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Wulf

S2 Livonia Ruleplay/Invalid kill

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Server and location: S2 Nadbor

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): 2019-12-09, 01:50

Your in game name: William Wulf

Names of allies involved: Sid Sandman @SidChaos , Samurai Woman and a Canadian called Mathew

Name of suspect/s: Some robotic native

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): The accused was joyriding a red banana car

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): @SidChaos will be providing a full video of the encounter.

Detailed description of the events: Me @SidChaos and a mute Japanese woman met a pretty cool Canadian dude and we decided to head into town to look for the base @SidChaos had seen earlier. Where we bumped into a robotic native dude. He starts off pretty assertive asking where we was going in that very new to the server way. So me being me decide to engage him in banter to which it sounded like he thought it was funny as his tone quivered at a few points. Which is the classic tell that someone is talking through atleast a smirk. This went back and forth ending with me making a remark after he had removed his mag and filled it with ammo and putting it back on. Saying: "He had no mag in his gun that was our chance." I say this in a very sarcastic and or banterous way almost breaking into laughter as i said it, the others did however break into laughter. Clearly it was a joke... However Captain Livonia over here retorts with "ARE YOU THREATENING ME"

And With a massive grin on my lips i reply with: "Yeah i'm threatening ya"

And he murdered everyone, the end.

@SidChaos Saved the encounter on shadowplay so it will show what happened in its entirety, its currently 5am for him, so expect his video early tomorrow.

Edited by Fenrir

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Kill Logs:

Spoiler

01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" (DEAD) killed by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 8.81008 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" (DEAD) killed by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.35818 meters

 

Hit Logs:

Spoiler

01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 8.81008 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 8.81008 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 8.81008 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 8.81008 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 8.85213 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 8.85213 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.01861 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.01861 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.01861 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.01861 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.24089 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.24089 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.24089 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.24089 meters
01:52:19 | Player "William Wulf" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 9.24089 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.35818 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.35818 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.35818 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.35818 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.35818 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.3946 meters
01:52:20 | Player "Sid Sandman" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 6.40371 meters
01:52:21 | Player "Sumiko Fujiwara" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 13.3976 meters
01:52:21 | Player "Sumiko Fujiwara" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 14.9414 meters
01:52:21 | Player "Sumiko Fujiwara" hit by Player "Jax Kungsgard" with M4A1 from 15.8162 meters
01:53:18 | Player "Jax Kungsgard" hit by ZmbF_ShortSkirt_grey

 

Connection Logs:

Spoiler

00:15:53 | Player "William Wulf" is connected
01:53:52 | Player "William Wulf" has been disconnected -DEAD-

00:16:34 | Player "Sid Sandman" is connected
00:44:09 | Player "Sid Sandman" has been disconnected
00:45:21 | Player "Sid Sandman" is connected
01:53:53 | Player "Sid Sandman" has been disconnected -DEAD-

00:15:53 | Player "Sumiko Fujiwara" is connected
-Still Connected-

00:15:53 | Player "Matthew Steiger" is connected
-Still Connected-

01:31:16 | Player "Jax Kungsgard" is connected
-Still Connected-

 


Calling in the following people for their point of view as well as any un-edited video evidence they may have.

@Fenrir - William Wulf - OP

@SidChaos - Sid Sandman - POSTED

@AFluffyBrick - Sumiko Fujiwara - POSTED

@Matthew Steiger - Matthew Steiger - POSTED

@kranen - Jax Kungsgard - POSTED

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Me, the English Banter Lord, a woman called "Sumuki"? And a chill Canadian dude stumbled upon a driver in Nadbor. After a good 20 seconds of him trying to kill infected while driving he gets out of the car and started RPing with us as a robotic native. @Fenrir was doing all the talking as I was listening to the conversation and laughing, the only words I said were something like "don't you have sarcasm here?". After a bit, the accused pulled the mag out of his gun and started reloading it while talking. After he finished reloading @Fenrir said something like "He had no mag in his gun that was our chance", keep in mind that was in a very sarcastic tone and we didn't have guns in our hands. The accused started yelling "Are you threatening me", the OP laughed and said "yes". He immediately started shooting the OP then turned around and shot me.

Vid: 

Blurred out a conversation with a friend.

Edited by SidChaos
added vid

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Hi I'm the accused, I'm not RP'ing as an robot first of all. I don't want to call out someone for their RP but "banter" to an unknown person saying they are going to raid my base my home. The only safety I have left in this world. I'm RP'ing realistically I was defending my own home from intruders and he admitted he wanted to harm my home. Also he was verbally threatening me when I unloaded my mag and loaded it with bullets. I'm sure these people have video evidence but I was live streaming on discord for two friends @Tobascosauce & @Not Pepsi

Edited by kranen

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I'd like to add that insulting me saying this "very new to server way." Basically calling me out for not knowing what I'm doing.

1 hour ago, Fenrir said:

Where we bumped into a robotic native dude. He starts off pretty assertive asking where we was going in that very new to the server way.

Sadly I think you don't take RP'ing as serious as I do as you show "banter" in-game and now as I suspect "banter" in forums. I don't think that's any professional. But at last we are waiting for the unedited-footage. If staff then rules in my favor I'd like to see action on this user @Fenrir for first making an false report. Then I'd like to see action for the bad RP when you "banter" with a stranger threatening the strangers home and him and calling it "banter". In an apocalyptic setting.

Have great day.

Edit:

45 minutes ago, SidChaos said:

Me, the English Banter Lord

Edit 2: Also I didn't kill everyone I killed the two persons that showed the most threat. And I heard the person say please don't shoot me so I didn't and told him to stay back. Also didn't kill the woman because she said "Stop, you are going to get us shoot".

Edit 3: Also if staff rules with me I'd like to see action taken on @SidChaos for supporting the "banter" role-play.

Edit 4: bf8dc34a9526a3df5573ab6d3e4706d0.png

I was talking to him on discord and linked this post as I was typing he posted faster then me but I think that he is involved in this report due to him watching my stream and he can detail all that happened. I don't think he should be reported and I think his viewpoint is important to this report.

Edited by kranen

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My character's name is Sumniko, I run a Deaf Girl wose only method of hearing is a jury-rigged radio with wires that thread up into her ears as an improvised hearing aid. Due to a childhood disease called Prebuscusis my character does not speak as that would attract unwanted attention to the way she speaks due to her being very hard of hearing.

So in the quote aboe, the 'woman', being my character, said nothing and was supsequently shot roughly 5-6 times, keep in mind, I had a rain jacket in my hand, and none of us displayed any form of hostility toward the accused.

The one speaking to @kranen spoke jovially and laughed a lot, wondering why @kranen's character didn't understand pop culture references. Jokingly he also said we are 'commiting mass murder in this town'  to which the accused pulled his weapon off his shoulder asking "What did you say?"

Again he repeated himself, still all of our weapons are on our backs aside from the accused. When the accused backed up, he stepped behind his car, pulled a 100 round drum mag from his rifle, then packed it with more rounds. He then loaded it back up.

To everyone, deffinately not quietly or discreetly, and also still in a joking manner. The speaker of our group said "Guys, he didn't have a loaded mag that was our chance."

The accused asked: "Are you threatening me?"

Speaker: *Laughs*

Accused: "Are you threatening me?"

Speaker: Laughing still, with no weapon out, "Yeah sure, why not."

This is when the gunfire erupts, the accused fires upon the speaker, killing him, then he fires on the 'Banter Lord' as he calls himself, killing him, then fires at me, I manage to run around the building and out of sight.

 

The demeanor from the outset from when the accused stepped from the car was immediately hostile. Asking us in an aggressive tone what we were doing in "his" city. He drew his weapon first, and did not initiate at all. From my point of view this was a chance for him to try and clam kill rights because a person was simply being sarcastic to him.

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6 minutes ago, AFluffyBrick said:

He drew his weapon first, and did not initiate at all. From my point of view this was a chance for him to try and clam kill rights because a person was simply being sarcastic to him.

I'm role-playing in an apocalyptic world and my character don't think this "banter" is so funny. He said he wanted to raid my base and such threats mentioned above. My intention wasn't to shoot you but you got caught in the line of fire.

 

6 minutes ago, AFluffyBrick said:

The one speaking to @kranen spoke jovially and laughed a lot, wondering why @kranen's character didn't understand pop culture references. Jokingly he also said we are 'commiting mass murder in this town'  to which the accused pulled his weapon off his shoulder asking "What did you say?"

 

6 minutes ago, AFluffyBrick said:

Again he repeated himself, still all of our weapons are on our backs aside from the accused. When the accused backed up, he stepped behind his car, pulled a 100 round drum mag from his rifle, then packed it with more rounds. He then loaded it back up.

To everyone, deffinately not quietly or discreetly, and also still in a joking manner. The speaker of our group said "Guys, he didn't have a loaded mag that was our chance."

Edit: I'm still waiting for the unedited-footage. We can go forwards after the whole footage is uploaded.

Edited by kranen

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On 12/9/2019 at 3:39 AM, SidChaos said:

Vid: 

Blurred out a conversation with a friend

Now when we have the video, you can see the whole incident. I asked where they where going. And you can hear that this quote below does not fit the videos.

 

On 12/9/2019 at 3:18 AM, Fenrir said:

sounded like he thought it was funny as his tone quivered at a few points.

Not only that but you can hear him say he wanted to raid the base and threatened me. I don't think his kind of RP in this kind of world and situation is good RP. I think I did what most people would do in a world like this. I do understand that I could have asked them to leave and such things but then it feels like the person don't answer for their actions taken. I also said "Now you go" to his friends around him and the other character been "funny" threatening. I also never sounded amused by the "banter" nor did I scream "Are you threatening me" I just sound really angry. And the Japanies girl noticed it and said "stop" to the "banter" dude. Also their Canadian friend said "I'm going to get shoot with you guys". Both of them noticed.

In the end I think I acted and took the actions necessary to the situation and actions made in it.

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30 minutes ago, kranen said:

And the Japanies girl noticed it and said "stop" to the "banter" dude. Also their Canadian friend said "I'm going to get shoot with you guys". Both of them noticed.

My character doesn't speak, like, at all.

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@kranen Oh my goodness would you stop quoting me, every time i open the website there's a notification from you, abstractly quoting something i wrote followed by a frenzied paragraph that makes little to no sense.

Look im gonna be real with you here, you seem to be trying to use RP as blanket armour for your actions however this community like many others is built upon rules, specifically these rules: MUST READ

I strongly suggest you read through these rules in their entirety. But for the purposes of this report you should focus on the last section, the one titled "Hostilities". Realise you gained absolutely no kill rights in that situation as no demand followed by a threat was presented other than you screaming "ARE YOU THREATENING ME" followed by me banterously saying "Ye Ye its a thr..." and im ded. Once you have achieved ascension via reading the rules, apologise to me @SidChaos and @AFluffyBrick for ending our adventure so prematurely and aggressively. If the apology is sincere i will happily put my signature towards closing this report.

Edited by Fenrir

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9 hours ago, AFluffyBrick said:

My character doesn't speak, like, at all.

That's my fault I mistook you for the Canadian guy.

8 hours ago, Fenrir said:

@kranen Oh my goodness would you stop quoting me, every time i open the website there's a notification from you, abstractly quoting something i wrote followed by a frenzied paragraph that makes little to no sense.

Look im gonna be real with you here, you seem to be trying to use RP as blanket armour for your actions however this community like many others is built upon rules, specifically these rules: MUST READ

I strongly suggest you read through these rules in their entirety. But for the purposes of this report you should focus on the last section, the one titled "Hostilities". Realise you gained absolutely no kill rights in that situation as no demand followed by a threat was presented other than you screaming "ARE YOU THREATENING ME" followed by me banterously saying "Ye Ye its a thr..." and im ded. Once you have achieved ascension via reading the rules, apologise to me @SidChaos and @AFluffyBrick for ending our adventure so prematurely and aggressively. If the apology is sincere i will happily put my signature towards closing this report.

I don't think you know what RP is. Roleplaying is when you set your mind in to the world of DayZ your "banter" RP is not good nor is it funny. I'm waiting on staff to take action on whom ever they see was in the right. I don't use RPing as an "blanket" I RP with the mindset of an zombie apocalyptic world. I saw most of your comments threatening and I will take action on them. If you'd like me to read the rules I have here 4.2 "If you are a defender - the one being initiated on or subjected to other hostile actions that threaten your life which you did not start or provoke - you are allowed to defend yourself by gaining DEFENDER RIGHTS on the attackers" I saw your comment about "our chance" as life threatening I do not care if you say it's "banter" as I see that as bad RPing because I don't know you nor do you know me and the setting of the world is a dark place and I'm surviving also threatening to raid my home. My food and supplies is my life in a world like this. If you feel like RPing with "banter" I'd recommend playing FiveM in GTA world setting.

I respect the rules and guidelines of this community and I'll respect the decision made by the staff team of this report. I RP in my style and you did yours you got killed for yours and it's the style you have picked and it got you killed so instead of crying about it maybe take a second and think. If someone in this world approached you with banter and jokes and you are on your way to help your friends who just got in to a raid and is requesting backup and you stop to ask some other survivors where they are going and you get joked with and such things I'm not going to be happy. If you'd made a joke and then would have maybe said "Well we are looking for food and shelter" and didn't say you was going to raid the only base here when I told you I lived here. Yes I know I said I didn't own the base here but I just met you guys for the first time but I would happily have given food and supplies. But you decided to be the cool guy and you basically got shit on. I know in your mind I just blew your cool guy status but man you re-spawn and now you know maybe be more polite to people.

And talking about rules maybe read the first lines here. 3.2 3.2 "Your character must behave realistically and appropriately to the different situations you participate in, keeping the current world situation and context of post-apocalyptic world in mind. Do not act in a way that indicates no value for your characters life and survival. For example, attempting to kill people when heavily outnumbered, excessively talking back or insulting someone when taken hostage, or knowingly running into an area of active hostile engagement when not involved in the fight. Characters found guilty of breaking this rule will be permanently marked as dead."

Edit: This will just be a battle against replies I would wish and staff member took their time and make the decision they deem necessary. Thanks and all have a great day even you @Fenrir.

Edited by kranen

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This is the most entertaining report I have ever seen in awhile. Now jokes aside, let me address some issues here since you are a new player. 

  • Having a character with realistic traits like being  funny or telling jokes, is not considered as BadRP. it makes your character more human and believable. 
  • @Fenrir character Mr. Wulf not taking your character seriously is not BadRP either.

In short, you'll find different people in the world, its not my way or the highway.

On 12/9/2019 at 6:01 AM, kranen said:

I killed the two persons that showed the most threat

So you killed the most persons that showed you threat, with no visible guns, and just words. Now lets  pretend that your kill on @Fenrir is justified "Cause its not". How was I showing threat ? I was quite for the entirety of the encounter apart from making a John Wick reference in the beginning and asking if you do have sarcasm in Poland. Probably because I looked at you the wrong way I don't know. But you RDM'ed me and attempted to kill @AFluffyBrick because simply we were around the OP, not posing any threat. 

  • You decided to open fire on all three of us, despite no one have any guns visible and without initiation.
  • You prioritized the use of kill rights instead of Role-playing the situation. But you don't have kill rights because there was no threat, no gun pointing at you and no demands has been made. Just the use of words

In future situations you might want to initiate first and roleplay the situation properly instead of using whatever kill rights you think you have, and opening fire. Also, I would highly recommend PM'ing one of these fine ladies and gentlemen to refine your RP as a new player to the server. 

 

Edited by SidChaos

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@Matthew Steiger will be temporarily banned from the server until his POV is added to this report.

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24 minutes ago, SidChaos said:

This is the most entertaining report I have ever seen in awhile. Now jokes aside, let me address some issues here since you are a new player. 

  • Having a character with realistic traits like being  funny or telling jokes, is not considered as BadRP. it makes your character more human and believable. 
  • @Fenrir character Mr. Wulf not taking your character seriously is not BadRP either.

In short, you'll find different people in the world, its not my way or the highway.

So you killed the most persons that showed you threat, with no visible guns, and just words. Now lets  pretend that your kill on @Fenrir is justified "Cause its not". How was I showing threat ? I was quite for the entirety of the encounter apart from making a John Wick reference in the beginning and asking if you do have sarcasm in Poland. Probably because I looked at you the wrong way I don't know. But you RDM'ed me and attempted to kill @AFluffyBrick because simply we were around the OP, not posing any threat. 

  • You decided to open fire on all three of us, despite no one have any guns visible and without initiation.
  • You prioritized the use of kill rights instead of Role-playing the situation. But you don't have kill rights because there was no threat, no gun pointing at you and no demands has been made. Just the use of words

In future situations you might want to initiate first and roleplay the situation properly instead of using whatever kill rights you think you have, and opening fire. Also, I would highly recommend PM'ing one of these fine ladies and gentlemen to refine your RP as a new player to the server. 

I see you guys don't really have the same quality of RP as I do. I want my RP to be realistic all you guys want to do is "banter" around and have fun. I like the real RP I think that's the fun part being in danger and such things. I opened fire on the OP and you as in a real situation I want to kill the persons that are threatening to me and you might pull out a gun and shoot me. It's realistic, I didn't open fire on @AFluffyBrick she got caught in the line of fire. As I said if you are looking for your kind of RP I'd recommend FiveM as it's more "banter". If you don't think he has bad RP then don't cry about getting killed. You made the choice to threaten my life then I'll defend it. Yes it's right you didn't have a gun towards me but it doesn't state in the rules you have to have a gun to my head. You was showing threat as I saw you as the main guy towards this character as you laughed the most and was so on with him. The other people stood back and the Canadian even said "Stop it" to YOU guys not me.

  • You prioritized the use of kill rights instead of Role-playing the situation. But you don't have kill rights because there was no threat, no gun pointing at you and no demands has been made. Just the use of words.

The next time someone in real life goes up to you and threatens you and you don't respond by defending yourself call me then."

If you'd like to show me how to RP I've RP'd in allot of games where I'm looked as a great RP as I take the role of the character and the environment around me. I'm not new to RPing I might be a new member and new to DayZ but I just like my realistic RP and I don't like "cool" guys running up on me thinking they funny then cry on the forums cus they can't take being killed. I've refereed to rules that give me the kill right and I'm only waiting for staff to make a decision on this report. Thanks for all of the involved parties and let us just wait for staff decision.

Edited by kranen

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From my perspective, I was not caught in the crossfire as you went from Killing @Fenrir which was closest to me, then to shooting @SidChaos which was closest to the Canuck, then dinally shooting me, the only reason I survived was because I was closest to the corner of the building and was able to duck around the corner.

Edit: @kranen The main issue here was not your RP, as over time you'll get better, whether or not you go to the mentor program provided. The main issue is that you did not initiate, and did not have defense rights as we had no initiation on you. Just apologize for it so we can close this report and move on with our RP lives.

Edited by AFluffyBrick
Additional mention, for @Kranen specifically.

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Hey, I was the Canadian dude, Matthew. My view of this event started when I met @Fenrir, @SidChaos, and @AFluffyBrick near the Fire Station in Nadbor. I introduced myself, then we proceeded to chat a little bit, when one of them (I forget which one, as this was almost 30 hours ago for me, and I had school so I couldn't check the website) mentioned seeing a player built base at the edge of town. One of the men said they wanted to check it out, and see if anyone was there. I asked if I could tag along, as I had nothing better to do. So as we were making our way through town, @kranen drove by in his car. I presume that he saw us, as he turned his car around and started coming back towards us. He drove into the infected on the road, and did a doughnut or two, and then pulled over. @kranen asked what we were doing here, to which banter man said "committing mass murder". And then everything was pretty much banter back and forth. I eventually was getting spooked, so I said, "dude, your gonna get us shot". Eventually, after some more banter, @kranen asked if he was being threatened, while raising his voice. When banter man laughed and said yes, he raised his rifle and shot the two men and the woman. I ran across the road and started yelling don't shoot, while @kranen told me to leave. I left the town, and found a place to log off for the night.

And that's my pov of the situation. At least, what I can recall. I had a test in school the next day, so I was more concerned about that, which is why I can't remember much else. Hope this helps.

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9 minutes ago, Matthew Steiger said:

-snip-

Thank you for the reply, your temporary ban has been revoked.

Please be sure to check the forums in case we have more questions!

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Summary:
@Fenrir, @SidChaos, @Matthew Steiger, and @AFluffyBrick are searching Nadbor for a base previously located by SidChaos when they spot a car driven by @kranen running down infected.  They stop, the driver exits, and the two parties engage in communication.  Fenrir jests that they were in Nadbor to murder and raid, which kranen takes IC offense to, questioning further about Fenrir and company's intentions and warning that his gun could kill all of them if needed.  Kranen then retreats behind his car and loads his rifle, causing Fenrir to joke that was "their chance," as kranen was unarmed.  Kranen questioned whether he was being threatened and Fenrir jokingly replies, "I mean, yeah.  Yeah, yeah, that was a threat."  Kranen responds to this by killing Fenrir and SidChaos, as well as shooting AFluffyBrick multiple times.

Rulebreaks:

  • Throughout the conversation shared between the two parties, @Fenrirdid not initiate on @kranen, nor did any other members of Fenrir's party.  An initiation is constituted of clear hostile intent, a demand, and a consequence; jokingly saying "He had no mag in his gun, that was our chance!" or "Yeah, yeah that was a threat," does not constitute an initiation, but rather an in-character joke.  No rights were gained for either side from this interaction, as there was no initiation.  Because of this, the kill on @Fenrir, the kill on @SidChaos, and the attempted kill on @AFluffyBrick by @kranen will all be deemed invalid.
  • Additionally, the staff team has agreed to aggravate the punishment issued to @kranen due to the nature of this report.  Your character responding poorly to an in-character joke is no excuse to kill the person making this joke and is certainly not an excuse to blindly shoot the joke-teller's compatriots.  Even if @Fenrir had actually initiated, none of his friends did, meaning they would not have been involved with the initiation and therefor would not have rights on @kranen and vice versa.  We believe this gross misunderstanding of initiations, defender rights on your initiator, and defender rights as shared dynamically through initiations warrant an aggravated punishment, as they are rules pivotal to the facilitation of roleplay on our servers.

Evidence:

Spoiler

 

Suggestions:
@kranen, throughout the duration of your ban, the staff team strongly recommends you review our rules surrounding initiations and kill rights.  A thorough read through Rule Section 4 with a focus on rules 4.1 and 4.2 will hopefully assist you in avoiding this issue in the future.  We'd like to reiterate that, in this interaction, no initiation was dropped and your character's life was clearly not in danger, as the "initiating" party was not even brandishing firearms.  You must not kill people you do not have rights on and you must always ensure that you do have rights on people you decide to kill.  An easy way to ensure this in this particular situation would've been for you yourself to initiate.  If your character dislikes how another character speaks of his homeland, initiate on them and engage in roleplay, do not just blindly start shooting.

Verdict:
@kranen | Invalid Kill (roleplayed) x2, Attempted Invalid Kill | GUILTY.  5 day ban, 15 warning points. (AGGRAVATED)

Signed by @Peril, @Scarlett, & @Inferno

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