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Joffrey

Less of a Prison System.

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Joffrey    894

So I've been thinking... dangerous I know. But it seems to me the way the community punishes rule breakers  is a tad unproductive towards community health, and growth. How it currently works:

A person does something pretty dumb.

Another person is a victim of that dumb action and reports it.

The person who did the dumb thing gets found guilty, and the punishment? 10 or so points and a removal from the community for a few days.

To me this looks a lot like The United States' prison system. Where repeat offenders eventually stack up enough offenses, probation breaks, until they hit significant time in the slammer or life in prison.

The're multiple studies that show that when a criminal commits an act, if he is put through a rehabilitation program they are far more likely to not commit more crimes, and conform back into society as a productive member.

I propose we create a "Rehabilitation" system when it comes to rule breakers. Create a system of where a person is a first or second time offender, they must take on an RP mentor for a day or two. Get shown the ropes, that sort of thing. After the man or woman has had one or two rule breaks, and has been cleared by the mentor to go "back on their own."  If they continue to break rules, THEN they start getting the 7 day bans/permabans. Perhaps give them a chance to learn by example, instead of getting thrown in the slammer alone.. only to commit the same types of"crime" until they are perma'd.

There are plenty of community members who have shown interest in being an RP Mentor, as can be seen by fox's RP Class Thread. So finding mentors in different time zones wouldn't be too difficult.

In this way, we can grow the community, and not shrink it.. and increase the quality of RP the server receives. Thoughts?

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TEazy97    8

Joff, this is a brilliant idea. I like how fox will be able to get more traffic through this way for his project aswell. Good idea man!

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Defiance    96

I'm really in favor of this idea, especially since it incorporates Fox's program. If something like this were to take off, then I'm sure more people would be willing to step up to the plate and help first-time offenders.

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Janana    28

Perhaps give them a chance to learn by example, instead of getting thrown in the slammer alone.. only to commit the same types of"crime" until they are perma'd.

There are plenty of community members who have shown interest in being an RP Mentor, as can be seen by fox's RP Class Thread.

Joff, this is a brilliant idea. I like how fox will be able to get more traffic through this way for his project aswell. Good idea man!

Yes. Give Fox more traffic with his classes. They are helpful and people aren't very likely to take on something like that themselves so we may as well make it mandatory if they repeatedly express that they need some guidance.

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I think this is a great idea and just as I am willing to help Fox with his classes, I'm willing to help with this. Shit, that reminds me, I have a write-up for him I need to finish. But yes, this is a great thought and I think it would in fact help the community.

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Maro    1

Seems like a good suggestion, but it would require a lot of time and effort by staff to ''rehabilitate'' first-and second offenders if reports are to be solved this way, AND keep up with the ''normal'' reports giving verdicts etc. The RP Master Class is a good idea, but seeing the amount of first and second hand offenders in reports these days will require a large amount of people to participate. I don't know how many would be willing to learn people rules they should already know well, on a seemingly full time basis. Might work better than how it is done now in terms of keeping members from being banned, but in the long run I think it will take up too much time if this to become the standard of solving rulebreaks. It already takes a long time to provide verdicts, and with this new addition, stafff will need a lot of help to maintain it. However, if people are willing, it would probably be a good idea. Maybe shine some more light on Fox' thread already so that new players can try it out before they break a rule instead of it being a consequence of a rule break in the future.

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MadeInsane    11

The amount of effort needed might not be worth the reward, perhaps I am cynical but I feel that people could be wasting their time on a lot of the people that break rules, sometimes they are honest accidents and whatnot, but a lot of people know what they are doing is against the rules and still decide to do it anyway.

Perhaps the perpetrator could ask for one of these "RP Mentor" types in return for a reduced punishment, not removing the punishment entirely of course, however should the person break rules shortly after spending the allotted time with the Mentor, their punishment should be increased in my opinion, as they have been dishonest with staff to get a reduced punishment and wasted the Mentor's time.

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Clumsy    226

This sounds like a really awesome idea. People make mistake. Believe it or not we are all human. Yes we have all read the rules and obviously knew them enough to get accepted into the community. Sometimes people mess up unintentionally and have never had any points or reports on them prior and get tossed a week ban being told "Re-read the rules" well some people have an easier time learning things hands on than reading words. So I think the mentor would be a very helpful tool for people. Not saying this goes to all people. Those that break the rules and KNOW they break the rules should not be apart of the community in the first place.

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Brad    158

Perhaps give them a chance to learn by example, instead of getting thrown in the slammer alone.. only to commit the same types of"crime" until they are perma'd.

There are plenty of community members who have shown interest in being an RP Mentor, as can be seen by fox's RP Class Thread.

Yes. Give Fox more traffic with his classes. They are helpful and people aren't very likely to take on something like that themselves so we may as well make it mandatory if they repeatedly express that they need some guidance.

This idea is intriguing.  People aren't necessarily lining up for these classes (as far as I know) so using them as a rehab tool might be very beneficial to those who want to be here but aren't quite grasping the essentials.

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Darion    152

This is really good idea and I support it , the community needs this now more then ever

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Destinwolf    13

I say that the only rehabilitation a rule breaker needs is reading and paying close attention to the report he is involved in and taking everything said into consideration, as well as analyzing the verdict a GM has given. It's a creative idea you have here, Joff, I'll give it that, but I think the system that's currently in place is what's best for now.

I would say though, however, give it a test run and see how it works out. We wouldn't really know how beneficial this could be until we see it in action.

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Guest   
Guest

This is actually a VERY interesting idea.  As a follow up what would you all think of a staff section known as "Mentors".  To become a mentor you have to be in the community for a decent amount of time and probably have no excessive warning points.  Something like that.

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Boston    776

snip

snap

This idea is intriguing.  People aren't necessarily lining up for these classes (as far as I know) so using them as a rehab tool might be very beneficial to those who want to be here but aren't quite grasping the essentials.

Like the others have said, this would bring Fox's RP program some more attention. I've already signed up before this thread was created for the very same thing, learning to get better and stay out of reports. Now others will sign up, too. :D

On the subject of the American Prison System: I think that some punishments can be very harsh for petty things. I understand that there's the "extenuating circumstances" addition, but other than that, it seems that if you slip up once, and the person you're dealing with makes a report over said slip up, you'll get a ban for a simple mistake.

Also, continuing off the last paragraph, I feel like staff should consider the accused's defense as much as they do to OP statements in a report. It seems as though the staff point fingers a lot of the time, and more often than not, someone who is accused is basically interrogated in a public report. It's embarrasing when you get seemingly berated in front of the whole community (or those paying attention to the report). Simply put, I feel like the OP of reports is treated like they just got punched in the stomach, and staff is like "Oh my goodness! Are you okay?" and then staff gives you the evil eye when you're accused of something. Rulebreaking is wrong, and rulebreakers need to learn to better themselves, but I think the way it's currently handled where you're receiving negative (Mean, for lack of a better term) criticism. Rather, it should be constructive.

Here's an imaginary situation where someone screamed in the middle of RP for no reason. Instead of saying things like:

"The way that this situation was handled was very poor, in staff's eyes. The accused came and yelled right in the middle of RP, and completely and totally broke immersion within the situation... Not at all what we expect on these servers at any given time." 

Could be replaced with:

"The situation could have been handled better, is how we see it. The idea of yelling something random in the middle of a roleplay session isn't necessarily what we expect on these servers. It should be properly roleplayed out, not just random in the way that you did it. I recommend taking a look at this guide (Insert random RP guide here)."

The second quote is more professional, constructive, and not about making the accused feel bad, but about improvement. One could say both statements are about improvement, which may be true depending on who you are, but the second one shows that they have consideration for your feelings. A staff member once said "There is a person behind every player". Staff should take this into consideration when writing verdicts.

EDIT - Yes, I understand that maybe not all staff is like that, but just something to consider...

The situation above I imagine would have warranted a five-day ban for BadRP, because it broke several people's immersion. This is just my opinion, but it seems standard punishments are rolled out for simple mistakes like that.

But anyways, back on topic, this is a good suggestion and I hope it gets taken into effect. :)

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Hatch    0

Nice idea but the people who commit the offences might not be bothered to take part in the rehabilitation nor may there be "tutors" available.

Ideas like this have been presented before and always get brushed off because people don't have the time nor resources.

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This idea actually gives The Regulators a reason to exist. Break a rule? Get sent to prison island m8.

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Scouser    115

How would this work for people who are decent at role playing but haven't committed an offence? Some people can mess up at any time and do a silly act which can lead to a report.

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Hatch    0

This idea actually gives The Regulators a reason to exist. Break a rule? Get sent to prison island m8.

I think you need to re-read the thread :P

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This idea actually gives The Regulators a reason to exist. Break a rule? Get sent to prison island m8.

I think you need to re-read the thread :P

Nah I'm just taking Joffrey's thought process and applying it to IC. I was definitely and completely 100% serious. Nice try though, you almost got to correct somebody. :P

PS. You could actually make this work IC though, you're forcing the players into a very controlled environment where they can RP and be monitored.

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Dougie    23

Nice idea but the people who commit the offences might not be bothered to take part in the rehabilitation

+1

I feel like none of these crazy, rulebreaking rascals are going to want to calm down their uncivilized ways

Interesting idea nonetheless

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Guest Doug Quade   
Guest Doug Quade

TBH , the problem is twofold.  

#1 - The whitelist system, which only reinforces how people read a page of text. Does not offer multiple scenarios where a applicant has to actually apply the rules.

#2 - The good ol "common sense" to apply to people and how they interpret the rules (and all grey areas) 

I suggested sometime back, to have S3 setup as password-ed test server for applicants to be brought on to the server in small groups to test their RP cred, as well as some basic scenarios to see if they understand the rules.  It is like building the RP Masterclass into the application process.  Yes it takes more time up front, but how much time could it potentially save, in report, investigations, whitelist app processing etc.......

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