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Server time (UTC): 2021-07-31 06:15

Lore Event - "The Scientists"
TODAY | 2021-07-31 19:00:00 (server time) | Starts in 12 hours, 44 minutes | Nyheim City

S1 - Invalid Execution - 2021-06-27 ~4:55


cjackson821

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  • Diamond
Posted (edited)

Server and location: Server 1 - Nyheim

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): 2021-06-27 ~4:55

Your in game name: Jack Williamson

Names of allies involved: None

Name of suspect/s: Unknown

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): N/A

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): Video Included 

Detailed description of the events: 

Was walking through the north part of the city outside the main walls when I happened across @Millie and another individual in a house. I began talking to them when a large group wearing pink armbands ambush us from behind and tell us to put our hands up. We comply and are brought to a house where the group in pink armbands is attacked by a different group in orange armbands. The two groups begin to shoot at one another. @Millie and I are talking to them telling them we have no idea who the other people are and keep insisting we have no involvement with them. People were dropping all around us and we kept insisting we do not know who these people are. Then out of no where while I am tied up and laying on the floor I am invalidly executed by the man at the end of the hall with a mosin who was one of my captures. This directly violates rule 4.6 :
 

Spoiler

4.6 If you successfully capture a player through a hostile action and then take him into your custody, he is now considered your hostage. You must do everything in your power to keep your hostages alive and in a relatively good health. That includes protecting them from external threats like zombies and leaving them with a realistic chance of survival when they are released. A character that is taken hostage may be executed once for a hostile incident that happened in the past where the hostage was personally responsible for a death of a member of your approved group. In any other circumstances, hostages may only be executed in the following scenarios:

Hostages do not comply with your demands after repeated requests or try to escape.

Hostages pose a direct threat to you or your group, for example by picking up a weapon when not allowed to.

Hostages do not value their life, for example they repeatedly talk back or insult you despite being told to stop.

Approved group of the hostage refuse to negotiate or open fire on hostage takers.

Demands from negotiations with approved group of the hostage have not been met after a reasonable time has elapsed.

I was not given any demands at the time of my execution nor was I trying to escape. At the time I did not pose a direct threat to anyone as my hands were tied and I was not insulting or talking shit about my captures, I kept insisting that I had no involvement when the orange armband shooters. Also, I am not apart of any approved group and no real negotiations were open when I was shot by the man with the mosin. 
 

 

Edited by cjackson821
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  • Game Master

Connection Logs:

Spoiler

04:05:43 | Player "Jack Williamson" is connected
04:59:36 | Player "Jack Williamson" has been disconnected
05:54:09 | Player "Jack Williamson" is connected
07:50:02 | Player "Jack Williamson" has been disconnected

03:35:52 | Player "Holiday Otradovska" is connected 
05:02:59 | Player "Holiday Otradovska" has been disconnected
05:05:21 | Player "Holiday Otradovska" is connected
07:12:21 | Player "Holiday Otradovska" has been disconnected

02:55:46 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" is connected 
05:02:59 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" has been disconnected
05:06:34 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" is connected
06:31:55 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" has been disconnected

Hit Logs:

Spoiler

04:58:26 | Player "Jack Williamson" (DEAD) [HP: 0] hit by Player "Zachary Kazwinski" into Head(0) for 92.2441 damage (Bullet_12GaugeSlug) with Benelli M4 from 16.2876 meters 
04:58:26 | Player "Jack Williamson" (DEAD) [HP: 0] hit by Player "Zachary Kazwinski" into Brain(37) for 92.2441 damage (Bullet_12GaugeSlug) with Benelli M4 from 16.2876 meters 

04:58:29 | Player "Holiday Otradovska" [HP: 8.12302] hit by Player "Zachary Kazwinski" into Torso(15) for 91.811 damage (Bullet_12GaugeSlug) with Benelli M4 from 16.7091 meters 
04:58:30 | Player "Holiday Otradovska" is unconscious
04:59:12 | Player "Holiday Otradovska" regained consciousness

05:09:43 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" (DEAD) [HP: 0] hit by Player "Shiesty Guy" into Head(0) for 88.4376 damage (Bullet_762x39Tracer) with AKM from 12.0711 meters 
05:09:43 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" (DEAD) [HP: 0] hit by Player "Shiesty Guy" into RightLeg(4) for 106.125 damage (Bullet_762x39) with AKM from 12.7695 meters 
05:09:44 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" (DEAD) [HP: 0] hit by Player "Shiesty Guy" into RightLeg(6) for 54.1567 damage (Bullet_762x39) with AKM from 12.8825 meters 
05:09:44 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" (DEAD) [HP: 0] hit by Player "Shiesty Guy" into LeftArm(29) for 9.02611 damage (Bullet_762x39) with AKM from 13.2293 meters

Kill Logs:

Spoiler

04:58:26 | Player "Jack Williamson" (DEAD) killed by Player "Zachary Kazwinski" with Benelli M4 from 16.2876 meters 

05:09:43 | Player "Zachary Kazwinski" (DEAD) killed by Player "Shiesty Guy" with AKM from 12.0711 meters 

Chat Logs:

Spoiler

04:54:43 | Chat ("Holiday Otradovska": //would I recognize anyone?)

04:54:53 | Chat ("Jack Williamson":  //no)

 

Calling in the following people to post their complete POVs and any evidence they may have:

@cjackson821| Jack Williamson - OP
@Millie| Holiday Otradovska - Posted

@Leucifer| Zachary Kazwinski - Posted

 

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  • Emerald

I open at work and have no time to post a POV this morning; I will be home around 4pm CST to post it though.

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  • Diamond
Posted (edited)

Millie POV:


After a long day of liberating, I decided to unwind by going out to do more liberating with Fin, Skinny, and Kai ( @Ethan-J@Final Krullix@tz) . We had some RP while we were trying to break into the place and I stormed off in a drug-fueled fit of anger, headed back toward the West side. A promising radio message drew me back and I walked through a crowd of people calling themselves the "UGP". They started to circle me but didn't make any immediately aggressive moves so I simply walked back to the others, apologizing to the group but telling them that I was busy and having a shitty day, then locking a door behind me as I went back into the base we were in the middle of raiding. We have a little more RP between the four of us and then I head out to see who the hell all these people are.

As soon as I open the door, I see
two people in pink armbands with guns drawn. They initiate on me and a man in the street who I haven't fully met before IC, but whose voice I immediately recognize as @cjackson821 . We're taken hostage and several more appear while we're led down the street. They lead us to a three-story blue door building (the one with an apartment on the 2nd floor), and put us on our knees in the hallway. A man in a yellow shirt (not the shooter) seems to be in charge of the situation and later says his name is Erik

'Erik' asks me what I know about the city, to which I reply "a lot", and then asks me about the raiders and the fighting club. I start telling them some basic information about the fighting club and shots ring out. I tell them I have nothing to do with whoever's shooting at them. The man in yellow repeatedly threatens to execute both of us if the people outside won't go away. As the standoff begins, a dose of comfort Holly took shortly before being held up kicks in. Around this point I recognize @ImRabbit's voice outside, and then @Final Krullix's. The fighting club makes an initial push and three of the captors go down. At this point I hear Mick, @RPShilo, the only member of my approved group present for the situation, outside. He indicates that he doesn't have a gun and asks to be let inside to negotiate. 'Erik' then threatens to kill everyone with a satchel, including himself and his people.

One of the captors gets back up. He doesn't seem in any rush to bandage himself as he bleeds all over the place, so I offer my medical advice. At this point the
man at the end of the hall, @Leucifer, who I don't believe ever said a word to me, shoots @cjackson821 and then shoots me. While my fellow hostage is shot 'dead', I'm rendered unconscious with flashing red health and a single bleed. I wake up asking them to bandage me and telling them I don't understand why they shot me. 'Erik' begins speaking with voices I recognize as Magnus and Shiesty ( @Duke and @SHIESTY Dongle). Magnus attempts to negotiate my release while Shiesty declares that it's "time for Shiesty to get in" and threatens to kill all of them. 'Erik', left in a standoff with 3 allies and numerous enemies outside, says that he's ready to meet his maker; this following the pattern of no value for life set when he repeatedly threatens to blow all of us up with a satchel charge. A little more RP ensues and the server resets.

As the server comes back up I initially have the car UI glitch, but it goes away when I try to indicate it in side-chat. @Duke asks in side-chat to be informed when everyone's loaded inside. As everyone begins to load in, someone takes a shot at
'Erik' through a window and he says in voice "Oh, someone decided to take a shot a little early I think." Magnus indicates that he has no idea who shot and that there are a few different groups here. He talks to me for a bit, I get his name. After a while another initiation drops and so does one of the captors shortly after. 'Erik' is given a final chance to negotiate and says they might as well just come in and kill everyone, at which point the fighting club pushes. I start shouting the locations of my captors as my rescuers push the stairs, easily overwhelming the two that remain at this point. Narrowly escaping death at the hands of a mad-man with a bomb and a death wish, I'm freed.

Video evidence is attached below. Please excuse the horrific difference in audio volume between my own voice and the recorded in-game audio.

 

 

Edited by Millie
typo; formatting
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  • Emerald

Hi, so, we pulled the hostages into that house or whatever it is, and as we started questioning @Millie; shots go off and one of our team dies. Then, either one or multiple of us, started saying that if anyone were to come in or shoot us, we would kill the hostages (as quoted by Millie as well).

4 hours ago, Millie said:

The man in yellow repeatedly threatens to execute both of us if the people outside won't go away.

Now keep in mind that since one of our men was shot and killed, we ICly assumed that they (the hostages and rescuers) were together since they were killing our guys and trying to rescue our hostages. We said it multiple times and gave plenty of time for the people outside to comply, but they didn't. After our guy(s) started shouting "if anyone is to come in or shoot, we'll kill the hostages", again, the rescuers didn't comply and pushed into the building and killed three(?) of us in the process. We fought them back and there was a break in the gunfire and the guy in yellow started negotiating. While all of this was happening, we had one guy outside radioing that more and more people were showing up and pushing into the first floor and near the staircase (we were up on the 2nd floor) and that's when I decided, since we gave multiple warnings and plenty of time, to kill the hostages. Since @Milliesurvived the shotgun shot, we bandaged her, and tried negotiating again. However, at that point, the rescuers had no intent on trying to negotiate and they came into the house and killed us.

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  • Emerald
Posted (edited)

I would also like to bring up and how at no point or very minimal points did the OP contribute to the RP before or after the shooting started. He seemed frustrated with the entire situation from the start especially when compared to Millie and her very accurate RP of the situation. 

Spoiler

4.4 Hostile situations must focus on the role play experience of both attackers and victims. Both sides should actively participate and contribute to role play in all situations, any disputes or issues can be discussed and resolved afterwards.

  • As an attacker you may NOT:
    • Attack other players just for the sake of gear by doing a quick robbery that involves little to no role play.
    • Ignore your victims. You must provide an engaging role play to keep things interesting for the victims at all times.
  • As a victim you may NOT:
    • Pretend to be fearless, emotionless, not feel pain, or otherwise be unaffected by the situation where your life is at risk in a hostile situation.
    • Be passive during the hostile role play and refuse to actively participate in it. Just sitting there and not contributing to role play can make the situation very boring for the attackers.

During the firefight it is not fair for our group to listen to someone saying “we” meaning Millie and CJack were not involved with the group attacking us. Granted both hostages were shot, but Millie was well taken care of after the the shots were taken because she was actively involved in the situation. 

Personally, I feel as if this entire report would be invalid based on the video evidence provided and the lack of vocal RP coming from CJack as we could have killed him anyways for not being involved in the situation.

 

Edited by Leucifer
Formatting
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  • Diamond
4 minutes ago, Leucifer said:

Personally, I feel as if this entire report would be invalid based on the video evidence provided and the lack of vocal RP coming from CJack as we could have killed him anyways for not being involved in the situation.

As mentioned in the DM's we had discussed that my shadowplay doesn't record my voice and frankly I am not sure why. If you watch @Millie's video evidence you can clearly hear me multiple times talking, so you are literally trying to pull straws. 

Also, as mentioned in 4.6 you are only granted kill rights from negotiations when:
- Approved group of the hostage refuse to negotiate or open fire on hostage takers.
- Demands from negotiations with approved group of the hostage have not been met after a reasonable time has elapsed.

I honestly have never met any of the orange armband individuals ICly and this is the exact reason the rule is set like this. At the end of the day @Leucifer you and your friends decided to try and hold up people in a crowded city and people got caught in the middle. Just because you assume I am with them doesn't mean you are correct and ignorance isn't an excuse to just execute people. Next time you and your friends want to go around holding people up, don't do it in a crowded city area where there are multiple people and dynamics at play if you don't fully understand the rules. 

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  • Administrator

Thank you for posting your POV @Leucifer. Do you have any additional video evidence? If so please post the unedited footage here.

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  • Emerald

No I do not have video evidence as I am not a recorder but there is plenty of video evidence posted. Evidence that clearly shows there is no RP from the OP when compared to Millie. I am not sure if he was not talking on 3 bar or not like Millie was but he was not able to be heard from where I was but even from Millie's POV there is minimal hostage RP with CJack when compared. I took it upon myself to get rid of a possible agent with our attackers because it cannot be expected for someone to stop a firefight or active RP to figure out exactly who they have as a hostage and to coordinate with others on whether or not they are in the group. In fact I would consider that metagaming for information. However, the entire idea of “were dynamic so you can’t attack us in the city” is laughable and to be honest, IC it makes total sense for them to die because they received help that did not back off when we asked multiple times. To be honest that entire idea is not roleplay it’s ruleplay. I'm not mad, nobody even wanted a report  because we were all having fun. This is my closing statement and if you want to talk in the Help Desk or something, I'll be waiting.

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  • Administrator

@Leuciferwe know that you have video evidence. Please post the unedited footage in this report.

I'm also calling in @PrimalKing92 to provide his POV and the unedited footage he has.

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  • Emerald

I just talked to you guys yesterday about this. I literally don't have any video proof. Like, at this point, this is getting a little ridiculous. 

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  • Administrator
1 minute ago, Leucifer said:

I just talked to you guys yesterday about this. I literally don't have any video proof. Like, at this point, this is getting a little ridiculous. 

Think again. 

Screenshot_20210628_133330.jpg

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  • Emerald

Oh, so a quote taken out of context (with a typo) is the ultimate decider for that kind of thing? Tell me, do you have any context of that picture? Hmm? I literally told 3 admins yesterday they could go through my videos on my computer and find jack shit. Give it up and use what video proof you have here; you have everything you need.

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1 hour ago, Bryan said:

@Leuciferwe know that you have video evidence. Please post the unedited footage in this report.

I'm also calling in @PrimalKing92 to provide his POV and the unedited footage he has.

I messaged realize about the video, I have personal information in the recording st the time and I do not wish to submit my property for this report as per I was never called in nor did anything wrong

18 minutes ago, Bryan said:

Think again. 

Screenshot_20210628_133330.jpg

As per my screenshot attached showing proof I messaged realize

Screenshot_20210628-065231_Discord.jpg

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  • Administrator
18 minutes ago, PrimalKing92 said:

I messaged realize about the video, I have personal information in the recording st the time and I do not wish to submit my property for this report as per I was never called in nor did anything wrong

As per my screenshot attached showing proof I messaged realize

Screenshot_20210628-065231_Discord.jpg

This is not a problem, you can submit the video evidence in private to the admin team and we will internally review it discretely.

Also, you have been called into this report by me, please add your point of view of the situation as well, like I asked you to.

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((Pov is from what i remember, it was late and i was intoxicated at the time and as per my request, i will not submit my video as it says my address and phone number in voice as per a joke that ensued in voice , and i will not give that information out to a non policing agency or someone that i do not trust with said information))

 

POV: Me and a couple of my friends head to the town to see the community center and see what we can get into.

we make our way to the down and locate said community center and talk to a few people in the area, after that we head out walking down the road ((cannot remember direction))

We spot two people on the road who we do not know or recognize ((at least i do not)) as said time we approach them and ask them questions, they are jumpy and the answers they were giving us were not adequate, so we tell them to put their hands up and do not touch their radios. They comply ICLY, we talk among ourselves for a minute and bring them into a building

we tell them to lay down and we secure the building. ((yes at this time they are tied up)

we hear people outside and we all yell " you come near the building they all die, put your guns away" 

they do not comply, putting the hostages lives in their hands as per a real life situation. Some chaos ensues and shots are fired, one guy runs up and kills one of my team mates, i open fire killing him, and then immediately get downed, but not dead. passed out i wake back up, scrambling to patch myself and secure the hostages, as said time more people are shooting from outside into the building, ((as i keep passing out and loose sight of anything happening)) We took that initation apon ourselves to shoot the hostages as per our instructions. Jack died, millie wounded, i patch her as she is bleeding and more chaos is ensured untill i die. 

 

  I must urge this matter to be resolved and i suggest calling ALL parties in, the people taking the hostages lives into their hands and any other parties from the logs that will show

We are here to have fun and play a game at the end of the day and we were kitted to the teeth and lost alot more in this situation, but we had a great time and lots of fun.

   Have a good day.

Edited by PrimalKing92
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  • Administrator
9 minutes ago, PrimalKing92 said:

-snip-

Greetings there fella,

As the admin team directly told you in the help desk yesterday, you need to post the video of the situation for the staff team to review no ifs, or buts. If you’re worried about private information being leaked then that is understandable. You can either send it directly to the admin team for internal viewing only or censor/cut ONLY THAT private information as long as the staff team sees that it is confidential information and not other things caught in 4K. Any denials to do this will result in punishment for withholding evidence.

This last line goes to all, both denial/lying about not having video or the staff team finding said video in the future about the situation when withholding it here will result in punishment

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32 minutes ago, Inferno said:

Greetings there fella,

As the admin team directly told you in the help desk yesterday, you need to post the video of the situation for the staff team to review no ifs, or buts. If you’re worried about private information being leaked then that is understandable. You can either send it directly to the admin team for internal viewing only or censor/cut ONLY THAT private information as long as the staff team sees that it is confidential information and not other things caught in 4K. Any denials to do this will result in punishment for withholding evidence.

This last line goes to all, both denial/lying about not having video or the staff team finding said video in the future about the situation when withholding it here will result in punishment

As per my statement, i gave you any and all information i am going to be providing. The video is my property and has personal information in it and i will not be sharing or editing it since i was asked for a unedited version of said video.  ((also have no knowledge on how to edit a video of that nature))

Also i would like to inform as well the screenshot was from a private discord and should not be used, If that is the case i would like to see discord logs for said other parties involved for any discrepancies and unedited videos of other parties involved as well. 

Also i would like to point out to the admins that brought me into the help desk last night, They accused  me of LYING, they were not clear between DM'S and a actual public chat, and i fell attacked and harrassed ((as per my defensive tone and words which i apologized)) as they kept calling my a liar and insisting i know what they are talking about. I had to phyisically scroll up to see what they ment as they were not clear nor showed evidence at the time of said voice call. And i feel threatened about these "consequences" since i was not called in originally, and i urge the staff to reach out to ALL parties of said night to ask for any video evidence or their POV. As per all evidence shows i have not lied or denied any knowledge of any video evidence just forgetfulness as it was late and was intoxicated and do not remeber what was said in  a private discord channel 

Also now i have people harassing me on my fourm profile page and wish this matter to be delt with 6/28/2021 8:44am centeral 

Edited by PrimalKing92
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  • Game Master

Summary:
It's another fine Nyheim day when Jack Williamson (@cjackson821) comes across Holiday "Holly" Otradovska (@Millie). The two are then accosted by individuals wearing pink armbands, affiliates of Zachary Kazwinski (@Leucifer) & Hutch Taylor (@PrimalKing92), and are initiated on. They are then led to a building where their captors can keep a better eye on them. Following this, a crowd begins to collect outside said building, some wearing orange armbands and some not, and shots are exchanged. During this time, a man known only as “Erik” begins to interrogate Jack and Holly, asking them various things before he begins to lead the negotiations on behalf of the hostage takers with the collected group outside. 

As the standoff continues, Zachary decides that the negotiations aren’t going his way, and he then proceeds to execute Jack. As the bloodlust takes over, Zachary then attempts to kill Holly, however he must have gotten distracted as he fails to kill her. Holly then receives medical treatment for her wounds, as the standoff continues towards its climax. Eventually, the crowd of hostiles outside storms the building and clears it of the hostage takers, freeing Holly from this whole sordid affair.
Verdict:
@Leucifer| Invalid Kill (Roleplayed) - GUILTY - As we can see from the video evidence provided, you took it upon yourself to rather randomly execute @cjackson821, who had up until that point been a compliant hostage. Furthermore, as far as we’re aware, @cjackson821 had no affiliation to the group outside or anyone else that collected outside the building. Therefore, the group outside had no obligation to enter into negotiations with you over the life of @cjackson821 or heed any of your demands, the onus was on you and the rest of your group to keep him alive as a compliant hostage. We understand the confusion of the situation, ascertaining the allegiances of your hostages during an ongoing standoff can be tough, but until you’re absolutely certain that the approved group of your hostage refuses to negotiate, you aren’t to execute a compliant hostage.

@Leucifer| Attempted Invalid Kill (AIK) - GUILTY - Similar to your kill on @cjackson821, you attempted to invalidly kill @Millie. This has been deemed as an AIK as, again, negotiations between your group and her official group hadn’t concluded. As such, you shouldn’t be executing a hostage until you’re absolutely sure that their approved group refuses to cooperate with you any further. 

@Leucifer| Lying in a Report & Withholding Evidence - GUILTY - The Staff Team has received numerous screenshots from your group’s discord that show conclusively that you did have additional video evidence that you subsequently refused to upload, even when presented with your own lie. As such, you have been found guilty of lying in a report and withholding evidence. 

@PrimalKing92| Withholding Evidence - GUILTY - Similar to the above verdict, the Staff Team have received numerous screenshots from your group’s discord that show you referring to a video related to this report. Furthermore, when asked by an Admin to provide this video, either privately or publicly, you refused to do so. As such, you have been found guilty of withholding evidence. In future, if there's personal information you'd prefer remain private, then send your video to an Admin like you were asked. It will be treated with the utmost discretion and you can avoid punishments like this. 

@Leucifer& @PrimalKing92| Overall the Staff Team are disappointed with the attitudes displayed within this report. For this reason, alongside the number of rule breaks, the both of you are being put on Final Warning. @Leucifer, the number of rules you have provably broken is enough alone to warrant putting you on Final, regardless of the ones you undoubtedly broke in the video that the pair of you refuse to upload. This is compounded by the fact that you chose to accuse the Admin team of taking screenshots out of context and doubled down on your lie. @PrimalKing92, when asked in Helpdesk for the video you were initially compliant and willing to cooperate, then very quickly your story changed and you refused. You knew you had the video, we knew you had the video, and we all know that video would have provided evidence of yet more rule breaks. However, in the end you still refused to comply with the Admin Team. 
Outcome:

@Leucifer- Invalid Kill (Roleplayed), AIK, Lying in a Report & Withholding Evidence - 7 Day Ban + Final Warning (Aggravated)

@PrimalKing92- Withholding Evidence - 3 Day Ban + Final Warning (Aggravated)
 

Signed - @Queerios, @Lettuce & @Realize

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