Meta Gaming Livonia

[G_DateSB]

Server and location: Livonia  9:00pm ish  Tarnov industrial  

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): 9:00pm ish  02/08/2020

Your in game name: Gareth Jones

Names of allies involved: 5.0.3 @C-J @DuquesneLR  @Eagle

Name of suspect/s: Unknown

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): 

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): 

Detailed description of the events: Me and the lads are heading towards Sitnik and got told a BMW is on the way down towards us. We then decide to ambush them at a checkpoint and tell them to exit the car and put there hands up. We then tell them to drop there hands one at a time and drop there radios and bags weapons and vests. After that we get them in the car and drive off to a factory and start asking them questions as one had the an pobal armband on. While we are talking to them Michael takes one to one side of the factory and me and C-J are talking to the other one. While talking we heard someone in this mans radio come through asking where are you. At this point this man does not have a radio and me and C-J start asking "What the fuck is that who is that" He replies im trying to talk to my mate down there. Clearly not his voice we then decide to get them together and then we leave as the location is compromised and ruined the RP we was building at this moment.

Edited February 8, 2020 by G_DateLR

[Eagle]

I get the cars set up and move into the metal structure and joined into the hostage situation they speak for some time and then I heard a weird discord sound and a voice confirming that he was still relaying information whilst having no way of communicating with his group members.
 

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Eagle

[Duke]

Since I'll be called into the report to provide my POV, I'll post in advance.

I was interrogating the other hostage when CJ walks up to me and says some voodoo shit is going on, with noises inside the other mans head asking him where he is, where as he replied.

Then we left as we knew we had just been hard meta'd and therefore had to end the RP prematurely. It is to say that the fella I was speaking to never seemed to be on Discord. Always replying to my answers pronto and concise, while the other seemed more 'off'.

Maybe I should add just in case as I logged out pretty early: I got permission from @Earl to log out, just in case. 

Edited February 9, 2020 by DuquesneLR

[Kermit]

Connection Logs:

Spoiler

- Server restart -
19:28:13 | Player "Michael Duquesne" is connected
21:01:22 | Player "Michael Duquesne" has been disconnected
23:20:13 | Player "Michael Duquesne" is connected

- Server restart -
19:28:49 | Player "Charlie James" is connected
21:59:49 | Player "Charlie James" is connected

- Server restart -
19:28:53 | Player "Yannick Baros" is connected
20:44:51 | Player "Yannick Baros" has been disconnected

- Server restart -
19:28:54 | Player "Riggs Fuller" is connected
21:21:39 | Player "Riggs Fuller" has been disconnected
22:07:13 | Player "Riggs Fuller" is connected
23:58:35 | Player "Riggs Fuller" has been disconnected

- Server restart -
19:29:29 | Player "John Jameson" is connected
20:50:05 | Player "John Jameson" has been disconnected
21:56:47 | Player "John Jameson" is connected
01:29:08 | Player "John Jameson" has been disconnected

- Server restart -
19:32:19 | Player "Gareth Jones" is connected
21:43:55 | Player "Gareth Jones" has been disconnected
21:48:25 | Player "Gareth Jones" is connected
21:49:53 | Player "Gareth Jones" is connected
23:38:33 | Player "Gareth Jones" has been disconnected
23:42:58 | Player "Gareth Jones" is connected

- Server restart -
19:29:00 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" is connected
19:34:45 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" has been disconnected
19:34:57 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" is connected
21:04:31 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" has been disconnected
21:06:04 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" is connected
21:07:21 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" has been disconnected
21:42:49 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" is connected
21:52:44 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" is connected
23:21:02 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" has been disconnected

19:45:29 | Player "Lee Mannion" is connected
21:56:18 | Player "Lee Mannion" is connected
22:31:41 | Player "Lee Mannion" has been disconnected
22:38:54 | Player "Lee Mannion" is connected
23:57:29 | Player "Lee Mannion" has been disconnected

- Server restart -
19:28:13 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" is connected
20:31:55 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" has been disconnected
20:32:04 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" is connected
21:55:10 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" is connected
23:17:54 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" has been disconnected
23:18:05 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" is connected
23:38:22 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" has been disconnected

 

Hit logs:

Spoiler

20:39:06 | Player "Lee Mannion" hit by FAL
20:39:14 | Player "Lee Mannion" hit by FAL
20:39:55 | Player "Lee Mannion" hit by Player "Gareth Jones"  into Head(0) for 3.5 damage (MeleeFist)
20:41:30 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" hit by Player "Michael Duquesne"  into (272) for 0 damage (MeleeFist_Heavy)
20:41:36 | Player "Gareth Jones" hit by FAL

 

Position logs:

Spoiler

20:38:12 | Player "Michael Duquesne" (pos=<9284.6, 11119.6, 187.7>) 
20:38:12 | Player "Charlie James" (pos=<9312.4, 11142.4, 188.7>) 
20:38:12 | Player "Yannick Baros" (pos=<9251.6, 11096.8, 191.7>) 
20:38:12 | Player "Riggs Fuller" (pos=<9244.3, 11043.3, 197.5>) 
20:38:12 | Player "John Jameson" (pos=<9252.9, 11094.7, 191.6>) 
20:38:12 | Player "Gareth Jones" (pos=<9311.6, 11138.9, 187.7>) 
20:38:12 | Player "Hyde Nikolo" (pos=<9284.5, 11120.5, 187.7>) 
20:38:12 | Player "Lee Mannion" (pos=<9311.5, 11141.9, 187.7>) 
20:38:12 | Player "Ramon Pushkin" (pos=<9250.7, 11091, 191.8>) 

 

Calling in the following to post their detailed POVs and any un-edited video evidence they might have.

@DuquesneLR - Michael Duquesne - Posted
@C-J - Charlie James - Posted
@punchie - Yannick Baros Posted
@Atrix17 - Riggs Fuller - Posted
@JJRambow - John Jameson - Posted
@G_DateLR - Gareth Jones - OP
@Earl - Hyde Nikolo Posted
@Leejames123 - Lee Mannion 
@Eagle - Ramon Pushkin - Posted

[CJBB]

CJ's POV

We are out hunting some of our enemies, coming across players here and there. Then our scouts infront radio in saying there is a BMW heading our way with a green armband driver. 

So i get on the old whistle blower with the rest of the lads and plan to stop the car in its tracks a few towns away. We set up an ambush by a road block. making it very difficult for them to even possibly get away. After our plan succeeds and we managed to stop the car and take the two men hostage. we proceed to roleplay. The roleplay was good. I enjoyed it, we had already preplanned what we was going to do with the hostages. So we take them to a warehouse about 1k away from where we took them, after we took away their radios or any form of communication. Knowing the chance of someone finding us would be rather low. 

We proceed to the roleplay, interrogating them on why they left the enemy's town wearing their armbands. Trying to get a confession of sorts out of them. @Earl was the main talker. His roleplay was excellent. The other hostage did not speak so much. not until I got him alone. even before we got him to the warehouse his responses was delayed. It was suspicious but  we gathered it would either be lag or something along those lines. 

We had this fake ploy in trying to get one to rat on the other for being an pobal. in exchange for their life. and in the middle of this process I clearly heard voices that was not his own. Clearly from a 3rd party software such as discord ask for his location. From that point on I was certain there was metagame involved. So I decided to wrap up the current roleplay. because it just put a sour mood on everything we had planned. and no matter where we relocated or took the hostages a gun fight would of happened. As i was running back and fourth between the hostages I also heard a discord mute/unmute. Also If i chose to stay in the location any kills the enemy party obtained would of been invalid due to the use of metagame. 

So we gave the hostages food and water, piled them together and left.  

It was just a shame, the roleplay was going well. and it was spoiled. Missed out on a great opportunity for some development. And you had plenty of time to mute your discord while you was in the back seat of the car. or even when I was questioning your friend. so for us to actually have to call you out in //stop the meta for you to mute your own discord.... doesnt look good at all. 

But yes we will never know if you actually was giving out information, as that is something impossible to prove. but what we can prove here is. Your team mates was still communicating with you, while you had no radio. while you was bound/tied up. so unless its in your prison pocket on loud speaker. I have no clue how you would of role played that out. and to me it was completely impossible to pass or receive any information from your team mates. 

Edited February 9, 2020 by C-J

[ImAtrix]

Riggs's POV:

Riggs and the 5.0.3 boys had just left Kolembrody headed towards Sitnik. We got word that a beamer was headed our way. We made the choice to initiate on the vehicle and have them get out with their hands up. We had them drop their vests, weapons, bags and radios. We put them in a car and set off to a factory where we would interrogate them because one had an An Pobal armband. After a short car ride we arrived at the factory where we took them into a building and started asking. @DuquesneLR separated the two hostages on opposite sides of the building. @DuquesneLR interrogated @Earl while @C-J and @G_DateLR questioned @Leejames123

I was told to go watch the BMW's, about five minutes into watching the car, I heard something over the radio about Voodoo magic. Later I learned that @Leejames123 had been communicating with his friends whilst not having a radio.

I do not have any video evidence, and even if I did I wasn't around at the time of the said incident.

[G_DateSB]

Would also like to edit that he also was also delaying in some responses and looks like he was talking to his members over radio in the times he wasn't speaking again its hard to prove but in the video you see a short break where he doesn't respond to @C-J and then talks then to hear one of the guys over his radio say "Where are you" If staff need any more information please @ me. 

[JJRambow]

JJ POV

I was cold and hungry, I was a little sad as i was not really with the main group as the new people we just meet got seats in the car, I had to walk so I was not happy,
I walked down the road to a factory building after being told over comms, I then walked up to the cars and noticed there was no one looking after the rides someone could easy pull the cars away when we were inside dealing with the new friends. I then stayed outside and later moved the cars closer to the building. 

Sorry my POV isn't that good, I was not part of the main Issue and was just on lookout out of Voice Range. 

  Love Y'all   

[Earl]

POV time:

Me and @Leejames123 were out driving, we then drive thru a roadblock in Grabin. We slow down and 5.0.3 approached us. We then get held up, they take our radios and weapons and get put back into the car. We then drive to Tarnow idustrial. They begin with interrogateing while both me and @Leejames123 beeing present. They ask simple questions and we answer. As I were wearing a An Pobal armband that made it a bit more complicated. They say they were going to talk to their snake inside An Pobal, to find out if we are saying the truth or not of being in An Pobal. After that they divide me and @Leejames123. They then trying to turn him against me to see if I am lying. As I were on the other side of the building I could not hear what they were saying. @DuquesneLR are interrogating me. After a couple of minutes, CJ approches saying "This dude is doing some vodoo magic" (Something like that). They then write some stuff OOC about metagaming and his mic. They then leave me and @Leejames123 there. As I saw and heard that, I saved my last 10 mins thru shadowplay to prove that I were not involved in any discord communication when not having my radio.

Quote

 

 

[Leejames123]

Based off of the evidence provodied by all parties I would like to say that the OP's party was metagaming.. specifically CJ himself. As shown by the gif provided you can see that CJ viewed my profile during the time of the interrogation. The time displayed on the GIF is 12:34 PST Febuary 8, 2020. When convereted to UTC then to military time it is 20:34, which is fairly close to the time that we were tied up and interigated to. You can see in Eagle's video at 4:03 I get hit with a FAL at 20:39 so by using simple math 4 minutes prior would be 20:35, which is only a minute after they checked my profile. On top of that there DuquesneLR claims IC that they have a rat after "checking" but then saying nothing IC over any radio. This is where I believe the metagame had happened.   

 

https://gyazo.com/e742a36aeaa25753b3b9d7583a9fc08b

 

Edited February 9, 2020 by Leejames123
Forgot to post aditional information.

[Duke]

15 minutes ago, Leejames123 said:

On top of that there DuquesneLR claims IC that they have a rat after "checking" but then saying nothing IC over any radio. This is where I believe the metagame had happened.   

We were bullshitting IC. I simply went off into a corner, stayed quiet, came back and made up some stuff. We're allowed to lie to you IC.
It is quite common to make up false accusations to pressure people hard enough to admit it themselves.

As for the rest of the metagaming accusations, all I personally had to go out from was that one of you had a green armband, other than that we had no proof you were An Pobal. Both me and CJ were muted during all of this as his own video shows.

Just own up to it man, it's right there in the video and everything.

Edited February 9, 2020 by DuquesneLR

[CJBB]

14 hours ago, Leejames123 said:

Based off of the evidence provodied by all parties I would like to say that the OP's party was metagaming.. specifically CJ himself. As shown by the gif provided you can see that CJ viewed my profile during the time of the interrogation. The time displayed on the GIF is 12:34 PST Febuary 8, 2020. When convereted to UTC then to military time it is 20:34, which is fairly close to the time that we were tied up and interigated to. You can see in Eagle's video at 4:03 I get hit with a FAL at 20:39 so by using simple math 4 minutes prior would be 20:35, which is only a minute after they checked my profile. On top of that there DuquesneLR claims IC that they have a rat after "checking" but then saying nothing IC over any radio. This is where I believe the metagame had happened.   

 

https://gyazo.com/e742a36aeaa25753b3b9d7583a9fc08b

 

Can I just say through out the whole situation. not once did we say at all IC that you was an pobal or even accused you of being on. I would understand if I magically pulled out of the hat you was an pobal. But you was never accused of being apart of the group. 

You lied about your name.  You said your name was "lee gems" I believe. How would I have gotten from your forum account from a clear fake name. When there is 100's of lee's on the forum. 

 How is that metagaming? The whole "radio" the snake thing. Was fake and it was preplanned to make michael pick a hostage at random for being accused of being an pobal, But I believe he picked the other one due to the fact he was wearing a green armband.

Further more when michael came back he even said specifically ic. That you are not an pobal, Plus on that. I was even convinced IC and OOC that you was no an pobal, Until @Earl came in and apologised for you moments after that situation happened. 

Also If i knew for sure that @Earl was an pobal IC why would I attempt to turn you against him. Why would I go through all that roleplay to get to the point of already knowing. He was under suspicion for being an pobal. where as you was not.  

I would happily leak my DM's with michael about this situation with a GM if requested but I will not be posting it here. It will 100% confirm that the hostage was chosen at random and no metagame took place from our side at all, since the DM's show time stamps it was discussed before he even pretended to radio in. - sent them to fae before even requested to. any other gm is welcome to ask for them.

 

So can I ask the accused WHAT exactly you think I metagamed and WHERE in the experience/interaction it was.

Edited February 10, 2020 by C-J
add more information.

[Scarlett]

1 hour ago, Leejames123 said:

Based off of the evidence provodied by all parties I would like to say that the OP's party was metagaming.. specifically CJ himself. As shown by the gif provided you can see that CJ viewed my profile during the time of the interrogation. The time displayed on the GIF is 12:34 PST Febuary 8, 2020. When convereted to UTC then to military time it is 20:34, which is fairly close to the time that we were tied up and interigated to. You can see in Eagle's video at 4:03 I get hit with a FAL at 20:39 so by using simple math 4 minutes prior would be 20:35, which is only a minute after they checked my profile. On top of that there DuquesneLR claims IC that they have a rat after "checking" but then saying nothing IC over any radio. This is where I believe the metagame had happened.   

 

https://gyazo.com/e742a36aeaa25753b3b9d7583a9fc08b

 

This is not a POV, please provide a detailed POV of the incident from your point of view 

[Scarlett]

@punchie you explained in your POV that you may have recording, please confirm if you have recording or not. If you do have recording please post it with your POV

[Peril]

Because @Leejames123 has interacted with this report and failed to provide his point of view, only claims against the accusing party, he will be temporarily banned until he provides his full and detailed POV of the situation, including the context of the radio messages heard over VoIP at around 4:50 in the original video evidence.

[Duke]

I feel as if my POV was a bit lacking hence I just wish to confirm that CJ is indeed right. There was no metagaming involved and we didn't even go and accuse LeeJames of being An Pobal as to me he seemed like a random passenger compared. I was the one who ultimately decided on who we should accuse of what, and i came back only accusing Earl of being An Pobal for the mere fact he had the green armband. Whether or not CJ had a look at the profile it matters little. As the staff that's been shown the SS can prove. Plus it was me who decided who was accused of what. And you weren't even accused to begin with.

 

On phone sorry for formatting xoxo

Edited February 10, 2020 by DuquesneLR

[Leejames123]

POV, i was wandering around Sitnik, looking for building materials, Earl then picked me up as he offered to give me a lift to any random location to try and locate a friend.

 

As we hit Grabin we where stopped by 5.0.3, Robbed and then we where taken to Tarnow industrial where we where questioned further.

 

I was simply double micing by accident. I'm sure we are all human here and make mistakes. I did not directly respond to my friend on discord about being held up by CJ. 

 

No body acted on the info i was saying. As i didnt tell people who where in the game on discord. There was no meta gaming involved. This was a mistake and not intened malicously. 

 

This is blown way out proportion.

[Peril]

Thank you for your POV @Leejames123, your temp ban has been removed.  Please keep an eye on this report in case of any further questioning.

[Rover]

Verdict

@Leejames123 - Metagaming - Guilty

 

Summary

@Leejames123 and @Earl are taken hostage by members of the 5.0.3 and interrogated. During this event, @Leejames123 is speaking and another voice can be heard asking where he is. (~4:53 in video). This causes the aggressors to begin to cut short the roleplay to avoid any potential repercussions from @Leejames123 potentially warning his group where he is.

 

Reasoning

@Leejames123 - You are not allowed to communicate when your radio is taken from you or when your character is in a bound state; tied up, F1, or F2 animation. As is seen in the video, you are receiving OOC communications while you are a hostage. This is expressly against rule 3.6, and is metagaming. In the future if you are ever taken hostage, mute your discord immediately. There are a few points in the video where your responses clearly seem like you are having a second conversation because of the pauses and delays. Regardless of whether you were or not, we were able to hear that someone in whatever comms you were in was asking your location. 

Quote

3.6 Using OOC communications like Discord, TeamSpeak or others to transmit or receive information related to in game situations is only allowed when you have a personal radio item in your inventory. As soon as your character loses the ability to speak or use the radio - for example has died, is unconscious, has been gagged, is surrendering (F1 or F2 animation), is handcuffed or had your radio item or clothing containing it removed from your inventory - you may not receive or transmit any in game information through OOC communications. While in presence of other players all such communication should also be transmitted in game using "double mic" mechanic. This means transmitting both through in game VOIP and external software simultaneously.

Additionally; viewing a players profile is not metagaming. Taking that information ICly is.

 

Outcome

@Leejames123 - Metagaming - Guilty, 3 day ban and ten warning points, character reset.

Signed: @Fae, @Inferno, @Rover