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Nova_Ethridge

Alternative to "death"

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I'm on a suggestion frenzy today! This one is probably a little more feasible.

Instead of dying in game, replace a character's death with incapacitation. Here's how it works:

1. When a character is reduced to zero blood, they pass out in a manner similar to being unconscious, but much longer-lasting, and with a red hour glass rather than a green one.

2. The character remains fully incapacitated for up to ten minutes. During this time, another player can apply a blood bag to the downed player to awaken them early, but they will suffer from incapacitation sickness (see below).

3. Once the player receives medical attention or recovers, they are immediately afflicted with incapacitation sickness, which lasts for ten minutes and has the following effects:

  • The player is constantly "out of breath" and cannot sprint.
  • The player is afflicted with the pain effect, which cannot be cured by painkillers, making aiming a weapon extremely difficult.
  • The player will randomly pass out. The chances of this happening are roughly half of the typical 1% from low blood.
  • To help prevent a "death loop" that could be caused by this condition around zombies, zombies are far less likely to notice a player that is either prone, crawling, or crouch-walking while under the effects of incapacitation sickness.

Why?

Some people have a real problem following the NLR. A real problem. So much so that they make up excuses as to why it was okay to return to a firefight or their corpses. Now, obviously, they could be reported, but that's all after the damage is done, and it ties the admins up with having to investigate the claim.

This system would essentially ensure that a player killed in a fight would have to wait at least ten minutes before they could effectively fight again. It would also allow an alternative to death, as (from a roleplay standpoint), the character awakens some time later, battered and bruised, but alive, and limp their way to safety. Furthermore, it would mean that bandits that end up attacking their prey could still leave some items on their bodies that wouldn't decay when the corpse decayed. It would also allow a form of kidnapping, as you could beat (or shoot, I guess) your victim into incapacitation and then drag them away.

Potential Problems

I'm not sure if Arma's code will allow you to loot a player that is unconscious but still technically alive. Since incapacitation would basically be a form of long-lasting unconsciousness, I'm unaware of whether or not the game would allow you to loot an incapacitated player.

KOS rules would still have to apply. Shooting someone into incapacitation without provocation would still be punishable. The fact that the player isn't killed and respawned wouldn't take away from the kill itself.

The player needs a way to allow their character to die. Perhaps logging out and back in while incapacitated would cause death.

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   0

That would be very hard for the lonewolf.

Imagine getting kill by zombies and staying on the ground for 10+ mins without being able to do anything.

And since you are alone, no one can help you...

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Alan Woods    3

it looks like a nice idea

but it should be optional...

like if I want to continue, we'll follow this, but if i want to die, i simply die and respawn

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Skippy    4

I would be ok with this, if it took more than one bloodbag. Say three blood bags, one morphine, one painkiller, one antibiotic. Also if you lost your skin, since I'd rather not have every single person running around in a ghillie, unable to die.

Speaking of unable to die, I would also like a scrollwheel option to execute people that're knocked out.

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Rel    0

You do really come up with creative ideas that can be used to solve problems, but that being said, bullets kill people. This isn't pokemon, you shouldn't just "faint" whenever you are hurt.

This is a military simulator game. If you die, you die. If you die and break the NLR, expect a punishment. It is already that simple.

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Livs    0

I have to agree with Rel on this one. It would be silly to only pass out from being shot with a .50cal rifle...

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You do really come up with creative ideas that can be used to solve problems, but that being said, bullets kill people. This isn't pokemon, you shouldn't just "faint" whenever you are hurt.

In that case, I expect everyone to rename their characters every time they die, and to sever all ties with previous friends, since they're dead, after all.

This is a military simulator game. If you die, you die. If you die and break the NLR, expect a punishment. It is already that simple.

You're not arguing realism, are you? In a world with respawning items, zombies, people that magically "log out" of reality from time to time, and arbitrary rules that prevent people from shooting others on sight?

Either dying is dying, or it's not. If it's not, then there needs to be something more concrete than an arbitrary rule that people can break, because it seems like a lot of reports of NLR violations go unpunished because of how hard they are to prove.


I have to agree with Rel on this one. It would be silly to only pass out from being shot with a .50cal rifle...

It's also silly that whenever someone dies, another person with the exact same name, background, history, and friends magically finds himself waking up on the beach and just picks up where his buddy left off.

Someone should try and locate the Chernarussian cloning facility we're all hatching out of.

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Jerry    15

This server is very far away from hardcore role playing, and that is what you're trying to look for? only a select few people make new characters..its just better to stick with one character if its what you enjoy. Remember this is still a game.

People are also bound by clans and everyone gets friendly with each others characters, so if people go off changing them everyday no one will be able to keep track of your character

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Mavasaur    0

We try to make this server as real as possible. But it's a video game, and we can only take it that far. With that said, it's not hard at all to prove someone broke NLR.

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This server is very far away from hardcore role playing, and that is what you're trying to look for? only a select few people make new characters..its just better to stick with one character if its what you enjoy. Remember this is still a game.

That's my point. It's a game. And in a game, you can survive a bullet to the head and wake up later on, near death but still breathing.

My suggestion would not only resolve the whole "clones on a beach" issue but also prevent NLR abuse. It's win-win.

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Rel    0

Bottom line is, this is never going to happen. /thread.

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Jerry    15

"Clones on the beach" actually provide good roleplay which in my experience people have done quite well, E.G. waking up dazed and not knowing what exactly is going on.

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Tosme    0

There is the faint mechanics already for this when you're low on blood.

Death means death, even by a swing from a zombie or a 50. cal to the head.

And it sounds like it would take alot of time to come up with a new background story every time you die, not to mention making new clans every single time.

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"Clones on the beach" actually provide good roleplay which in my experience people have done quite well, E.G. waking up dazed and not knowing what exactly is going on.

That's what I go for when I'm "killed", the issue is that people get picked up by friends and deposited back into firefights. Yes, I'm well aware that they can be reported, but why be so vehemently opposed to a solution to the problem?

Hell, even if it's applying incapacitation effects on respawn, at least it would keep people from being able to quickly return to a fight.

I mean, from an IC perspective, either a bullet to the head kills you and you recreate a new character, or it doesn't kill you and you awaken sometime later. Either or.

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Livs    0

So if a firefight is going on.. 5 vs 5 people. They kill 4 people each, only 2 left. These 2 people then manage to resurrect 1 person, who then resurrects another person.. 5 vs 5 again, they continue the fight, they die again, repeat..

Did I mention I hate paradoxes?

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So if a firefight is going on.. 5 vs 5 people. They kill 4 people each, only 2 left. These 2 people then manage to resurrect 1 person, who then resurrects another person.. 5 vs 5 again, they continue the fight, they die again, repeat..

Did I mention I hate paradoxes?

Did you read the part where I talked about incapacitation sickness? Players that are revived by medics are out of breath and in pain for ten minutes after the revival. Aiming a weapon is virtually impossible in that condition.

Not to mention these medics would have to stop firing and break cover, exposing themselves in order to revive their teammates, who would then, in their severely weakened condition, have to reacquire targets while low on blood and try to fight with severely shaky screens while occasionally passing out.

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Livs    0

They would still be alive and able to kill, doesn't change that fact.

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They would still be alive and able to kill, doesn't change that fact.

Doesn't change the fact that they can come back fresh, loot some weapons, and be at full fighting strength as it currently is, either.

Oh, sure, they can be reported for NLR. And hours later, long after the fight has ended and their unfair tactics have paid off, one or two of them might get a character reset and maybe a ban...if there's proof...if the logs didn't poof...and if they didn't transfer their items and the gear of their enemies to their friends that didn't get banned.

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Tosme    0

Incapacitation effects can be cured with epi-pen, since that's how the "knock-out" works in this game. You can even load their bodies into vehicles if you drag them.

There's just some things that cant be changed, unless you rewrite the entire game.

And respecting the rules makes things a little easier around here.

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Livs    0

People who do not follow the rules are eventually removed from the community. This is what the banstrikes are for.

If a player breaks the NLR just 3 times, he's out.

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Incapacitation effects can be cured with epi-pen, since that's how the "knock-out" works in this game. You can even load their bodies into vehicles if you drag them.

There's just some things that cant be changed, unless you rewrite the entire game.

And respecting the rules makes things a little easier around here.

That was my point. I was looking for a discussion on whether or not it was possible, the pitfalls and benefits, etc.

I wasn't looking for "Yeah, stupid idea, not realistic, end of story."

It's just that implementing a temporary "debuff" that makes fighting after you've been killed nearly impossible would go a long way towards preventing, or at least curbing, the whole "firefight NLR" issue. I don't care if it's a little less "realistic". This entire game is a balance between realism and gameplay.

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Tosme    0

You used to get a 10 minute knockout timer when you died for...4 months ago or so, but they patched it due alot of rage.

Doubt it's doable to get it back.

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You used to get a 10 minute knockout timer when you died for...4 months ago or so, but they patched it due alot of rage.

Doubt it's doable to get it back.

Even that would be fine with me. My idea was to simulate being in severe pain and grave injury, but even a 10 minute KO would solve a lot of problems.

Who are these people that die so often that the 10 minute timer is such an inconvenience?

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Tosme    0

Lets say you spawn near a building.

You're knocked out for 10 minutes, and when you have 2-3 minutes left a zombie finds you and starts nomming on your legs.

As your timer expires, you die after a few seconds due low blood.

A new timer appears and you spawn next to a building again.

This was the main reason why it got removed.

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