language... flags, lights... but these are 100,000,000,000% noticeable) speaking at a normal volume is about 60db, EASILY heard for several meters around the speaker, hell even through objects like walls and doors you can hear people speaking. As for speaking ibto a radio while the radio is in their bag.... Please! Radios function in a specific way, Requiring the PTT to be pressed DOWN in order for a signal to be sent OUT, otherwise the radio is a RECEIVER ONLY.

TL;DR

Letting people use teamspeak like a game mechanic is the problem here. Teamspeak should be for OOC and for staff to communicate with players, not in place of the radio, an in game item we have to have in the first place in order to use the teamspeak fake radio. Why not just use the fucking radio? It has one use... USE IT.

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Randle    931

In my last community, everyone in game was required to have team speak MUTED while playing. Team speak (and Dart) was a tool used by staff to readily get in touch with members or parties on issues, not for people to communicate with each other. We have actual radios in game for that.

If that rule was implemented here, then radios wouldn't be just a prop, carried around with no use at all, basically wasting valuable item slots. Radios, and encounters regarding them, would be a lot more important than they are. Hostage takers could communicate with the victims friends PERSONALLY, issue demands for their hostages safe release ect. No hostage taker would risk it all by giving the hostage free reign in what to say to their potential rescuers, without them knowing what is being said. Hell it's essentially like a kidnapper giving their victim a mobile phone and saying "Don't tell anyone where you are" then leaving them to their own devices... No Hostages basically only ever speak to their friends and family as PROVE PROOF OF LIFE.

Generally they get to say a few words over the radio to a) prove to the relevant people the kidnappers HAVE the person in their possession and b) to prove that they are still alive in order for demands to be met. All other communications are done BY THE KIDNAPPERS not the victim.

The fact that, far too much happens OOC in teamspeak in this community (which would be like telepathy if it was real life which NO ONE HAS!!!!) is, to me, what is the main problem here. You cannot stand in front of me and communicate with your friends without me hearing or seeing you do something, so how can our in game characters do the it while tied up and watched by 2+ armed people LOOKING OUT FOR THAT KIND OF SHIT. You also cannot communicate without speaking (I know, sign language... flags, lights... but these are 100,000,000,000% noticeable) speaking at a normal volume is about 60db, EASILY heard for several meters around the speaker, hell even through objects like walls and doors you can hear people speaking. As for speaking ibto a radio while the radio is in their bag.... Please! Radios function in a specific way, Requiring the PTT to be pressed DOWN in order for a signal to be sent OUT, otherwise the radio is a RECEIVER ONLY.

TL;DR

Letting people use teamspeak like a game mechanic is the problem here. Teamspeak should be for OOC and for staff to communicate with players, not in place of the radio, an in game item we have to have in the first place in order to use the teamspeak fake radio. Why not just use the fucking radio? It has one use... USE IT.

But the reliability of the IG radios is poor therefore we use TS. 

And what's to stop people using a different teamspeak many people do anyway.

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Volke    131

In my last community, everyone in game was required to have team speak MUTED while playing. Team speak (and Dart) was a tool used by staff to readily get in touch with members or parties on issues, not for people to communicate with each other. We have actual radios in game for that.

If that rule was implemented here, then radios wouldn't be just a prop, carried around with no use at all, basically wasting valuable item slots. Radios, and encounters regarding them, would be a lot more important than they are. Hostage takers could communicate with the victims friends PERSONALLY, issue demands for their hostages safe release ect. No hostage taker would risk it all by giving the hostage free reign in what to say to their potential rescuers, without them knowing what is being said. Hell it's essentially like a kidnapper giving their victim a mobile phone and saying "Don't tell anyone where you are" then leaving them to their own devices... No Hostages basically only ever speak to their friends and family as PROVE PROOF OF LIFE.

Generally they get to say a few words over the radio to a) prove to the relevant people the kidnappers HAVE the person in their possession and b) to prove that they are still alive in order for demands to be met. All other communications are done BY THE KIDNAPPERS not the victim.

The fact that, far too much happens OOC in teamspeak in this community (which would be like telepathy if it was real life which NO ONE HAS!!!!) is, to me, what is the main problem here. You cannot stand in front of me and communicate with your friends without me hearing or seeing you do something, so how can our in game characters do the it while tied up and watched by 2+ armed people LOOKING OUT FOR THAT KIND OF SHIT. You also cannot communicate without speaking (I know, sign language... flags, lights... but these are 100,000,000,000% noticeable) speaking at a normal volume is about 60db, EASILY heard for several meters around the speaker, hell even through objects like walls and doors you can hear people speaking. As for speaking ibto a radio while the radio is in their bag.... Please! Radios function in a specific way, Requiring the PTT to be pressed DOWN in order for a signal to be sent OUT, otherwise the radio is a RECEIVER ONLY.

TL;DR

Letting people use teamspeak like a game mechanic is the problem here. Teamspeak should be for OOC and for staff to communicate with players, not in place of the radio, an in game item we have to have in the first place in order to use the teamspeak fake radio. Why not just use the fucking radio? It has one use... USE IT.

Also - Good luck proving Metagame - probably the hardest rulebreak to prove true.

It's not just hostage RP. Here's my issue right here, my little bone to pick. This is a roleplay community yes? Good, glad we got that clarified. What I want to know is why so god damn many people are PVP oriented over RP? Hell during my time here I've even been made aware that PvP experience is a desired requirement for certain settlements recruitment. They might not say it, because who wants to be that guy right? But you can't keep dirty laundry hidden in a laundromat, it's not frickin possible. Priority numbero uno at ever single point, should be the roleplay.

The report threads are absolutely bombarded and I mean full of incidents where people got trigger happy. Oh I know why you did it. 'I was scared, intimidated, felt threatened, had beef with the guy/girl' bla bla bla bla bla... bollocks. You did it because you wanted to kill someone. It's that simple. Why waste time with a hostile roleplay experience when you could just run around going 'PEW PEW PEW'. Because that right there is what it takes to make you a badass. It's ego, pure and simple. "I dropped this guy and that guy and the guys mother and look at me... look at how great a roleplayer I am!" Only it's not you being a badass, no one is a badass. These are characters. What you are is an effective PvP'er.

But it gets punished, and rules come up and with that people start playing around the rules. A hostile situation comes up and immediately you're on that radio alerting people about how you got initiated on at this exact spot yadayada... RIGHT IN FRONT OF THE CAPTOR. In a Teamspeak! Why in all realistic sense can they not hear you do this? So you lose the radio, but not before the word is out. And lets face it, not all of you are honest, some will slip that little bit of unwarranted detail even without the IC means. So long as no one knows right? You'll make an excuse, it's cool right... word vs word, report closed.

You will recruit anyone, literally anyone so long as it helps you win. Numbers, guns, who cares. Only this isn't a game that you can win, we're story tellers and that should include all of us. And before anyone posts to this thinking I am singularly speaking to you or your settlement or whatever, look at the wider picture. There are a hell of a lot of people doing this. And the thing is, most of you are good RP'ers... when you want to be, but you keep not doing it.

And all this causes is a split in the community, bad mouthing in segregated groups and even worse... people not wanting to roleplay because someone shit all over their day and fired that magic coastal teleportation gun, because they breathed the wrong way.

Now hostilities are awesome when done right. Value for life, back and forth banter. Hell even a hostage situation over radio would be AMAZING... if anyone actually did it. But nah, you don't. You take the captives radio and just ignore it, like it wasn't even there. What stops you speaking to the captives friends? And a fire fight can be a good thing, a fun thing... but every single day is more or less a fire fight.

The human beings number one instinct should always be survival. This is a damned fact. Now with that little bit of knowledge, why in the hell would people want to risk their lives for a PvP match, rather than politics!? It's that big old safety net of extra lives isn't it? Christ knows a lot of people only make reports because their precious gear is gone. 'I hate gear', I do. I wish this was like Fallout where we all had pipe pistols that hurt like BB guns. I hate gear because there's times I feel it takes focus over the RP itself.

And people have great examples of what it means to be a high class roleplayer. I am not going to mention a bunch of people, but I'll name two. Roach and Clownshoe. Their videos are a prime example of what it means to be an effective roleplayer. Not once in any video did I see them throw the roleplay to the side for PvP. It was always Story first. Not just your story, but the community story.

When a server is populated 50% or more, purely with your people and your soul purpose is to go out there and dominate, not provide great RP, but literally just dominate, then let me stress something very clear. You are hurting the community. And again let me stress this isn't specifically targeting anyone, what I am talking about is spread out over the months I've kept tabs on things and I've seen it time and time again.

Hell I won't even go near Kabanino most days because my subconscious is convinced someones gonna drop a grenade for the lol factor.

What's my point to all this? We can do better. Focus more on what made you take up roleplay to begin with... the roleplay itself and never ever put it secondary to gear, kill counts or ego.

And this is from a guy who will literally let you do whatever the hell you please if it makes sense. I do not require consent... just a damn good RP out of ya (=

The reason for this is simple. DayZ is a buggy game built with the sole purpose of PVP. Simply that's it - the limitations of the game and the community are the reason people prioritize PVP > RP (And recently I'll probably have to include myself in the above example). The game itself is a survival game with little to no elements of survival, a zombie game with no threat from zombies, and a community & game built upon a military simulator. I can imagine for most people - there really is nothing to do in game except to kill one another. What's the point of engaging war where neither side OOC admits defeat nor has any repercussions? What's the point of creating a "safe haven" which literally possesses nothing else to make it safe other than your word? There is no base building, barricading, defending or anything like that - so there is no way to actually have a safezone except for having numbers & people who are ready to firefight hence leading back to the root cause. DayZRP is a blanket statement roleplaying community (and the only reliable roleplaying community for that matter) so you have various people with different strengths, and waving interest for roleplay. People who's idea of roleplay is DROP YOUR GUN CUMRADE - DAH - I BADASS FUCK, to people who are interested in portraying a second life of themselves in this whimsical world. Hence why the titles of "Bandits", "Campfire Rpers", "Gear Rpers", are inadequate. It's people who all have varying interests in roleplay or different ideas playing within the same bubble. That's literally the long & short of every discussion I think comes up on the forums. Add this all into OOC, People being the main character and deciding what they feel is adequate, the rules, drama/gossip and staff; and your left with endless debates on forums, OOC salty reports from both sides, Pointing Fingers, and Popcorn munching drama. We can all add Gifs, +1 or -1, but the heart of the issue is the game, the numerous amounts of people with different ideals, a sole community to take all these people, a staff with their own sets of biases and opinions of a vague ruleset, and a hefty amount of salt mines & OOC hate.

((Looking over this post - this is way too big for this sole discussion - but I wanted to add on to Tony's explanation, which I found interesting.))

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   723

The reason for this is simple.  DayZ is a buggy game built with the sole purpose of PVP.  Simply that's it - the limitations of the game and the community are the reason people prioritize PVP > RP (And recently I'll probably have to include myself in the above example).  The game itself is a survival game with little to no elements of survival, a zombie game with no threat from zombies, and a community & game built upon a military simulator.  I can imagine for most people - there really is nothing to do in game except to kill one another.  What's the point of engaging war where neither side OOC admits defeat nor has any repercussions?  What's the point of creating a "safe haven" which literally possesses nothing else to make it safe other than your word?  There is no base building, barricading, defending or anything like that - so there is no way to actually have a safezone except for having numbers & people who are ready to firefight hence leading back to the root cause.  DayZRP is a blanket statement roleplaying community (and the only reliable roleplaying community for that matter) so you have various people with different strengths, and waving interest for roleplay.  People who's idea of roleplay is DROP YOUR GUN CUMRADE - DAH - I BADASS FUCK, to people who are interested in portraying a second life of themselves in this whimsical world.  Hence why the titles of "Bandits", "Campfire Rpers", "Gear Rpers", are inadequate.  It's people who all have varying interests in roleplay or different ideas playing within the same bubble.  That's literally the long & short of every discussion I think comes up on the forums.  Add this all into OOC, People being the main character and deciding what they feel is adequate, the rules, drama/gossip and staff; and your left with endless debates on forums, OOC salty reports from both sides, Pointing Fingers, and Popcorn munching drama.  We can all add Gifs, +1 or -1, but the heart of the issue is the game, the numerous amounts of people with different ideals, a sole community to take all these people, a staff with their own sets of biases and opinions of a vague ruleset, and a hefty amount of salt mines & OOC hate.

((Looking over this post - this is way too big for this sole discussion - but I wanted to add on to Tony's explanation, which I found interesting.))

I find your explanation pretty much spot on man. I agree with everything and when I read over it, it made a lot of sense. We work with what we've got.

ONLY, we are ROLEPLAYERS. Here's the thing, if a game is lacking on any aspect, then we as roleplayer's can implement it, we can improvise. Roleplayer's have been doing this ever since we had no platform other than a text based chat room to work with. The VOIP system I find is fantastic as it opens the door to a whole new breed of RP'er, because at one point RP was exclusive to text based or table top. We've evolved. The closest thing you could get to this would be a LARP.

We don't have to acknowledge that the zombies are not a threat. If they are not in a town we can play as if they are and work around it. We don't have to have walls to pretend walls are there. The point is... imagination. Isn't that the point of RP to even begin with?

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Rampage    0

I find your explanation pretty much spot on man. I agree with everything and when I read over it, it made a lot of sense. We work with what we've got.

ONLY, we are ROLEPLAYERS. Here's the thing, if a game is lacking on any aspect, then we as roleplayer's can implement it, we can improvise. Roleplayer's have been doing this ever since we had no platform other than a text based chat room to work with. The VOIP system I find is fantastic as it opens the door to a whole new breed of RP'er, because at one point RP was exclusive to text based or table top. We've evolved. The closest thing you could get to this would be a LARP.

We don't have to acknowledge that the zombies are not a threat. If they are not in a town we can play as if they are and work around it. We don't have to have walls to pretend walls are there. The point is... imagination. Isn't that the point of RP to even begin with?

Here is the issue. The voip in dayz sucks most of the time.

Here is what I noticed with role players at least here. You have a super small minority that are amazing. Then you have another small group that are pretty good. Most people I would say are average to mediocre. Some get super in to detail with their characters while others just slap a first and last name, say some edgy shit, rinse repeat. You need a balance. You need the hardcore role players and you need the average mediocre role players, otherwise there would be attention whoring to the max. You need the "prop" type characters who are villains but can do basic RP.

I think the problem is three things.

1. Certain rules that severely restrict rp

2. Role players that get into a boring repetition until that one rper breaks the mold.

3. This mentality that there are winners and losers.

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Exactly on point Rampage. Another thing I see is a lot of newer roleplayer's being disregarded entirely. People don't want them in their settlements, they get robbed constantly and more often than not either congregate together or they go lone wolf. This, this right here... is a god damned shame.

Everyone had to start somewhere. It isn't difficult to sit someone down and talk them through things. To 'mentor'. People learn by example, by little tiny things that make a difference. Sometimes a newer RP'er needs help separating the IC from the OOC. They need help understanding value for life. They need help just immersing themselves to begin with. There is a lot of selfish approaches right now and I understand why. Because you want your RP to be great.

My RP is something I am bold enough to say I am pleased with. But what I want is something better community wide and it starts with consideration to the environment around you. We all share the same house, therefore it's everyone's responsibility to keep it clean. Not just staff.

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