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Server time (UTC): 2023-01-27 04:19

Hitler vs Stalin


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Why is it acceptable to have clans that support soviet union in any time period. But unacceptable to have a clan support Nazism. In the second half of the twentieth century, Americans were taught to see both Nazi Germany and the Soviet Union as the greatest of evils. The most widely accepted figure is around 20 million for the amount of people killed by the Soviet Union under the leadership of Stalin. While 6 million is the most commonly accepted number for people (Russians, Jews, Gays, ect). Now I know it can be argued that "A Nazi clan would be far to offensive". But my father as close as my parents grew up with Stasi rule. Which in comparison with Gestapo did not kill as many people, but they treated people in general the same. As lowers; So when I see a semi-controversial clan that supports an idology that most people tend to not accept it kinda irritates me. Also to any admins, GM's or whoever has permission to close this, please dont just because a debate is going on. Keep in mind a debate is differently then flaming.

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  • Emerald

*is not touching this discussion with a ten-foot pole.*

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I think it has to do with Nazis specifically hating races and certain groups of people. While soviet laws weren't directly against races of people and just the idea itself got people killed.

But they did have issues with specific nationalities and races at certain points. Also clans have targeted specific groups of people based on race in the past. A good example is Salvation, whose goal was to kill any and all Chernorussians. And they were accepted as a clan for some time.

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*is not touching this discussion with a ten-foot pole.*

Respectable


Are you serious?

Yes i'm serious, thanks for taking my question seriously.

Ok then but why would the nazi party be in chernarus..

Not the Nazi Party ... It would be a Neo-Nazi organization. Are you saying that groups such as "Aryan Guard" would not take advantage of the anarchy going on with the outbreak to target specific groups?

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*is not touching this discussion with a ten-foot pole.*

Respectable


Yes i'm serious, thanks for taking my question seriously.

Ok then but why would the nazi party be in chernarus..

Not the Nazi Party ... It would be a Neo-Nazi organization. Are you saying that groups such as "Aryan Guard" would not take advantage of the anarchy going on with the outbreak to target specific groups?

No, im saying i don't think it would be realistic, why would a non miltary group travel in to the country of the infection.

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*is not touching this discussion with a ten-foot pole.*

Respectable


Ok then but why would the nazi party be in chernarus..

Not the Nazi Party ... It would be a Neo-Nazi organization. Are you saying that groups such as "Aryan Guard" would not take advantage of the anarchy going on with the outbreak to target specific groups?

No, im saying i don't think it would be realistic, why would a non miltary group travel in to the country of the infection.

Their can be groups that support Nazism in every country. Why is it not possible that one was already in Chernarus?

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  • Sapphire

Just think.

Are people taking offense to clans that 'support' Stalin? No.

Would they take offense to Hitler? Most definitely.

Hitler is better known around the world, Stalin... Not so much.

Not saying Stalin was a good man or anything, he was a tyrant. Though he did sign a pact with the British against the Germans (as far as I'm aware), while Hitler was generally bat shit crazy.

My overall thoughts?

Pointless argument is pointless.

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Just think.

Are people taking offense to clans that 'support' Stalin? No.

Would they take offense to Hitler? Most definitely.

Hitler is better known around the world, Stalin... Not so much.

So, its unacceptable because of peoples ignorance?

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Just think.

Are people taking offense to clans that 'support' Stalin? No.

Would they take offense to Hitler? Most definitely.

Hitler is better known around the world, Stalin... Not so much.

^ this. Its also been tried before and has been denied.

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  • Sapphire

sure the Soviet Union killed more people in the gulag system then Hitler. BUT Hitler picked a group of people to try and remove entirely from the face of the planet whilst also trying to take over the globe. If that is not enough of a rezone to see Nazism as a greater evil then Communism then you sir are foolish. Also yes the Neo-Nazi organizations would take advantage of an apocalypse to grab power and commit hate crimes but it is the pure fact that any role play made as a Neo-Nazi is purely made for hate and disparaging of other races. You'd be banned in a week if the clan idea went through think of what you are saying for a single second.

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Why is nazi groups arent so popular or acceptable?

First of all because Hitler had laws agains races. Nobody wants racism in dayzrp.

Second - I'm afraid not 99% of the community are americans. Me for example - I wasn't taught Soviet law is my enemy. I was taught that the axis were beast and not humans.

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  • Sapphire

Each nation would take offense to certain things.

For example, some Australians might take offense to a clan that supports Hirohito as the Japanese bombed Darwin during World War 2, killing more people than at Pearl Harbour.

I personally would not take offense to that, as this is a game. Not some attempt to brainwash young men and women in order to create a huge army to take over the world lead by a resurrected Joseph Stalin.

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Because Hitler's plan was to sistematicly wipe out some nationalities(including mine)religions etc. and put the Arian race in its plafe. Stalin is known to have killed millions aswell. But the Soviet union had other leaders, not just Stalin and they were bettee. Hitler=Nazi germany=beign offended.

The partisans and the commies in my country stopped the Nazi plans to exterminate us. I have nothing against commie clans as they are a big part of this region(Russia etc.).

Nazi clans, i wouldn't be offended by it, but i would not like it.

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  • Sapphire

Because Hitler's plan was to sistematicly wipe out some nationalities(including mine)religions etc. and put the Arian race in its plafe. Stalin is known to have killed millions aswell. But the Soviet union had other leaders, not just Stalin and they were bettee. Hitler=Nazi germany=beign offended.

The partisans and the commies in my country stopped the Nazi plans to exterminate us. I have nothing against commie clans as they are a big part of this region(Russia etc.).

Nazi clans, i wouldn't be offended by it, but i would not like it.

Nicely said.

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sure the Soviet Union killed more people in the gulag system then Hitler. BUT Hitler picked a group of people to try and remove entirely from the face of the planet whilst also trying to take over the globe. If that is not enough of a rezone to see Nazism as a greater evil then Communism then you sir are foolish. Also yes the Neo-Nazi organizations would take advantage of an apocalypse to grab power and commit hate crimes but it is the pure fact that any role play made as a Neo-Nazi is purely made for hate and disparaging of other races. You'd be banned in a week if the clan idea went through think of what you are saying for a single second.

I can understand that Nazis are the greater evil. I was not arguing that. And again I point out Salvation was acceptable and had a such a derogatory standpoint on Russians, or anybody that isn't American. And hate, yes hate would be a stand point. But is that bad in RP? You cant have everyone be little angles. You need to let people be hated or hate others. It allows a chance for terrific character development. And its all in the name of RP, and it shouldnt be an issue. If someone really had an OOC issue with them. They could ask them in OOC to avoid them. And I would hope the clan would respect that.


Why is nazi groups arent so popular or acceptable?

First of all because Hitler had laws agains races. Nobody wants racism in dayzrp.

Second - I'm afraid not 99% of the community are americans. Me for example - I wasn't taught Soviet law is my enemy. I was taught that the axis were beast and not humans.

I understand that. Im just pointing out that Americans tend to have very directed motives from birth. If you ask any American now im sure they will say Communists are bad. I am not an American I am a German. I was just using them as an example.

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  • Sapphire

Why is nazi groups arent so popular or acceptable?

First of all because Hitler had laws agains races. Nobody wants racism in dayzrp.

Second - I'm afraid not 99% of the community are americans. Me for example - I wasn't taught Soviet law is my enemy. I was taught that the axis were beast and not humans.

I'm American and I was taught that singling out a person based on race is completely and utterly wrong, it actually sickens me you would even want to play as such a despicable group of people. I know what the Soviets did I know what all the large dictatorships have done and I know the dumb things my country has done. The reason why it is wrong to support Nazism to me is probably the same as it is to you to support Soviet Communism.

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Because Hitler's plan was to sistematicly wipe out some nationalities(including mine)religions etc. and put the Arian race in its plafe. Stalin is known to have killed millions aswell. But the Soviet union had other leaders, not just Stalin and they were bettee. Hitler=Nazi germany=beign offended.

The partisans and the commies in my country stopped the Nazi plans to exterminate us. I have nothing against commie clans as they are a big part of this region(Russia etc.).

Nazi clans, i wouldn't be offended by it, but i would not like it.

I used Stalin because he was the leader at the same time as Hitler so I could use that as similar ground. And I understand that he targeted specific races. And I have pointed this out many times already, but there has been clans in the past with similar goals. They were just targeting in the extermination of nationalitys instead of race


Why is nazi groups arent so popular or acceptable?

First of all because Hitler had laws agains races. Nobody wants racism in dayzrp.

Second - I'm afraid not 99% of the community are americans. Me for example - I wasn't taught Soviet law is my enemy. I was taught that the axis were beast and not humans.

I'm American and I was taught that singling out a person based on race is completely and utterly wrong, it actually sickens me you would even want to play as such a despicable group of people. I know what the Soviets did I know what all the large dictatorships have done and I know the dumb things my country has done. The reason why it is wrong to support Nazism to me is probably the same as it is to you to support Soviet Communism.

Your right, our reasons are most likely the exact same. And I understand that it would sicken you to RP as a person such as a Nazi. But because you can take on the persona of an evil persons does not mean your evil. I use to play on a Metro RP server. And if you have played Metro you know the Fourth Reich. The server allowed them and the community still worked in a very respectable fashion. While on the server it was not just Germans or Americans or Russians or Jews or Catholics or Atheists. But a mix of all of those.

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  • Sapphire

I'm American and I was taught that singling out a person based on race is completely and utterly wrong, it actually sickens me you would even want to play as such a despicable group of people. I know what the Soviets did I know what all the large dictatorships have done and I know the dumb things my country has done. The reason why it is wrong to support Nazism to me is probably the same as it is to you to support Soviet Communism.

What Trimbly said. ^

Stalin will be forgotten as a tyrant, while Hitler's actions still have repercussions today.

And in Australia, we aren't taught that Communism was 'bad', rather that Communist governments were bad, as they didn't live up to the ideals and instead lead their countries to ruin and war.

Our very own Labor party has a communist history, we were just fortunate that they never won the election.

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  • Sapphire

Go ahead and make the clan then make it about killing all Blacks, Jews, Gypsies, and Homosexuals in Chernarous but if you do understand you are very very likely to get banned. Also I doubt very highly you will get many people who would want to role play with your clan or that you would ever be able to role play well enough to not make a complete ass out of yourself. Drop this idea I implore you.

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Go ahead and make the clan then make it about killing all Blacks, Jews, Gypsies, and Homosexuals in Chernarous but if you do understand you are very very likely to get banned. Also I doubt very highly you will get many people who would want to role play with your clan or that you would ever be able to role play well enough to not make a complete ass out of yourself. Drop this idea I implore you.

I wasn't planing on making a clan with those ideas. I dont care to RP as that, I was just looking for the reasons people are okay with Communists over Nazism. I understand now that its not the way they killed or the amount they killed. Its how they targeted specific groups.

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