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Furlean

'Powergaming' actions

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   37

Hey there,

Would it be considered powergaming if for example, you handcuffed someone to an object stuck in the ground, say a pole or table leg so they would not be able to move? I know this mechanic can not be actually carried in DayZ SA but is writing the action in Text RP something along the lines "Takes left hand and handcuffs to table leg* whilst actually handcuffing them with handcuffs in game a legit move in game or is that considered powergaming?

On the same lines, is putting a gag in someones mouth (for example, putting a face mask on the captured person to simulate the gag) so they can not talk but only make muffled sounds a legit move or is that considered powergaming? 

My understanding of powergaming as defined in the rules is 'Powergaming refers to forcing an action, condition or belief upon another player's character beyond what the games mechanics allow.' I remember a time during the mod where I would be *handcuffed* fictionally as there was no handcuffs in game then but with the rise of new items in DayZ SA, there new possibilities for ways to RP.

I just need a little clarity of the rules of what is and what is not permitted. Thanks.

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Hassan    381

Hello,

In my opinion yes that would be power gaming, it's not a game mechanic and you're basically forcing something on another person to do that isn't actually something you can do with the game and it forces the RP on there end. If you're going to do something like that I'd recommend asking them OOC for example, "//Is it alright if we can roleplay it off that we're handcuffing you to this post" or something along those lines.

Now I think it's a little different when you actually cuff them, you have the cuffs already on them and you're using the item and I don't see a reason why you couldn't really tell them you're using the handcuffs to cuff them to the table. Either way it's kind of something that you should ask and make sure just in case, especially if you're not using any actual handcuffs or rope.

As well with gagging a hostage, you should 100% ask them permission for that. You're completely forcing the RP by making them not being able to talk without their permission and limits the RP when it's not an actual mechanic, so yes that's powergaming.

Now that we have actual handcuffs and rope in standalone that can tie people up there's no need to fictionally handcuff somebody because you actually can do this by the mechanics in standalone, you just need to find the items.

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Guest

ask permission and you should be fine, type OOC "//can I gag you?" or "//can I bound you to a table?"

simple interactions like this would most likely be a yes.

but personally I would never allow to be gagged unless for a certain purpose. gagging usually imply I can't talk anymore, more times than not I enjoy playing as the kid who gets into the hostage taker's minds. do a reverse Stockholm syndrome and leave with most of my stuff so I like talking, connecting and rping. Gagging for me is a no no, but bounding me to something so I can't move is fine

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Brad    155

Yeah, asking permission is the best way to avoid people getting upset that it was a powergame. I personally think it's a cool idea to handcuff someone to a table etc. adds a bit of a different spin on the hostage RP, but definitely a good idea to ask them. As for Gags, I would avoid them, always. As previously stated, not being able to talk sucks. Unless it is for a very brief period of time

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To be honest I don't see why you would need to ask for permission in both cases.

In the first one, even though it is not a game mechanic that does not mean you can't go and do sth different like bounding someone to a table or pole. Makes perfecy sense and it is quite realistic.

For the second one I'll say the same. I don't see it as powergaming. It is quite common sense that if someone does not shut up, you could just gag them. The problem here lies in wheter or not you should do this. As Hassan stated it limits the RP for the hostage, so if you don't do it in the right situation it might turn into BadRP.

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Guest

Really? I always thought gagging was a valid RP move. I think as long as it is not the only RP you receive it can be great. It's surely a more realistic thing to do than to shoot someone in the leg for talking back?

Andrey beat me to it.

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You can always "attempt" to handcuff them to the table or log or whatever you're looking for.

Attempting to do something gives the victim two options:

~ They can accept the fact that they've been handcuffed.

~ Or they have the option of slipping the handcuffs off, escaping, or whatever.

Recently, people have been resorting to OOC to ask what they can do to their hostage.

If you type something like the following; *attempts to handcuff the man to a nearby table*, it keeps everything in character and the response you are getting is also in character.

If you "attempt" to handcuff them, they are not restricted to being handcuffed and can choose to escape or not. This would mean that it is not powergaming and it also increases hostage interaction as they can roleplay it out much further.

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Brad    155

To be honest I don't see why you would need to ask for permission in both cases.

In the first one, even though it is not a game mechanic that does not mean you can't go and do sth different like bounding someone to a table or pole. Makes perfecy sense and it is quite realistic.

For the second one I'll say the same. I don't see it as powergaming. It is quite common sense that if someone does not shut up, you could just gag them. The problem here lies in wheter or not you should do this. As Hassan stated it limits the RP for the hostage, so if you don't do it in the right situation it might turn into BadRP.

I respectfully disagree,  Powergaming refers to forcing an action, condition or belief upon another player's character beyond what the games mechanics allow.

You handcuff someone to a table, you are restricting their mobility, you are forcing an action on them and if not asked before hand would be powergaming.

Gagging someone without permission would also be forcing another action on them.


You can always "attempt" to handcuff them to the table or log or whatever you're looking for.

--snip--

Well said this is a great way to do it rather than OOC chat.


Really? I always thought gagging was a valid RP move. I think as long as it is not the only RP you receive it can be great. It's surely a more realistic thing to do than to shoot someone in the leg for talking back?

Andrey beat me to it.

Yeah I guess I could see if people were trying to rescue a hostage and captors wanted them to be absolutely quiet, just doesn't seem all that fun to do otherwise.

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Voodoo    366

Sung sums it well with his post above. I dont see a massive problem with this and feel it can bring some great RP to a situation.

Just use *attempts. .* and it will allow for the other member to react. OOC should only be used in urgent situations and by doing this simple action of attempting something it will drastically reduce OOC and keep the situation interesting and involves the victim in keeping the flow of the RP.

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If they're your hostage then you have every right to do so. Just like how you can beat up a hostage when they're under your power but when they're not you can't just go up to them randomly and go *Punches man in stomach*.

They'll still have the option to break out anyway because the cuffs are breakable.

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   37

Well, I am getting a lot of mixed answers here, I gather the general idea is to ask for consent when in doubt? If that is the case though, where do you draw the line on asking permission to conduct actions? I think the rules should CLEARLY state what is and what isn't in regards to power-gaming actions, otherwise reports of powergaming, and the interpretation of the powergaming rule based on Game Master's understandings of the definition and act, are vague and not consistent.

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Clumsy    142

If we were to sit and write out everything that is considered powergaming then it would be a really long list

as there are tons of different situations and actions. When you have a hostage it is true you are allowed to do 

what you wish with them. However there is an extent to these actions that would require OOC permission. Such

as Execution, Branding, Cutting off anything. If you don't want to break character or ruin the mood of RP then as

it was stated you can always put "Attempts". That gives the person the choice to either reply back with something like,

*Struggles for a bit seeing what (he or she) had planned before being handcuffed to the (object)*. That can open the

door to some really interesting RP as it is realistic. 

As for the gagging I personally don't see how that would benefit any RP, powergaming or not. If it's just for a few moments to

'teach them a lesson' or to keep them from screaming when people come by then I don't see it being a problem. Yet if you do it

the entire time the hostage is there then you are limited the RP to just muffled replies and sounds which would not make the

RP fun for the hostage. 

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The rules are pretty clear, any actions that force a state on a player is called powergaming. Without consent from the person you are RPing with any action where you force a condition is punishable. The moment you have consent you are no longer forcing any state on him or her, but instead the person has given you permission to do just that what you agreed upon. Therefor the rules need no adjusting at all.

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Guest

good to see you've got an answer to your question

/solved

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