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Grihm

The never ending fighting, just another re spawn.

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Grihm    16

Just curious to how people see the fact that you can basically re spawn indefinitely.

Do you see any immediate problems with it, for example the issue of having killed characters suddenly appear again a few hours later, and or the issue with clan wars that just go on forever? Does the world feel static in a copy/paste kind of way?

It feels like for me personally that the fear of dying is just absent to the point of it all becoming just another shooter.

The everyday struggle of the infection or the survival is more dotted out in small groups. Instead what shines through the most is verbal and shouting of profanity and do this do that i order you or BOOM, and that never changes pace of intensity part from getting more and more of it from time to time. Does no one fear death any more? 

The DayZRP i signed up for has indeed changed for me, but has it changed for you?

Here are a few trailers i try to keep in mind when playing, so in a way this is how i see the world that is filled with actual horrors and the never ending hovering feeling of what infected or horror that will be the death of you.

Who knows...maby the horror is removed for good? 

[video=youtube]

[video=youtube]

[video=youtube]

[video=youtube]

[video=youtube]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=aJK9XTvjkXw

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NishiUrban    79

I've had a very similar discussion with people I rp with frequently, when talking about our characters and interactions in game, and why we do the things we do. For a long while now, playing as my current character, I've had in the back of my mind. "The next death might be a perma death", it's what keeps me from doing something brash and getting myself or the people with me gunned down over something trivial, like an argument with someone etc. That being said, the first and only time so far someone has asked to perma mark my character, I've accepted. So there's always the concern that I may accept it again sometime, if I feel it's justified. All in all, there's a certain atmosphere of fear, and doubt that my character has been living with IG and I'm glad that I can enjoy such tense situations occasionally.

 That being said, I completely understand what you're saying. I've molded my character, with the OOC mindset that not everyone is going to accept being perma marked, perma killed by execution, etc. Although realistically, my character would want to execute someone who is posing an immediate danger, or future threat to the people he considers family, there's no certainty that the person I execute is going to actually be dead. Because they would just spawn somewhere, and lose the memory of what lead up to their death, I would more than likely just see them again someday and the cycle continues.

 So far I've tried to rationalize reasons as to why I would let the person I have at gunpoint go free, I don't know about everyone else, but I've decided my character is trying to turn over a new leaf so to speak and doesn't want to flat out kill people unless I'm forced too in a firefight. I know it's not exactly a solution to the problem, but when  you find ways to rp NOT killing the person, at least there's a justifiable reason why you would see them again later on down the line. As opposed to, "This guy somehow survived 30 rounds to his face from an AK."

 If I really had to execute someone, I would probably do like Cid suggested to me a long while ago, and shoot them in the chest or something. At least that makes more sense than survive bullet wounds to the head, IMO.

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Janana    28

I can't help but relate this post to another thread that sort of touched up on respawn and how that affects your experience, and everyone else's.

Family feuds, wars between groups and death have absolutely no concept of reality with a good majority of RPers here because respawning is a thing and people don't perma their characters. As Nishi said and I relate, I like to play thinking that if I do something stupid, it's my fault, and I die.. well then that's it. My character is effectively dead at that point and the fear of losing the character that you've worked so hard on for so long drives you to roleplay in a different way. A more realistic way. I think people who RP with the idea that respawning your character after death RP drastically different from people who don't respawn.

When you look at big fights between groups, the fighting never actually ends because all the people who are fighting want to win and you can't win if you're dead so you just never perma your character. The fighting continues indefinitely. I personally think the idea of just respawning your character after a death really has a bad affect on your RP, and everyone who knows you. 

Glitch/Accidental deaths have no affect on this line of thinking as you can't really.. justify your death just by walking down the street and then falling over like a bag of sand just because the DayZ gods decided you and gravity needed a closer relationship.

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Grihm    16

To just re spawn over and over again is very confusing indeed. Several times i have had to just ignore RP or turn the other way just because the situation is so awkward or confusing. The same people just keeps coming back, but still throw them selfs into combat situation after combat situation, with no hint of it ever ending. It has been ongoing for so long now it´s a systematical way of playing for far to many.

I cannot oven remember the last time i actually seen someone playing out any form of injury, part from a 3 min cough or such. No bullet wounds, no cuts, no infections. Nothing. No one is starving, everyone sleeps perfectly, everyone is at 100% combat ready.

SIR YES SIR!

With nothing restricting the fallout of combat, how can you ever possibly hope things to change?

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Jester    48

Well sometimes you get robbed and someone shoots you. it would suck to have months of RP and work go to waste if that was how you perma deathed you char. It does create issues. But it also allows a living breathing work to develop and continue.

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I made a thread a while ago touching that exact subject because I felt that the players who play in this community mostly for the PVP aspect treat their character as an empty meaningless disposable shell. They instigate hostilities and fights for their own enjoyment not thinking about the repercussion of wounds and/or death. I've stated many times that there needs to be an incentive for players to care about their character's well-being and survival, but was shut down because basically there's no easy way to legislate it. Still I think we as a community who has realism and roleplay at heart should strive to find solutions that cater to both what is fun and what is realistic, else we'll just keep playing a deathmatch waiting to happen with stale intermissions here and there.

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Janana    28

I made a thread a while ago touching that exact subject because I felt that the players who play in this community mostly for the PVP aspect treat their character as an empty meaningless disposable shell. They instigate hostilities and fights for their own enjoyment not thinking about the repercussion of wounds and/or death. I've stated many times that there needs to be an incentive for players to care about their character's well-being and survival, but was shut down because basically there's no easy way to legislate it. Still I think we as a community who has realism and roleplay at heart should strive to find solutions that cater to both what is fun and what is realistic, else we'll just keep playing a deathmatch waiting to happen with stale intermissions here and there.

Thanks for the link. I missed that one. :3

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Grihm    16

I do feel a certain "push" from areas where just as said up here,

players who play in this community mostly for the PVP aspect treat their character as an empty meaningless disposable shell.

The push is that no matter how you RP against players as such, you loose. You might RP out a wound or fatigue, but if it´s only a one way street, you will loose without a doubt.

RP and character creations goes past soaking up the 5 latest buckshots to the face.

Are we going to have to keep to closed events on S3 with password protections just to have what should be in the foundation of the server?

Might be a good time to take another look at the gameplay and how it´s played out, because the changes in staff and the changes in what is in front of us development wise are not the only areas in need.

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Guest Vittoria   
Guest Vittoria

-snip-

read op wrong, rip

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Ocean    6

Couldn't agree more with this post. I've made a thread too focusing on Realism VS. Entertainment. And I would write a lot more here but i'm on my phone so i'll keep it short.

What I have seen from quite a few members and groups including myself is this. You create a character and you RP, it's new fun and great. While you are playing and growing this character you make friends and enemies. 

Now think back to when you first started your first character. It was scary, exciting, and full of endless opportunities. But because you and I play so much dayzrp, you begin to learn almost everyone and everything. You get comfortable. You may die in a legit way because you were a bit careless with your actions or because you died and that how life goes. But you don't perma death. You aren't done with your character, you dont wanna lose all the connections and story line you got going on to a random bandit or hero, or a lame sickness. 

This makes absolute sense. It is a game to play, to have fun. Not a movie script were writing to entertain others with an awesome story. But as much as this makes sense, I see it in a lot of cases, its lessening the excitement of dayzrp, the scare factor, and the exploration/adventure/cautious post-apocalyptic feel we should have from this game. 

As mentioned by others before, forcing someone to perma is not the solution. But having an endless supply of lives with no consequence (in fact an advantage now) is also not right. There must be a balance, some rule or mechanic that we can follow to make this a lot better.

Now here is the other part to this tricky situation. Not everyone is playing DayZRP for the same reasons I may be playing it. In fact, some days you may find yourself playing for different reasons. All I know is everyone I ever talked to about it agrees at times it gets bland. And a big factor is because most stories can't conclude. Group wars last months with multiple of the same character deaths.  Thing is on a day to day basis I do have fun because im hanging out- sorry, RPing with my friends. Maybe i'm playing wrong, and I feel like I am now. Only because trying to progress my character by going through with scenarios have become meaningless shortly after. All I wanna know is are we here to hangout like in a club penguin/habbo hotel like setting with the odd repetitive hostile encounter? Or are we here to RP out characters stuck in Chernarus with limited resources, and dangerous people running around not knowing if you will make it to the next day. Or being the dangerous person knowing you actually are scaring the person you are robbing with some actual power over their life.

I just feel something has to change to bring a balance to this topic. 

(Guess I wrote more then I wanted)

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Sauce    43

As I understand it, the idea behind only one life or something similar is to force players to think more carefully about their actions.

Could the result possibly hamper some aspects of role play in ways that were never intended?

When I first joined I found it hard to relate to my characters and this continues in the way I find myself caring less about any 'alt' than I do about my 'main'. I suppose it's only natural given the time and effort invested.

I put it to you then that there may be more of an 'average lifespan' of characters under such a system and building a long RP history for a specific character may almost slip into obscurity. Groups could lose leadership and disintegrate in the same session they were formed, players may be forced to create many multiple characters in one session, not to mention the possible RP blunders or exploits that may be found...

I like the idea of RP lives being taken more seriously and the risk/reward actions taken by characters being more grounded than it currently is. Saying that though, there are also many players who would take advantage of a heightened fear for characters well-being.

Rampant banditry is already a problem and this relies on your willingness to comply to demands or deal with the consequence... How would any other re-spawn system stop large groups dominating others? It may even result in the most aggressive and largest groups being the only ones with characters of any age.

For me the rules are not the fundamental issue, rather they overshadow some basic ugly facts. The willingness to role play all aspects of a characters interactions with his/her world is just not there. I'd go as far as to say most buckle under the pressure of fire-fights. The want to 'win' is too strong. Maybe it's human instinct or maybe some people just don't care enough.

I just don't think it would make those who already care little care any more than they do now.

Our community is highly based on trust. Any rule system will always have deficiencies but with good players and a sporting attitude these shouldn't present an issue...

Unfortunately that doesn't seem to be the case here.

All RP situations rely (on some level) on a mutual agreement between players to provide a fun experience for one another. There will always be some who want to throw a spanner in the works and amending rules to defend against them will inevitably dull down the experience for the rest while they continue to find new ways to exploit the system as it evolves.

I agree 100% that the current system as it is has characters maimed and killed appearing fine in sometimes a matter of minutes. This seems stupid as hell but I think, at least for now, it's the lesser of two evils.

Hopefully we will see injuries effect the IG characters more as patches come out. With defibrillators and the other medical equipment working properly and expanded upon I think there would be more of a case for a one life rule, or at least a separate one life rule server...

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Vandy    34

There have been multiple discussions about this. And it all ends up in personal favor.

I have yet to be killed in game, so I can't speak of my own experience. But if I'm not per se excecuted on point blank, I'd probably won't perma death my characther.

If I would be shot, and die in a gunfight, I would probably roleplay that I was hit but survived. I'll defenatelly add a story to it, saying I'm hurt or injured, and can't run much. I've done that before when I died due to a glitch where I was stuck on top of a cliff. The only way out was jumping of the cliff. So I rp'ed I slipped off and had broken ribs. I had a week long campfire rp, and couldn't jog or sprint. It was amazing. Thanks to the people of the CDF 101st. We had great roleplay thanks to my in game death.

So I wouldn't autoamattically say that the unlimited amount of respawns would be bad for rp.

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Sin    114

Our community is highly based on trust. Any rule system will always have deficiencies but with good players and a sporting attitude these shouldn't present an issue...

Unfortunately that doesn't seem to be the case here.

All RP situations rely (on some level) on a mutual agreement between players to provide a fun experience for one another. There will always be some who want to throw a spanner in the works and amending rules to defend against them will inevitably dull down the experience for the rest while they continue to find new ways to exploit the system as it evolves.

I agree 100% that the current system as it is has characters maimed and killed appearing fine in sometimes a matter of minutes. This seems stupid as hell but I think, at least for now, it's the lesser of two evils.

We shouldn't have to settle for the lesser of two evils.

Unfortunately, there will always be those who seek fun only for themselves, or to find ways to exploit the rules.  And you're right, it's because of them that we have the rules we do which makes things less fun for everyone.

Ideally, we'd have no rules at all, just a common vision, and maybe a few soft guidelines.  And a lot of trust.  Instead, we have backbiting and reports and OOC hats.  GG

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Grihm    16

We all engage in combat now and then, either with the infected or by the hands of others.

The problem at hand is that too many just ignores the outcome of a fight if that is death.

They re spawn, their buddies brings them the gear and on it goes.

You cannot compete with that if you stick to your guns, that the world is in fact dangerous and that a re-supply run takes time.  Boom - Re spawn - Stuff - Back in business in 20 min and just keep on doing whatever it was that got you killed in the first place is not IMO a productive way to go. How many "gang-clan" wars have now been ongoing forever it seems and no one ever dies.

We are in a world with limited supplies and a survival aspect, are we not? Why cannot there be a reasonable request that people play by that fact?

Would there be an option to play on a separate server, password protected and with an invite list that you as a player - abides to play with combat damage and fatigue as a part of the gameplay, i would embrace it with open arms. You are not cool because you rush into combat and or dies for the 20´th time the same week. It´s not beneficial to anyone part from perhaps a PVP perspective.

That is not what i signed up for at least, and to be asked to just "ignore and go on and adapt" is just an ignorant way to deal with it. Where else is a community and server like this up and running? Basically none existent. A general PVP server however.... well there are more of them than i can count.

Do the math and the problem is clear.

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Glitch    15

If I'm going to shoot a hostage and they aren't going to perm their character I'd as well shoot them somewhere that could make sense for them to still be alive otherwise I most likely wont kill a hostage unless they want to be permed. And as for the horror aspect of DayZ I try to RP more cautiously like I don't avoid RP but instead of just walking around a town all happy like thinking everything is fine it could very well lead to being tortured and permed or whatever, people have become too friendly thinking there is no threat in DayZ and if they get attached to gear they avoid RP. So I try to act more cautious, while still interacting with people and I as well listen to some background music that goes well with every situation I have fallen into. Once I had met two strange fellows and they did end up taking me hostage but while listening to the music I could just feel the build up and when they had be tied up the music fit there as well, if anyone wants to use it as well it works very well as background music sounding a bit horror like, and suspenseful.

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Zero    277

The only problem I have is when people decide to attack, attack, attack! Constantly! As if their groups have unlimited numbers and armies backing them. Makes no logical sense what so ever, even if you are a bandit. In a realistic situation, if a roving bandit group lost 2-3 people they would lay low for some time. People should RP that they're recovering from their wounds more often. Nobody truly values their character/characters life because they know they can just respawn, regear, and attack all over again. :|

That's why I like the idea of perma-death rules/groups.

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Guest Vittoria   
Guest Vittoria

Forced perma death, and respawn timers are never going to happen.

Also, so a pvp group gets wiped and forced permadeathed... what do they do? make alts of the same tropes different nationalites

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Grihm    16

Forced perma death, and respawn timers are never going to happen.

Also, so a pvp group gets wiped and forced permadeathed... what do they do? make alts of the same tropes different nationalites

Well, you never know, that´s the point. You can never say never.

Also, you don´t seem to fully grasp what the issue is. It´s not PVP per say, but if you constantly keep dying over and over and over again to no ends.

* More logic form of PVP

A character that now and then engage in combat over a RP logic reason, such as defending a food storage - fighting for the preservation of your group against a hostile faction - an occasional brawl that weeds out and turns aggressive enough to include weapons etc

* None logic form of PVP

People that keeps PVP up against a groups for weeks and weeks or even more with no end in sight - The everyday i shoot you he shoots me i shoot back he shoots back - Jumping the gun actions / trigger happy situations etc

This is an RP based server. Just how beneficial to the RP is it that someone can keep dying for the 30´th time with the same character and show not even the slightest sign of battle fatigue or wounds? Where is the RP in that? It´s none existent. The only thing that gives is a sensation of people taking no care to develop a deeper character than up to the second a gun is involved.

A few videos in the past has even shown players engaged in PVP on this server, at the same time they are pumping dubstep through the speakers. How exactly are you supposed to be RP aware of your surroundings and or hear initiations, hear the opposite factions yell or speak and perhaps even give up?

As said, roleplayers are pushed to the side for casual everyday shootouts. There are countless servers for that all over the internet. DayZRP is limited.

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Harry    18

Well as a bandit i can agree with some points beign made here. However.. Without pvp the server wouldnt be realistic at all. From what i have noticed to many people are friendly to each other like the outbreak never happend. For example: Oh hello do you need anything?? here is some food or a drink. But i do agree with the many attacks happpening that its a little unrealistic. You cant just attack for the sake of attacking. There should be a good reason to iniate on places like greenmountain. And not just for the bandits enjoyment.

In my opinion there should be some kind of story development behind it. And not just that we felt like iniating on the place for the sake of pvp. And i agree many people dont even rp it out if they get shot. Most of them act like supersoldiers.. "You can kill me so i will fuck you all up!" Its already in the rules that you should have a valid reason to rob or to start a hostile action. However i feel this rule is getting abused alot.

The perma death idea is not bad. But its hard for people who have build up there characters from years or months of experiences. They get to addicted to their character and cannot simply say: Yes lets perma him because i got shot in the head. But at the same time you should ask what is more important..

Realism or Entertainment for both party's. In my opinion its the entertainment one. Its still a game remember that. We probaly never will find out how it would work in real life. And besides we only come here to have a fun experience i am right>

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   36

The thing is about this discussion is I do agree with it however at the same time I disagree its a funny one.

For example you have an unbelievable RP session that ends in your death after months of RP and you permadeath.

Second example would be you die from a glitch and then you permadeath... Its just not fair and it would be very hard to create a set of rules to enforce someone to permadeath a character .

So yeah I doubt this will ever change.

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Grihm    16

The thing is about this discussion is I do agree with it however at the same time I disagree its a funny one.

For example you have an unbelievable RP session that ends in your death after months of RP and you permadeath.

Second example would be you die from a glitch and then you permadeath... Its just not fair and it would be very hard to create a set of rules to enforce someone to permadeath a character .

So yeah I doubt this will ever change.

It seems people read permadeth, and then nothing else and make up their own mind as to what the meaning is about.

Glitches has never been a valid reason for death at any point, yet it is often brought up to shut down a suggestion.

If you take the time to read what the problem is about, i am sure you will not find any relation to the aspect of dying from a glitch and that that somehow is a valid reason for a permadeath.

 

The issue at hand is people not caring for their characters and or just doing PVP all day long in an unending wave of death upon death without showing any signs of slowing down.

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   36

The thing is about this discussion is I do agree with it however at the same time I disagree its a funny one.

For example you have an unbelievable RP session that ends in your death after months of RP and you permadeath.

Second example would be you die from a glitch and then you permadeath... Its just not fair and it would be very hard to create a set of rules to enforce someone to permadeath a character .

So yeah I doubt this will ever change.

It seems people read permadeth, and then nothing else and make up their own mind as to what the meaning is about.

Glitches has never been a valid reason for death at any point, yet it is often brought up to shut down a suggestion.

If you take the time to read what the problem is about, i am sure you will not find any relation to the aspect of dying from a glitch and that that somehow is a valid reason for a permadeath.

 

The issue at hand is people not caring for their characters and or just doing PVP all day long in an unending wave of death upon death without showing any signs of slowing down.

The way I read it has not changed. And the answer has not changed tbh the only thing I will add is there is no way to regulate or monitor what people prefer to do some people want to be bandits and PVP as you say and some people want to create story's and interact but that is what the server is about that is creating your own story.

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Grihm    16

The thing is about this discussion is I do agree with it however at the same time I disagree its a funny one.

For example you have an unbelievable RP session that ends in your death after months of RP and you permadeath.

Second example would be you die from a glitch and then you permadeath... Its just not fair and it would be very hard to create a set of rules to enforce someone to permadeath a character .

So yeah I doubt this will ever change.

It seems people read permadeth, and then nothing else and make up their own mind as to what the meaning is about.

Glitches has never been a valid reason for death at any point, yet it is often brought up to shut down a suggestion.

If you take the time to read what the problem is about, i am sure you will not find any relation to the aspect of dying from a glitch and that that somehow is a valid reason for a permadeath.

 

The issue at hand is people not caring for their characters and or just doing PVP all day long in an unending wave of death upon death without showing any signs of slowing down.

The way I read it has not changed. And the answer has not changed tbh the only thing I will add is there is no way to regulate or monitor what people prefer to do some people want to be bandits and PVP as you say and some people want to create story's and interact but that is what the server is about that is creating your own story.

If you still feel this is about glitches, then let´s just agree to disagree. Me personally i feel that getting yourself killed in combat for the 30´th time from basically the same reason is on top of the Bad RP. Glitches is an entirely separate thing that we cannot alter or change. This problem, we can.

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   36

It seems people read permadeth, and then nothing else and make up their own mind as to what the meaning is about.

Glitches has never been a valid reason for death at any point, yet it is often brought up to shut down a suggestion.

If you take the time to read what the problem is about, i am sure you will not find any relation to the aspect of dying from a glitch and that that somehow is a valid reason for a permadeath.

 

The issue at hand is people not caring for their characters and or just doing PVP all day long in an unending wave of death upon death without showing any signs of slowing down.

The way I read it has not changed. And the answer has not changed tbh the only thing I will add is there is no way to regulate or monitor what people prefer to do some people want to be bandits and PVP as you say and some people want to create story's and interact but that is what the server is about that is creating your own story.

If you still feel this is about glitches, then let´s just agree to disagree. Me personally i feel that getting yourself killed in combat for the 30´th time from basically the same reason is on top of the Bad RP. Glitches is an entirely separate thing that we cannot alter or change. This problem, we can.

I do not feel the conversation is about glitches it was just an example but let me ask a question out of curiosity how would you suggest changing something like dying in a fight over and over as there is no way to monitor it? No way to regulate it without any tools?

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