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Eagles

Griefing- Field between Vybor & Pustoshka

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Server and location: US Chernarus

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): between 8:45 and 9:15 server time at least

Your in game name: Marek Kral

Names of allies involved: @PhoenyxxRP

Name of suspect/s: Unknown

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any): None

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): 

(Video has been cut in order to preserve our base codes, if staff would like an unedited file of it please feel free to reach out to me)

Detailed description of the events: I was just getting ready to lay down to go to bed when I received an IC radio message from @PhoenyxxRP, she was asking if we had given anybody permission to tear down our walls for nails, obviously I told her we hadn't because we were still actively using the place and had logged out inside the house not even an hour before hand, seeing as I had Wolf Packs open frequency I jumped into it and informed two of the members within it what was going on. Upon logging in to see what the damages were I saw they had stripped our back wall of it's wood paneling and they had started to work on the front gate wall when Phoenyxx had originally came up on them. Upon getting reasonably upset with them and questioning who had given them permission the only name they could give me was Paladin. We had never met anyone by that name nor had we ever heard of anyone by that name. I stuck around for a little bit but seeing as how late it was at the time I am putting up this report I felt Wolf Pack and the Jackals members that were there would be able to handle the situation and keep them in check.

 

I do not want to talk out this report, because if Phoenyxx hadn't come across them they would have ended up stripping all of our walls for nails. We would have had no way to make all the repairs and in the end we still had to give them what nails we had in order to make the repairs they were forced to make ICly.

 

If staff has any questions please feel free to ask me. I will edit my POV with more detail when I wake up in the morning.

Edited by Eagles

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CONNECTION LOGS:

Spoiler

08:01:17 | Player "burke stanley" is connected
09:31:08 | Player "burke stanley" has been disconnected

08:06:05 | Player "Micheal Jay" is connected
09:39:37 | Player "Micheal Jay" has been disconnected

08:12:37 | Player "Phoenyxx Caine" is connected
08:27:50 | Player "Phoenyxx Caine" has been disconnected
08:28:10 | Player "Phoenyxx Caine" is connected
09:39:37 | Player "Phoenyxx Caine" has been disconnected

05:35:49 | Player "Marek Kral" is connected
08:19:59 | Player "Marek Kral" has been disconnected
09:14:54 | Player "Marek Kral" is connected
09:35:18 | Player "Marek Kral" has been disconnected

BUILDING LOGS:

Spoiler

 

08:43:20 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3621.0, 8061.2, 298>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:44:44 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3620.5, 8061.6, 297.9>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:45:49 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3619.4, 8058.2, 297.9>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:46:53 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3622.8, 8064.9, 298.0>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:48:28 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3648.0, 8062.6, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:49:28 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3648.1, 8062.6, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:50:33 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3645.9, 8059.9, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:51:34 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3645.9, 8059.9, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:52:54 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3643.9, 8056.4, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
08:58:29 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3644.4, 8056.5, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:01:25 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3641.6, 8053.1, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:02:30 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3641.6, 8053.1, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:03:47 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3639.9, 8052.1, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:04:50 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3639.9, 8052.1, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:05:57 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3638.4, 8053.1, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:07:03 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3639.9, 8052.2, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:08:15 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3644.7, 8076, 298.2>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
09:18:05 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3643.3, 8075.1, 298.2>) built Fence with Hatchet
09:20:42 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3647.3, 8062.6, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
09:22:25 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3647.7, 8063.1, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
09:23:57 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3645.2, 8059.7, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
09:37:37 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3643.2, 8057.2, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
09:46:28 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3643.2, 8057.1, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
09:51:23 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3641.1, 8054.3, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
09:55:31 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3641.4, 8054.0, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
10:42:26 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3835.2, 8869.0, 311.3>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
10:43:17 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3835.2, 8869.0, 311.3>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar
10:44:56 | Player "burke stanley" (pos=<3839.2, 8869.1, 311.3>) dismantled Fence with Crowbar

09:32:00 | Player "Micheal Jay" (pos=<3645.1, 8059.6, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
10:00:22 | Player "Micheal Jay" (pos=<3640.6, 8053.1, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
10:12:17 | Player "Micheal Jay" (pos=<3639.8, 8053.4, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
10:13:19 | Player "Micheal Jay" (pos=<3639.7, 8053.3, 298.1>) dismantled Fence with Hatchet
10:26:30 | Player "Micheal Jay" (pos=<3640.6, 8052.9, 298.1>) built Fence with Hatchet
10:29:02 | Player "Micheal Jay" (pos=<3621.2, 8061.3, 298.0>) built Fence with Hatchet

 

CALLING IN THE FOLLOWING TO POST THEIR POV AND ANY VIDEO EVIDENCE THEY MAY HAVE:

@Eagles | Marek Kral | OP
@The Saviour | Micheal Jay | 
@Lt Stanley | Burke Stanley |
@PhoenyxxRP | Phoenyxx Caine |

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Hello @Fae,

After a nice incident at The Den I had respawned outside Zeleno. I had traveled through where I came face to face with an enemy, and then another enemy but managed to get away. As I arrive at GM, one of the enemies follows. We have an intense moment, she takes my radio and i head on my way. Starving I remember that the Soup kitchen near Vybor is always open for people to go in an take some food as they have generously told us before. 

I head over there, exhausted and worried my enemies are close. I get to the soup kitchen, dont see anyone but swore I heard something but proceed to go grab some soup to fill me for my journey. Suddenly theres two people behind me guns drawn and I fear I met my end. However, it turns out that these guys I know, well one of them. They put their weapons away and We engage in a conversation. This conversation leads to the one guy Stanley handing me his radio and me alerting my people that I am fine, who are already on their way to GM as the last time i radio'd them before mine was stolen was me saying i was at the charity centre. So my people were close by. As im doing this I hear someone hacking away at the walls in which Stanley and his friend inform me that someone had told them that they are allowed to take some wood and nails. I think to myself this is odd but don't question much as I'm alone, with 13 bullets not much I can do. After handing back the radio, I bid my farewell and go to vybor where I meet bobby and take his radio.

Here i radio my people and radio @Eagles trying to figure out if these guys are allowed to be ripping apart the walls. I was informed they were not. I then assemble the troops and we descend back on the soup kitchen. We make these guys put the walls back up, teach them a lesson. I left shortly before restart and let the rest of my boys handle the situation.

These guys were tearing down from what I can tell, the walls until it was just the frame to get nails. Im unsure how many walls they had done prior to me arriving.

Thanks

Have a wonderful day.

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Me and Michael jay were going to the soup kitchen when we met somone there called paladin. We talked to him when he said we could take the nails and leave the planks as they were gonna move. So we went  in with crobars and dismantled metal and wooden walls for nails and metal. We placed the planks back so they could be used agian and we were gonna leave when Phoenix showed up and asked to use the radio. We then told her it was ok for us to do what we were doing and she left. They then came back with everyone and we had a hostage situation. We rped the situation out and rebuilt the walls as told to do so when we were held up. They then let us go and we left. 

Thanks, @Fae

Edited by Lt Stanley

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So from my side of things myself and @Lt Stanley arrived at the soup kitchen where as he stated we met someone named "Paladin" which I'm assuming now is a fake name. Elaborating on Stanley's post we got to talking and stated that we needed nails. This individual continued on about how he helped out there and that they would be moving and we could take walls down to get nails but just to leave the planks for transport. I myself thought this was odd but didn't question it as there were no other members around we needed the supplies. This individual left sometime before Phoenix got there and so we began the deconstruction of the walls. Later on after helping out Phoenix with the radio she returned and a hostage situation occurred which myself and Stanley complied and went along with. I myself personally don't see this as griefing as we were mislead but also there were no official members of this "soup kitchen" to clarify this (IC of course.) I myself owning a base some patches ago know it is frustrating when a base or compound gets raided however if you are not there to protect what you keep that is not on the attacker to take responsibility for that; from a rp perspective if a survivor is going out into the land to scavenge supplies and sees something that could benefit himself he will most likely take it in order to increase his chance of survival. I have no ill feelings towards the wolfpack or the "soup kitchen" OOC or IC. This was not done out of spite which I told members of the wolfpack when they were questioning us. More or less this was a lie told to both myself and Stanley which resulted in an attempted deconstruction/raid that was then prevented and the base was rebuilt. There was great hostage rp I had fun with it I know someone in the wolfpack was laughing along with me and having a good time during the rp as well.

This is simply my perspective on the whole situation, ultimately its up to staff to determine what happens however I feel the need for this report is unnecessary as all this was explained directly to them, the base was reconstructed to the best of our abilities (as being instructed too form the hostage takers), there was good rp all around.

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First off @Fae if at all possible I would like position logs to be looked through within a 10-15 minute period from when they first started tearing down the walls because me and my base mates had logged out an hour before hand when I received the first message from Phoenyxx (9:00 would have been the server time when I received the message), I would like to know who Paladin is and why he was telling people to tear down the walls to a knowingly active base.

Now on to everything else

1 hour ago, The Saviour said:

This individual continued on about how he helped out there and that they would be moving and we could take walls down to get nails but just to leave the planks for transport. I myself thought this was odd but didn't question it as there were no other members around we needed the supplies. This individual left sometime before Phoenix got there and so we began the deconstruction of the walls.

The fact that this man told you he only HELPED out around the camp should have been a dead giveaway that he wasn't actually apart of the camp. We have countless people that come through our camp and bring us supplies to make our stews, any of them could state that they help out around the camp. So the fact that you didn't question him about what he does within the camp or if he had codes to access our house and inner storage is a concern to me. Another thing that you should have had an immediate concern to was someone saying that we were moving but we wouldn't be taking the nails, no one in their right mind would put that much work into a base and just let some random person come along and dismantle the walls and run off with the nails they put so much time into acquiring

 
1 hour ago, The Saviour said:

Later on after helping out Phoenix with the radio she returned and a hostage situation occurred which myself and Stanley complied and went along with.

This is a flat out lie, because one of you two had attempted to run off and had to be brought back with guns on them which is when I had logged in, with that in mind if you could have gotten away you wouldn't have bothered coming back to build our walls back up that you had dismantled. @PhoenyxxRP can confirm this bit of information that one of them had attempted to flee the area upon being confronted by both groups that showed up.

1 hour ago, The Saviour said:

I myself owning a base some patches ago know it is frustrating when a base or compound gets raided however if you are not there to protect what you keep that is not on the attacker to take responsibility for that;

This was not a "raid". There was no attempt to actually get inside our base where we keep our loot. We have been raided before and not once did any of those raids result in our walls being dismantled. You character doesn't need nails in order to survive in this world. So to sit there and claim that dismantling someones base for nails and metal qualifies as a raid is poor reasoning in my opinion.

Quote

 4.8 Griefing is act of damaging or destroying a player base, storage container, vehicles or their contents using OOC knowledge, ill intent or doing so without IC reasoning that is proportionate to the damage done.

You were not breaking down walls for the purpose of getting to our loot, if you had done so we wouldn't be having this conversation. What you were attempting to do was stripping an active base down for resources, which has been deemed griefing NUMEROUS times in the past.

1 hour ago, The Saviour said:

This is simply my perspective on the whole situation, ultimately its up to staff to determine what happens however I feel the need for this report is unnecessary as all this was explained directly to them, the base was reconstructed to the best of our abilities (as being instructed too form the hostage takers), there was good rp all around.

That's all well and good that you had good hostage RP, the bottom line is that if Wolf Pack and Jackals hadn't rolled up we would have woken up to no planks on our walls at all. We had to dip into OUR supplies and even after doing so everything that you had dismantled couldn't be repaired because you didn't have everything that was necessary to fix what you had broke down.

Edited by Eagles

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2 hours ago, Lt Stanley said:

-snip-

 

1 hour ago, The Saviour said:

-snip-

 

@The Saviour, @Lt Stanley

Were you two traveling together prior to this incident? You arrived together?

Where did you speak with Paladin? Was it at the camp? Another town? Be specific.

Roughly how long before you broke the first wall down (8:43 sever time) did you speak with Paladin? 5 minutes? 15 minutes? You don't need to be exact, but give me a good guess.

 

@Eagles - I will be updating with position logs once the above are answered.

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me and jay were together yes because we are freinds. the paladin guy was at the base when we arrived and we asked about what the place was then was told it was a soup kitchen but they were moving. we then asked if we could take nails and when he said yes then we did. and it was about 10 mins before stripping the first wall. i also want to say it is technically counted as a  raid as you had stuff outside and we did take some food. we also were taking nails and leaving planks in the wall for you guys so there was no greifing. it doesnt matter if you can rebuild it or not that is what a raid is. as long as we were not despawning stuff or taking what we dont need then there is no greifing. we were taking food and nails thats what we needed. if you dont have it protected that isnt our fault. and when we ran the first time you all ran away from us so yes ofcourse we are gonna try and run when no one is around us. also you didnt have us hostages at the time of us running there for we can still run with valuing our lives. when i was shot i stopped running so did jay. all im saying is you cant count this as grief as we followed the rules and took what we needed, left the planks in the wall, and didnt de spawn anything. also it was at the soup kitchen where we met paladin.

2 minutes ago, Lt Stanley said:

 4.8 Griefing is act of damaging or destroying a player base, storage container, vehicles or their contents using OOC knowledge, ill intent or doing so without IC reasoning that is proportionate to the damage done.

this is a rule yes but we had a IC reason to take as much as we did. we needed nails to build and we needed alot so there for it is not griefing.

Edited by Lt Stanley
adding info

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8 minutes ago, Lt Stanley said:

-snip-

vP4WPa9.png

These comments clearly state that dismantling walls for resources is deemed griefing. Just because you "needed nails" doesn't mean it isn't griefing.

 

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By definition a raid is “a sudden attack on an enemy by troops, aircraft, or other armed forces” (attack on your base’s resources). the fact of taking the nails as supplies as we needed in the rp as a goal for both of our characters to build the home that we were trying to accomplish. 

 

When it says “with ill intent or without IC reasoning” we had IC reasoning and there was no ill intent as I stated before 

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1 hour ago, Eagles said:

vP4WPa9.png

These comments clearly state that dismantling walls for resources is deemed griefing. Just because you "needed nails" doesn't mean it isn't griefing.

 

2.4 Don't be a sore loser. Items in game can be replaced, there is no need to be angry and hold grudge against someone just because someone was better. Keep in mind that it is just a game. Take regular breaks from the game if you have trouble separating In Character events from Out of Character real world.

 

then you broke this rule aswell so whats the case on that.

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35 minutes ago, Lt Stanley said:

-snip-

Reporting someone for a valid rule break against them doesn't equate to a 2.4, if that was the case every person that has reported someone for a rule broken against them would be hit with a 2.4.

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3 hours ago, Rover said:

 

 

@The Saviour, @Lt Stanley

Were you two traveling together prior to this incident? You arrived together?

Where did you speak with Paladin? Was it at the camp? Another town? Be specific.

Roughly how long before you broke the first wall down (8:43 sever time) did you speak with Paladin? 5 minutes? 15 minutes? You don't need to be exact, but give me a good guess.

 

@Eagles - I will be updating with position logs once the above are answered.

 

We never broke a rule

Ignore the qoute my phone bugged sorry lol

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Verdict:

@The Saviour | Lying in a report | Guilty

@Lt Stanley | Griefing + Lying in a report | Guilty


Reason:

In this situation, both @The Saviour and @Lt Stanley go to the 'Soup Kitchen', a small base between Pustoshka and the Vybor military compound.

Shortly after arriving they begin to dismantle the walls of the compound, allegedly to collect nails from them in order to construct their own base. As seen in this thread it is stated by @Roland that "It's ok to dismantle anything in shortest path leading into inner core of the base. Removing anything more than that can be considered griefing. Yes, this includes dismantling bases for resources."

@The Saviour and @Lt Stanley, you did not dismantle a wall in order to gain access to the base through the shortest path. You methodically worked your way through the walls of the base, stripping them one by one for resources and only stopped once @PhoenyxxRP found you. We strongly believe that had she not found you dismantling the walls, you would have both continued until there were no walls for you to destroy. Due to your actions in this situation, you will be punished for griefing.

If you want nails to build your own base with, hunt around the map for them like everybody else instead of destroying what others have worked hard to create.

 

Now to explain the lying.

Multiple gamemasters have combed through the position and connection logs in our records and there are several things we have discovered.

It is stated that when you arrived at the camp, you spoke to a man named "Paladin" for around 10 minutes before you even began to start stripping the first wall. This is simply false as 10 minutes prior to you beginning to strip the first wall, you are both in Vybor. Approximately three minutes before you start working on the first wall, both of you are roughly 300 metres to the east of the compound, making your way towards it. We struggle to comprehend how you were talking to "Paladin" at the compound for 10 minutes before breaking the first wall when you were not even at the compound for 10 minutes before you began to work on the walls.

The following spoiler contains an image showing the movements of those involved during the time frame of the situation.

Spoiler

21ee143dfc.png

The next thing we discovered is that, at no point before or during your time at the base, are there any other players nearby. No players logged in or out during the time that you are there who could be this "Paladin". Apart from the two of you, the only other player at the compound during this time was Phoenyxx when she eventually arrived after you had already begun to dismantle the walls. There is no record of anyone in the area who could've told you it is okay to dismantle the walls. We believe that "Paladin" is a fabrication by the two of you in order to try and excuse your actions in this situation.

It is not hard for us to see that you have lied in this situation because if an item does not appear in our records, it does not exist. We strongly recommend that in the future you are truthful about any situation you find yourself having to explain in a report.

@Lt Stanley due to the circumstances of this situation, we have chosen to aggravate the punishment you will receive. Details regarding punishment aggravation can be found here.

With the above stated, the following applies


Outcome:

@The Saviour | Lying in a report | 7 Day Ban + 10 Warning Points

@Lt Stanley | Griefing + Lying in a report | 7 Day Ban + 15 Warning Points

 

Signed by @Conor, @Fae & @Rover

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