Jump to content
Server time: 2017-08-18, 12:32

Sign in to follow this  
Wunsleh

Abusing the 'new-spawn' status okay or not?

Recommended Posts

Wunsleh    10

what I mean with this is running around with a hatchet in a firefight pretending to not be involved. this causes the opposing party not to shoot due to fear of kos, rightly so.

then the pretending new spawn goes around a corner grabs his main weapon and lits up his enemy.

I think its a disgusting way of going about, technically using the kos fear of others not to get shot only to shoot them later.

what do you guys think?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
   61

i think it should be reportable for abusing game mechanics, ruleplaying or something?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Bloody    0

This is why in a firefight you can't trust civs sticking around. To be safe you should initiate on all civs in the area and hold them captive till the fight is over. This happen to me, I was helping defend desal from an Al-Takizh attack and a civ was running around in the field. We told him to leave but didn't. After I shot an Al-Takizh guy. The civ runs up to me saying "do you need help?" I needed a blood bag and morphine so I asked if he had med. exp. he said he couldn't get the option. So I told him it's fine get out of here. He them sprays me down. Saying "you picked the wrong side". Now I know you can't trust anyone you don't know. If you ask them to leave and they don't you should hold them captive as suspicious enemy's.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Oldman    22

How is this abusing game mechanics? You can put a gun in your backpack and a hatchet in your hands. Yes in the game you can just switch really easy, but calling that abusing is silly.

And yes, it is a low move if you do it in a fight. Specially if you are a random without tag that somehow gained kosrights. To be honest I have never seen this happen to me. I have been fighting a lot of civillians that seem not involved, but not with hatchets out and blatantly flanking around.

When did this happen to you?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wunsleh    10

How is this abusing game mechanics? You can put a gun in your backpack and a hatchet in your hands. Yes in the game you can just switch really easy, but calling that abusing is silly.

And yes, it is a low move if you do it in a fight. Specially if you are a random without tag that somehow gained kosrights. To be honest I have never seen this happen to me. I have been fighting a lot of civillians that seem not involved, but not with hatchets out and blatantly flanking around.

When did this happen to you?

multiple time, most recently today. only he didn't kill me because i caught him in the act.

if you think about it, it's using ooc information (the information that the other guy is afraid of killing him due to being reported) to gain ingame advantages.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
   0

Yes it's grey area, but it goes against our rules "Use the knowledge of game mechanics to create unreasonable or unrealistic scenarios."

You should report it if you see it.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Reacher    0

^

Exactly.

Additionally, what he meant Oldman, is that people are pretending as through they don't have guns, with hatchets out [which is fine]; but then those same people are actually involved in the fight, being on the opposing side, and are using their status/appearance as a 'fresh spawn without weapons' to flank and then shoot at them.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wunsleh    10

I might have footage, but i'm not sure because i literally ran out of hdd space during my recording, gotta love fraps videos :P

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Leguminosae   
Guest Leguminosae

How is putting a weapon in your backpack breaking the rules? thats just plain bloody crazy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wunsleh    10

How is putting a weapon in your backpack breaking the rules? thats just plain bloody crazy.

that's not the point i'm trying to make. when there's a firefight and you pretend your not involved while in fact you are, you cause confusion.

People are afraid to kill innocent bystanders, but when someone uses that knowledge to pretend he's not involved, he uses ooc information to gain ic advantages.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Burgz    6

How is putting a weapon in your backpack breaking the rules? thats just plain bloody crazy.

He's talking about the fact that some people, mid firefight, will hide their weapon to seem innocent. People won't shoot them for fear of risking KOS. It's just a massive dick-move.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wunsleh    10

here's the video. now before you say i'm doing the same thing, i did that to get close to what I initially thought to be someone stumbling in a firefight.

also, the comment later made with baiting is meant that he put himself in the open for enemy snipers to get eyes on him so we could locate them.

[video=youtube]

after i thought a minimum amount of cover was enough i reverted back to my main weapon as seen in the video.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Burgz    6

wait, what did you do differently to what you're talking about?

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wunsleh    10

wait, what did you do differently to what you're talking about?

I wanted to warn the man about the firefight without undue risk of my own, i risk myself to avoid kos for both parties, I could've ignored the man and he could've been shot, thus my reasoning to use the hatchet to get close. Afterwards as soon as i leave that hill you can see me swapping back.

i did not use the new spawn status to gain advantages on the enemy, only to warn the person.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
BobitoZ    0

It seems to me that would fall under God Modding.

A normal human would not do that if it were a real situation.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest John Le Bear   
Guest John Le Bear

wait, what did you do differently to what you're talking about?

I wanted to warn the man about the firefight without undue risk of my own, i risk myself to avoid kos for both parties, I could've ignored the man and he could've been shot, thus my reasoning to use the hatchet to get close. Afterwards as soon as i leave that hill you can see me swapping back.

i did not use the new spawn status to gain advantages on the enemy, only to warn the person.

It is still using the same form of abuse, just for a different purpose.

If you want it to be reportable, then all cases should be, regardless of the purpose.

Saying that, I fully understand your argument and I will make a response later today as I agree with most of what you say.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wunsleh    10

I agree I should have probably used a main weapon, but seeing as that is where the opponent was earlier I'm not going to risk myself for a randomer. I could've easily ignored him and let the guy who shoots him handle it.

Yes i did something similar but in no way did I gain an advantage and that's basically what he did here, seeing as i later found out after the fight who he really was.`

I eventually reluctantly let him live, despite my earlier intention (not in the video), which resulted in the death of Reedy.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
MrDisGood    0

Very clear example of ruleplay over roleplay which I personally find disgraceful but it could be countered with confirming your targets better. So... I'm not sure what to do. Like others said, it's a gray area.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Guest Leguminosae   
Guest Leguminosae

What is stopping you from going and talking to the person with the hatchet? I understand that its a 'FIREFIGHT' (l33t spec ops) but surely if you get fired upon you have teammates to help you, if you get deceived then fair play to the people you're fighting against, and if you accidentally kill the wrong person what ever happened to a good old fashioned apology.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Sin    113

I think Wunsleh handled this perfectly. So he switched to a hatchet for awhile, big deal. He wasn't looting bodies that he didn't have rights to. He wasn't ducking behind bushes and taking aim at the guy who had just warned him off repeatedly. He was the one doing the warning, at potential risk to himself.

Now admittedly, deception and misdirection are part of the game, but if this guy was involved in the fight, or trying to get himself involved, he was doing so under protection of the rules, using the rules to gain unfair advantage. Random civies should not be looting bodies - if they do so, they're risking their lives; as one side or the other will assume they're involved and open fire to protect their winnings. If he was from an opposing clan though, gg.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Ancalagon    0

I can understand wunslehs point.

Running around with hatchets most likely gives you some advatages. f.e. lees people robbing you. Well, thats not a problem, i guess in aapocalypse, i wouldnt show of the most valueble things i have.

What a problem is (and this is my opinion) is, when people know that they will look like an uninvolved civ/randomer with this and they abuse this knowledge, especially in firefights.

Just imagine if a guy would use this (swapping to crowbar/hatchet) to run over a open field (f.e. near radiostation) while there IS a firefight going on and while he IS involved.

IRL, noone would do this. Because they know they would be shot at and because both sides might shoot at randomers aswell.

But he would be aware of the KoS rules and of the fact that this wouldn't happen. And that people won't shoot him if he is just crossing a field with a crowbar because they dont want to get banned. So he freely moves inside of the firefight-zone because of his ooc knowledge about the rules. And then he is going into position somewhere else without taken any big risk while moving positions, taking out his main weapon to kill his enemys. This person would abuse this ooc knowledge, act against all common sense/value of life and gain a advantage in a firefight out of it.

... Not cool imo...

confirming targets in a firefight can be hard enough, even without this...

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Vassal    0

I feel that in a way this is fair but in another way it isn't.

I think that this should be allowed for the purpose that if someone is in an active firefight and decides to declare himself not a threat than pulling out an axe would probably be the best way of initiating a white flag.

At the same time I think that this shouldn't be allowed because people aren't using it as a method of surrender but a method of being sneaky and using it to get an upper advantage that wouldn't be there initially.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites
Wunsleh    10

I feel that in a way this is fair but in another way it isn't.

I think that this should be allowed for the purpose that if someone is in an active firefight and decides to declare himself not a threat than pulling out an axe would probably be the best way of initiating a white flag.

At the same time I think that this shouldn't be allowed because people aren't using it as a method of surrender but a method of being sneaky and using it to get an upper advantage that wouldn't be there initially.

I fully understand your point.

if a survivor stumbles into a firefight I fully understand why he would bring out a hatchet to show that he's not involved and wants out of the area.

however using that same method to get behind enemy lines because you know the opposite party fears they might kos an innocent survivor is the absolute lowest of the low.

I'm still unsure whether or not to pursue this incident. I eventually shot the person and he dropped his weaponry so I didn't kill him. He ran off only to come back to Prud later and kill two of JBG, which wouldn't have happened if I had decided to drop him back then.

Share this post


Link to post
Share on other sites

Create an account or sign in to comment

You need to be a member in order to leave a comment

Create an account

Sign up for a new account in our community. It's easy!

Register a new account

Sign in

Already have an account? Sign in here.

Sign In Now

Sign in to follow this  

  • Recently Browsing   0 members

    No registered users viewing this page.

×