S2 Topolin Hosp - Invalid Execution 26/02/20

[Harvey]

Server and location: 

S2 Livonia Topolin Hospital

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): 

Around 11:50PM? 26/02/20

Your in game name: 

Emerson Wilde

Names of allies involved: 

Eddie Sorella @Eddie

Don Mcfarlin @Retro

Name of suspect/s: 

Joyces?

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): 

N/A

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot):

Spoiler

https://www.twitch.tv/muamademoiselle/clip/EmpathicBitterFennelFailFish?filter=clips&range=7d&sort=time

 

Detailed description of the events: 

Alright, quick and cheerful, the Joyces initiate on the hospital seemingly in order to root out any 503 members and order us (Kings Ridge) to refuse service to them if they ever come to our compound. The initiation and holdup went smoothly for the most part aside from a few shots and me, Eddie and Don as well as other visitors such as @cheeks and @Mademoiselle were cuffed and frisked before being led into the back tent for questioning. During this they found a 503 member and held him aside, ransoming him for ammunition and supplies, @Ryan Shepherd (I think?) Told me and eddie that we are not to help the 503 and that if we were to they would come back and repeat the ordeal, we agree and everyone is released. Shortly after the Joyces and their mercenaries are attacked by what I assume were the 503, they attack with grenades so all of the hostages hide under the stairs in the hospital. A guy in a blue jacket comes in and orders the 503 to drop their weapons unless they want the hostages to die. He points his gun at me and after 10 seconds executes me. I am told they begin to execute the rest of the hostages and in a desperate plea to save their lives Cheeks and Mademoiselle shoot the man with concealed weapons but are also killed. It seems that the rest of the hostages shared their fate.

The concern for me is whether or not this was justified considering that none of us were members nor allied to the 503. I cant speak for the few others there, but I think this concludes the executions as invalid. But to make sure I asked and was advised to report.

Edited February 26, 2020 by Harvey

[Mademoiselle]

POV of Diadora Estelle:

Basically what Harvey wrote. The Joyces, An Pobal and others initated. RossTheSauce had not initiated on me whatsoever. 

We were kept hostage which seemed like a complete mess. We were sat down in a yellow tent where I basically remained quiet mostly as it just seemed like people talking over each other to get some sort of roleplay. I resorted to RPing text wise due to myself becoming bored with the situation. We get left go. I collect and nab shit my character wants cause she's a deceiving person. So I take plyers and a can opener as well as stealing someone's cigarette cause she's a smoker. Anyhoe, back onto relevancy. A guy gets shot. I stand beside the wall and nearly get blown up. I move and encourage everyone to come under the hospital. We're waiting out this firefight. 

Apparently a 5.0.3 is in the hospital and before we know it people were getting shot in the head. No torture RP. Nothing. I resorted to attempting to defend for my life as they just gassed compliant hostages. RosstheSauce who never initiated on me, kills me. He did not have kill rights.

End of story.

I would like to add, could've RP'd and tortured people or shot them in the leg or shot the wall to create the person to comply. But sadly mine as well as others RP were cut which you can see from the clip Harvey added from my stream.

Not only this but the fact that you did not put roleplay forward. This is far disappointing.

You can hear me mention my disappoint of it just ruining the roleplay. What is the point sitting us there for an hour and a half to abruptly cut it. 

 

Your screenshots from my twitch chat are invalid to basically cut off roleplay. This shouldn't make it some sort of backup / reason to just pop everyone in their head?

Edited February 26, 2020 by Mademoiselle

[Conor]

Kill Logs:

Spoiler

23:52:55 | Player "Emerson Wilde" (DEAD) (pos=<1558.0, 7594.7, 175.9>) killed by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1557.3, 7596.0, 175.9>) with M417 from 1.47986 meters
23:53:05 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" (DEAD) (pos=<1557.7, 7593.0, 175.9>) killed by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1557.5, 7594.3, 175.9>) with M417 from 1.29887 meters
23:53:14 | Player "Matthew Cade" (DEAD) (pos=<1554.1, 7594.8, 175.9>) killed by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1556.9, 7595.6, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.96196 meters
23:53:17 | Player "Bozan Branislav" (DEAD) (pos=<1552.2, 7593.2, 175.9>) killed by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1553.9, 7594.7, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.2659 meters
23:53:47 | Player "Michael Joyce" (DEAD) (pos=<1554.2, 7595.0, 175.9>) killed by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1552.1, 7594.8, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 2.15459 meters

 

Hit Logs:

Spoiler

23:52:55 | Player "Emerson Wilde" (pos=<1558.0, 7594.7, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1557.3, 7596.0, 175.9>) with M417 from 1.47986 meters
23:52:55 | Player "Emerson Wilde" (pos=<1558.0, 7594.7, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1557.3, 7596.0, 175.9>) with M417 from 1.47986 meters
23:53:05 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" (pos=<1557.7, 7593.0, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1557.5, 7594.3, 175.9>) with M417 from 1.29887 meters
23:53:05 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" (pos=<1557.7, 7593.0, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1557.5, 7594.3, 175.9>) with M417 from 1.29887 meters
23:53:14 | Player "Matthew Cade" (pos=<1554.1, 7594.8, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1556.9, 7595.6, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.96196 meters
23:53:14 | Player "Matthew Cade" (pos=<1554.3, 7595.8, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1556.6, 7595.5, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.29274 meters
23:53:14 | Player "Matthew Cade" (pos=<1554.3, 7595.8, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1556.6, 7595.5, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.29274 meters
23:53:16 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1555.1, 7595.0, 175.9>) hit by Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1552.2, 7593.2, 175.9>) with Makarov PB from 3.40817 meters
23:53:16 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.2, 7595.0, 175.9>) hit by Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1552.2, 7593.2, 175.9>) with Makarov PB from 2.65886 meters
23:53:17 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.0, 7594.8, 175.9>) hit by Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1552.2, 7593.2, 175.9>) with Makarov PB from 2.34485 meters
23:53:17 | Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1552.2, 7593.2, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1553.9, 7594.7, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.2659 meters
23:53:17 | Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1551.9, 7593.1, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.3, 7594.6, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.73061 meters
23:53:17 | Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1551.9, 7593.1, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.3, 7594.6, 175.9>) with M417 from 2.73061 meters
23:53:17 | Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1551.8, 7593.1, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.6, 7594.7, 175.9>) with M417 from 3.24478 meters
23:53:17 | Player "Bozan Branislav" (pos=<1551.8, 7593.1, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.6, 7594.7, 175.9>) with M417 from 3.24478 meters
23:53:45 | Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1551.6, 7594.5, 176.2>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1553.6, 7595.6, 175.9>) with Mini-14 from 2.26321 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1553.9, 7595.3, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1551.7, 7594.7, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 2.24541 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1553.9, 7595.3, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1551.7, 7594.7, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 2.24541 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1553.9, 7595.3, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1551.8, 7594.8, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 2.13538 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1553.9, 7595.3, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1551.8, 7594.8, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 2.13538 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1552.1, 7595.1, 175.9>) hit by Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.0, 7595.2, 175.9>) with Mini-14 from 1.89354 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.0, 7595.3, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1552.2, 7595.1, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 1.83305 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.0, 7595.4, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1552.3, 7595.2, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 1.75042 meters
23:53:46 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.1, 7595.3, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1552.3, 7595.1, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 1.75501 meters
23:53:47 | Player "Michael Joyce" (pos=<1554.2, 7595.0, 175.9>) hit by Player "Diadora Estelle" (pos=<1552.1, 7594.8, 175.9>) with UMP-45 from 2.15459 meters

 

Connection Logs:

Spoiler

23:30:08 | Player "Emerson Wilde" is connected
00:23:15 | Player "Emerson Wilde" has been disconnected

22:37:18 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" is connected
23:39:14 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" has been disconnected
23:46:42 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" has been disconnected
23:48:27 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" is connected
00:11:44 | Player "Donothan Mcfarlin" has been disconnected

22:37:58 | Player "Matthew Cade" is connected
00:04:41 | Player "Matthew Cade" has been disconnected
00:25:32 | Player "Matthew Cade" is connected

22:39:52 | Player "Bozan Branislav" is connected
22:59:54 | Player "Bozan Branislav" has been disconnected
23:18:39 | Player "Bozan Branislav" is connected
23:54:52 | Player "Bozan Branislav" has been disconnected

22:46:05 | Player "Diadora Estelle" is connected
23:55:15 | Player "Diadora Estelle" has been disconnected

22:38:40 | Player "Michael Joyce" is connected
23:54:58 | Player "Michael Joyce" has been disconnected
00:14:57 | Player "Michael Joyce" is connected
00:24:49 | Player "Michael Joyce" has been disconnected

 

---

Calling in the following people for their point of view as well as any un-edited video evidence they may have.

@Harvey - Emerson Wilde - OP

@Retro - Donothan Mcfarlin - POSTED

@Cow - Matthew Cade - POSTED

@cheeks - Bozan Branislav - POSTED

@Mademoiselle - Diadora Estelle - POSTED

@ChrisW - Michael Joyce - POSTED

[Cow]

Matthew "Jim" Cade POV: I was one of the hostages for the event in question.

Taken hostage by the mentioned people, it was group hostage RP, everyone complied and they were interested in rooting out any 503 residing etc I had an accent on at the time so I wasn't under any suspiscion. After tying some up, myself included there was some RP etc. One member of the hostages had a 503 armband which was discovered and that lead to them trying to use him to request ammo/nades in exchange for him/other hostages(?) The firefight continued despite this brief conversation. Eventually letting us up after some questioning to the Kings Ridge guards(?) and some IC stuff. We were eventually allow to stand, wiggle out of our binds and told to go grab whatever was left of our equipment, I was released last and saw others picking up their guns, thought I'd heard we could but wasn't sure so I assumed it to be okay so I stowed my shotty and smg without loading them and kept my hand/hands up. A nade was thrown in to the compound after another one of the attacking forces was sniped so 2-3 died and there was some panic, myself and the other hostages ended up in the stairwell of the hospital I had recovered a batter and radio unnoticed so began to double mic, giving some info away as sneakilly as I could given the situation. The accused eventually started to countdown, screaming about killing all the hostages, starting with the KR people, myself and the others some tried to fight back.

Thank you for coming to my RepTalk.

[Mademoiselle]

I’d like to add all the hostages tried negotiating and influencing the guy to come down but wasn’t given a lot of chance. It all seem blanked.

[Roland]

@ChrisW I hope you realize that some of the hostages you killed were not part of 5.0.3 nor their allies and the rule you quoted about hostage executions does not apply and kills are therefore invalid?

Also @Ryan Shepherd (and @AndreyQ, @CJ for reference) I thought there was a common understanding with 5.0.3, Nameless and Joyces and whoever else is involved that the Kings Ridge who are neutral are not to be forced to pick sides with hostile threats like "do not RP with X or else we will continue attacking". Did I not make myself clear enough, do groups need to be archived for this to be understood?

[Ryan Shepherd]

43 minutes ago, Roland said:

Also @Ryan Shepherd (and @AndreyQ, @CJ for reference) I thought there was a common understanding with 5.0.3, Nameless and Joyces and whoever else is involved that the Kings Ridge who are neutral are not to be forced to pick sides with hostile threats like "do not RP with X or else we will continue attacking". Did I not make myself clear enough, do groups need to be archived for this to be understood?

When and where was this 'common understanding' ever discussed with me? That's the first I have ever heard of it.

Why is this group getting special treatment when they are housing what we know IC as a group that housed a rapist, when many trader groups for years with the best intentions of being 'neutral' were dog brained until archive and this special treatment was never issued to them?

Personally, I think this is ridiculous interference with roleplay, we have a feud with the 503 and the 503 are permitted to get medical aid at this hospital, we came to cut off that supply in exchange for Joyce protection on the hospital. I even gave every member of this group once I was satisfied they caught my drift their equipment until this misfortune event took place in the end which I will be posting my PoV on later.

This is a totally unnecessary interference of roleplay.

[cheeks]

So I was RP'ing with the people at the hospital and it was quite busy there. After some time my game crashes and I am in a queue waiting to get back in. 

As soon as i get back in there's people with yellow armbands standing everywhere. There's a pile of unloaded guns and everything else starts loading in.

As I am logging into an active situation I get found and get told to put my hands up, to which I comply. 

I had to drop my bag and guns on the stack and then I was told to move to the yellow tent.

There's some back and forth between the hostages and the hostage takers. And the people at the hospital are told that they can't let any of the 503 in due to rumours about them being inhumane.

They get given a frequency to call the hostage takers in case any of the 503 show up so they can deal with them.

Meanwhile there has been some minor firefights here and there.

Now people are getting told that the situation is resolved so people can grab what was theirs. The hostagetakers will leave once the 503 bring them a supply of grenades. That's what we're being told.

So after a couple of minutes there's grenades being thrown over the walls. The hostages alongside me move in the safety of the hospital stairwell to get cover from gunfire and grenades.

Eventually the guy with the blue coat shows up and gunfire erupts outside. There's word that an enemy of the hostagetakers is inside the hospital.

So the blue guy points his gun to @Harvey's head. And screams that if the guy is not coming down with his hands up, he will start killing hostages. He gets no reply.

He starts counting from ten to one and proceeds to pull the trigger. @Harvey's now dead. His brains all over the wall.

The guy points his gun to the next person and does the exact same.

I believe he does it to another person as well and then he moves in my direction.

As he was sort of distracted by someone, and because I was next I pulled my pistol (that I picked up because I was told I could, by the guy in the tent).

Aimed it in the direction of the guy and started shooting at him.

Spoiler

Hoping it would kill him, and make him stop from shooting the remaining hostages.

He blasts me and that's the end of my POV.

I had no other choice than to fight back, he forced us into defending ourselves. It would have been NVFL if we did nothing and let him slaughter us like animals one by one untill everyone was dead.

[Retro]

POV: originally when the initiation went down I was so shocked by the fact it was just out of the blue nobody suspected a thing and it was well organised to my point of view (good execution on that front lads) . From there there was the same old face the wall and drop all ur gear like what BanditRP is like , but since I was facing the wall I personally couldn't see  what was going on , my bag was dropped when I was told to and I had dumped my gear on the floor down to my clothes , they said after i could put my bag on and so I did , then they asked again to put my bag down ? this was kinda strange in my eyes as to why would they ask me to pick up my bag and then put it back down again.
 

After this we were frisked for radios and then moved to one of the medical tents since it was raining and our health was their responsibility, when we were moved to the tent I was then pulled up and had cuffs slapped on me and told to move to one of the locked gates and was asked to tell them the code , I did and they got in this then lead to them simply saying just walk back to the others , no escort no nothing like I could of walked out for all they knew when they left me be I even said "so am i being left to my own devices or what", they got the jist quick as to what they were doing wrong and then escorted my back to the others. After about 5 or so mins of me sitting around basically hearing us being forced to not help the 503 and @Eddie being forced to shake his hand or else we would be having this problem again i then suddenly crashed as seen in the logs.

I was then trying to reconnect and going through the motions , when I had then logged back in I did the first thing and called out I was still here tied up and where was anyone to show I was not a threat and was still a hostage , I was then picked up by one of the members and then told to run on my own to the inside of the hospital in a active firefight even though I was under his protection, he simply just said go into the hospital and then bolted off just as quick . So i made my way to the door where they were keeping people and I was let in , we were all heard into a corner of the ground floor behind the stairs and we were told to stay here and not move , we all complied to value our own lives and from there things escalated , it happened so fast it was all mostly a blur people were shooting outside and ti was like a nuke being dropped right next to my ears , but after that subsided some guy ran upstairs and people were chasing him and pointing guns and this is where the man in the blue coat @ChrisW showed up.

He would then start hiding himself to use us as human shields as he stated "I am hiding in the hostages if you try anything I will start killing them off one by one". He then immediately points towards @Harvey and counts down from 10 rather quickly , we were telling him and pleading him to stop and dont kill us , at this point in my eyes we were fully compliment and thus couldn't be shot and since we were also not apart of the 503 we couldn't be used as bargaining chips , but either way after the 10 second he shot Harvey in the head and then just as quick points it to me counting down from 10 again in a rushed way giving no time to talk at all . I was asking him to stop and just as quick he shoots me and kills me . 

 

Note: In the stream video given as evidence I was the man in the scrubs with the balaclava and the backwards facing cap as a point of reference. 

 

[Harvey]

I don't know where this notion that we were harbouring 503 members came from honestly. We run the hospital as an RP hub of sorts and do not screen every person that comes in. And even if we wanted to you know damn well a medical group with 1 or 2 security members could not repel 503 or any group for that matter, it just so seems that the 503 like to come to the hospital a lot.

@Ryan Shepherd I completely agree that neutrality should be determined by IC action, but your actions last night literally forced us to not be. If we were to agree to help the Joyce's keep 503 out we would be pitting ourselves against the 503 in your favour, and I'm sure this would apply the opposite way around.

As per my conversation with @ChrisW last night it seems you may need to work on your communications, as he told me he had no idea what was going on and that he assumed that us kings ridge guys under the staircase were 503, when I think it was made very clear in the RP beforehand that we were not. This still does not explain why he attempted to kill all the other hostages however.

 

[Roland]

@ChrisW only one of the hostages you killed are considered a valid kill per hostage execution rules. The three other ones are not affiliated with 5.0.3 who were the ones who refused to negotiate and therefore hostage execution rules do not apply to them.

Invalid Kill (Roleplayed) x3, aggravated - 20 warning points for 2 months, 10 day ban

Solved with @Rover, @Inferno