S1 - Grishino Constant Attacks , 4.4 and 2.3

[Burak]

Server and location: S1

Approximate time and date of the incident (SERVER TIME): 2019/10/30 21:30 ~ 22:00 

Your in game name: Cem Ersever

Names of allies involved:  @Poopslayer (Neo Galvani)

Name of suspect/s: Trade Union group

Friendly/Enemy vehicles involved (if any):  -

Additional evidence? (video/screenshot): -

Detailed description of the events: 

Everyday mostly i visit Grishino , Jackson is trying to build up a tradepost there , and its trader posts fate to get robbed or get raided , or got heist every single day. But last 1 week i can ensure you these guys are daily pay a visit and seeking some excuse to start gunfight or robbing people. I like mostly Character called Ivan Volkov , a little bit drunk guy, Trade union uses him like bait that he should flame someone and initiation and other trade union member when they have kill rights after bait , he or she is killing the people within distance. 3 days ago there was a big fight really , i watched that fight in a distance within nvg pso scope about baiting people on front gate and killing who was standing there,even i saw they shared same video with cutscenes on media thread like operation . Yesterday again they pay a visit to Grishino, one by one they get together near grishino as normal survivors , and yell again to be an attacker ( put our hands up ). I saw it will happen and i went to tell Neo stay safe and moving back to my own way, in the meantime it happened and i tried to run in a cover with 1 or 2 steps to wait things get calm down,but i got shot in 1 or 2 second that attackers told put our hands up. i didnt point gun to anyone even. If guys have video evidence we can purely see that there. Yes my fault was not putting hands up , but when they here and try to attack , everytime it begins or ends with a gunfight , and they kill with accident in between people too. I dont want people get banned or something like that , but as i cant see any official group like theirselves , i wanted to create as a report, hopefully they can improve their RP or they can let newbie people ( Grishino Community Jackson and his friends. )  to enjoy RP a little bit more.

Edit:Allies forum name and some part of the event.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Burak

[Ryan Shepherd]

I will be representing the Trade Union in this report.

I ask that no one else responds to this report from Trade Unions side and also your side @Burak in order to keep this as clean as possible.

I will respond with our full view on this '2.3' later.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Ryan Shepherd

[Burak]

I edited my detailed description of event last time right now , if there will be anymore , we can keep it short to reach solution in these tons of solution waiting reports 

[PublicVoodoo]

If you have any video evidence please add it to this report

[Burak]

I dont have. But if Trade Union has or dont have , i believe their honesty OOC.

[RandyRP]

@Burak Can you please list out the dates and times (server time) that you were attacked, so we can verify when the attacks where and who they were by. 
Thanks  

[Burak]

Sunday 27/10/2019 18:00~20:00 (Bait and Kill)
Tuesday 29/10/2019 16:00~20:00 (again bait and kill started since airfield.)
Wednesday 30/10/2019 21:30 ~ 22:00  ( heist including invalid kill to my character death)
Biggest ones were them

in their media thread there are some cutscenes videos, if they have full and not edited ones , they can work well.

Edited first was Sunday , i wrote by fault Monday.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Burak

[Burak]

Plus +

Trade Union initiations are a little bit weird. I just heard 2 different voices hands up without seeing someone , and when i move 2 steps i got shot.

Examples:
*Before getting in any village or cities if we shout PUT YOUR HANDS UP , do we complete initiation ?  *
*Or in the middle of cherno if i shout put your hands up , but in the end of street someone running , do i have right to gundown these ?*

I am part of redwood radio and i was wearing a red checkered armband all the time , while trade union members were coming one by one to grishino without alerting grishino individuals and getting ready for heist , even one of them told me he will getting ready for a sleep behind a shed.they all saw that i am different than these individuals and didnt even have initiation on me. (i'm telling that , because as i know Trade Union not an official group , they are also individuals.)

So its very multiple report with invalid kill , constant attacks , i mean multiple rule problems.

Reason of this report a little bit more RP not only PVP things.

P.S. I might be using some wrong words during explain myself , sorry English is not my native Language.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Burak

[Ryan Shepherd]

Trade Union's composed PoV.

As the Trade Union, we actively want to protect traders, we forcefully make traders join under the Trade Union wing, aggressively if needs be. We initially came to Grishino two weeks ago and we spoke to who seemed to be the leader figure, we advised this encampment will be under Trade Union protection, to which he accepted. The higher ups were happy to have us and protect this encampment.

Now that is a VERY BRIEF introduction on our plans to implement the Trade Union into the region, which is phase 1.

Anyway, lets move on to the firefights you have listed, before we begin I would like to add every action a group takes it has a reaction, in this case repercussions.

27/10/19: 

Spoiler

 

@Challenger & @OxeN were doing inspections of the Grishino encampment, in relation to how trading was flowing and where to. They resided at the camp for approximately 2 hours. An argument between Trade Union and one of the residents of Grishino traders sparked however, it seemed to boil down. @Challenger was then searching through some stuff in the town when the traders in Grishino initiated on @Challenger, a man named Oisin was among them, a regular at Grishino who then relieved@Challenger of his equipment. As everyone else, when you have been mistreated, in this case, robbed, you will enact revenge. @Challenger positively identified one of his attackers and shot him, for safety reasons, @Challenger initiated on the entire encampment of Grishino, not once but twice to ensure everyone knew what was going on. Shortly after the firefight moved from the town to the tree's where @Challenger escaped from 3 separate groups coming to aid the Grishino traders of between 10 - 20 strong.

TLDR #1: @Challenger was initiated on while looting OUTSIDE of the encampment by Grishino Traders. @Challenger acted in defence.

 

29/10/19:

Spoiler

 

The Trade Union were looting at NWAF. @OxeN was alone when 10 - 15 Grishino Traders rolled up on him, circling him. He was taken hostage by Grishino Traders unprovoked. @Challenger & @Cuchulainn infiltrated the group traveling back to Grishino as unafilliated people. Both of these men received defense rights under the dynamic rule as they had been traveling together at NWAF. A firefight began once everyone arrived at Grishino, with @Challenger & @Cuchulainn killing all 10 remaining traders in Grishino and surviving, sadly @OxeN was swiftly executed before the end of the firefight by the Grishino Traders.

TLDR #2: Grishino Traders took @OxeN hostage unprovoked while simply looting the airfield.

 

30/10/19:

Spoiler

 

This is the one and only time that we, the Trade Union instigated the fire move in an attack. This was a planned assault by myself in order to completely unionize both Vybor and Grishino as recent efforts were not taking effect peacefully, they had robbed both @Challenger & @OxeN. However I may add, Vybor was hit because they had taken @KennethRP hostage, we came and killed everyone rescuing @KennethRP. The people at Vybor and Grishino are closely affiliated.

Also on another note, I was punched to the point of yellow health, unprovoked, I told the guy to quit it i am feeling unwell. He punches again to the point that I am red health flashing, I scream at him to fuck off your going to kill me, he raises his fists to punch me again and I whip out my gun and kill him, it was me or him. I used defender rights, Grishino being neither a group or group idea do not share rights in such a way, I was questioned briefly after this as to why I committed the act when a man raises his gun to my head, I go to throw my hands up but he just shoots me in the head without initiation, I let that one slide, I messaged the man who killed me to ensure he knew what he did was outside of the rules however to no response, I left it alone. Obviously due to NLR, I did not bring this up, however, this act was witnessed.

TLDR#3: We instigated this attack as a sign of dominance.

 

We have instigated only one attack, the rest have been the use of defender rights and repercussions. Everything we have done has been done in a roleplaying capacity due to the events that have unfolded in-game. We do try to prove our best roleplay at all times, however it can be difficult when there is clear non compliance and wish to fight.

I find it very hard to read @Burak posts so one of the things I want to point out is when he was killed. He was initiated on twice and chose to run, he heard the initiation and failed to comply and was killed by a member outside of The Trade Union.

I will also like to add that reports and accusations of 2.3 should never be a get out of jail free card to have your story.. your story and no one elses and refrain from having to deal with tough situations and pressure from other groups.

Final TLDR: Three firefights. Two instigated by Grishino Traders initiating on members of trade union on two separate occasions. One instigated by Trade Union & allies in order to stamp out the fire. I also would like to add that every firefight, attacking or defending, every dynamic member of the Trade Union initiates and reinitiates as a single party multiple times.

I am open to speak with the OP & I ask staff to cross examine me with any queries they have as the OP's multiple posts is hard for me to respond to every accusation he makes.

Thanks.

Edited October 31, 2019 by Ryan Shepherd

[Burak]

I wrote seperated multiple post , if Staff wants i could get them into together one.

[Ryan Shepherd]

Due to the incredibly misinformed report and false ill informed accusations damaging the reputation of The Trade Union that I & my friends have been working hard for, I would like staff to accept my request to counter report @Burak for false report in the case of 2.3.

[Burak]

First of all i respect everyone who plays on this server and who spend their  valuable times in front of a computer to create RP , Good , Bad , Hostile , Friendly etc.. Including Trade Union individuals.

I apologize and demanding my respect to who read and work on this report, Staff , Admins , Players.
I know i shouldnt have write something and wait until staff ask something to me;
But, @Ryan Shepherd and his friends playing under the trade union individual community name might be worried about the summary and silence.
Trade Union composed POV is totally a weird story,They still dont accept they use one of their members to bait new players (fresh bloods) and use them like target boards if they dont comply well  With this baiting , initiating and gaining attacker rights , but call it like defender right is not honest.People in Grishino were not experienced like @Ryan Shepherd and his friends, both in combat and bait initiation.

If be honest , such reaction shows @Ryan Shepherd and his friends worries , and fury about my this report. I really dont want to turn this into 1 on 1 discussion.

In the ending of my Report I wrote:

'' I dont want people get banned or something like that , but as i cant see any official group like theirselves , i wanted to create as a report, hopefully they can improve their RP or they can let newbie people ( Grishino Community Jackson and his friends. )  to enjoy RP a little bit more. ''

[Ryan Shepherd]

I assure you, I nor my friends are 'worried' about this report.

I will ask you the following simple questions.

1. Did Grishino and its allies initiate on @Challenger outside the front gates of Grishino while he was simply looting? Yes/No.
2. Did Grishino and its allies initiate on @OxeN while he was in the airfield, rolling on him 15 (approx) people strong and initiate on him? Yes/No.

When one party initiates on another, be it today, tomorrow or next week, there will ALWAYS be repercussions. In this case the repercussions were immediate and resulted in all of your deaths. The third and final time was an attack that I planned and take full responsibility for doing so, was the one and only time that we began the situation in a hostile intent which there is totally nothing wrong with, we all play hostile characters and many of us have done so for years in this community.

If you have proof of this 'baiting' then feel free to post it, not a single member inside of The Trade Union is ever used as bait or is told to instigate the opportunity to be initiated on, I nor @OxeN would ever deem that a suitable way to roleplay.

Your story is not the only story in the community, actions have reactions.

I would like you to answer my questions above @Burak.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Ryan Shepherd

[Burak]

- USER HAS BEEN CAUTIONED FOR THIS POST -

[Ryan Shepherd]

3 minutes ago, Burak said:

 

Well I am afraid that is what you have signed up for by making a report, that is how reports work.

You failing to respond to two simple but VERY important questions, tells me all I need to know.

Edited November 1, 2019 by Ryan Shepherd

[Saunders]

@Ryan Shepherd @Burak Do neither of you, or anyone involved in this report have any video evidence of any of the situations that are being brought up in this report?

[Burak]

No , i dont have. But trade union has media thread , maybe they might have unedited videos.

[Ryan Shepherd]

5 hours ago, Saunders said:

@Ryan Shepherd @Burak Do neither of you, or anyone involved in this report have any video evidence of any of the situations that are being brought up in this report?

Not that I know of regarding these situations, I will ask around.

Also, it is worth following up the answers to these, like I said, simple but VERY important questions he is conveniently refusing to answer for me:

On 11/1/2019 at 7:11 PM, Ryan Shepherd said:

1. Did Grishino and its allies initiate on @Challenger outside the front gates of Grishino while he was simply looting? Yes/No.
2. Did Grishino and its allies initiate on @OxeN while he was in the airfield, rolling on him 15 (approx) people strong and initiate on him? Yes/No.

 

[Burak]

First, It shouldn't be like Q&A section, if it has to be , i could just pop up from your discord without creating a report here.We shouldn't turn this into a cluster if you don't mind.My opinion about these questions are just for getting me out from my comfort zone.I could also ask you tons of questions too, but it doesnt change that Either way grishino was under constant attack. My death was ''Invalid Kill'' .
Second, there are some people on the server who is good at avoiding or reasoning rulebreaks,but in any way it has come to an end at last.

 I respect you and your friends , but Ryan , let the staff do their work

[Ryan Shepherd]

5 minutes ago, Burak said:

First, It shouldn't be like Q&A section, if it has to be , i could just pop up from your discord without creating a report here.We shouldn't turn this into a cluster if you don't mind.My opinion about these questions are just for getting me out from my comfort zone.I could also ask you tons of questions too, but it doesnt change that Either way grishino was under constant attack. My death was ''Invalid Kill'' .
Second, there are some people on the server who is good at avoiding or reasoning rulebreaks,but in any way it has come to an end at last.

 I respect you and your friends , but Ryan , let the staff do their work

You understand, this is how reports work, the effected parties talk it out and the GM's make a decision based on that.

You running around both of those questions like sonic the hedgehog avoiding them is you attempting to hide the fact that Grishino and their people attacked US first in two of the three occasions. What do you want us to do? Let it slide?

Also like I said, you were initiated on individually twice and yet still decided to pull a runner, that's on you buddy.

Also, I rather you didn't throw accusations of 'being good at avoiding rulebreaks'. 

Also this isn't a cluster, pretty damn clear cut to me.

Actions cause equal and opposite reactions, deal with in in character, not on the forums when things don't go your way.

[Burak]

Reports are not meant for parties to discuss it out.... reports are to report a rule break, le each party post a point of view and let the GM's decide. They are not a court of back and forth. I wont be replying further.

[Ryan Shepherd]

User was warned for this portion of the post:

@Saunders, @Randy can either of you ask this man to answer those two questions please so we can get this over with.

Much appreciated.

[RandyRP]

@Burak 2.3 Reports are meant for the group leaders to talk it out and discuss what is going on so the Admins can see what is going on based off of all of the information laid out. Can you please answer the questions that @Ryan Shepherd asked. Thanks 

[Burak]

On 11/1/2019 at 10:11 PM, Ryan Shepherd said:

• Did Grishino and its allies initiate on @Challenger outside the front gates of Grishino while he was simply looting? Yes/No.
• Did Grishino and its allies initiate on @OxeN while he was in the airfield, rolling on him 15 (approx) people strong and initiate on him? Yes/No.

Both simple Yes and Yes. If Staff seek only that answer. Here it is.

''But'' here we are heading to another subject, Why trade union individuals ''alone''  (They are mostly minimum 4 or 5) looting just next to their hostile individuals ? When i tell they are baiting freshbloods(newplayers) to use them like target boards in hostility after initiation.He is of course not accepting it.
Very open i will tell something that Ryan Shepherd and his friends found these grishino individuals like carps in pond(no offense please.Its just examination.).They bait them and they have gunfight everyday.Its good type of practice i really saw that and assure that.However after report it got calm down.At least it worked a bit i guess.....


About invalid kill,he is still not honest, they were trying to initiate everyone on frontgate and the people meeting backyard.They didnt initiate on me individually , They saw me running 1 or 2 steps and gundown. Ok i dont have a video evidence too.But i don't have any reason to tell lies too same like Mr Ryan Shepherd.

Lets go another step: before i open any report or something like that. I always try to keep people in really good attitude.Or i try to solve within discord or by finding mutual friends.
I really apologize about sharing one URL

i read a conversation between @Roland and @Ryan Shepherd and decide it wouldnt work communicate with him. Because whenever people try to show him his wrong sides , or suggest him something , as i saw he just describe a lot to avoid or reason his own rulebreaks.
If I could understand i could solve with Ryan without any report , i could do. But I wanted to create report and see how Staff decide.


In the end i really respect every person who plays , or takes duty(staff) on this server.Even oldest, even youngest , even newest it doesnt matter.

Edit:Blue lined places edited.

Edited November 5, 2019 by Burak

[Ryan Shepherd]

This literally isn't even worth my time but alas, here we go again, for the last and final time.

1. The Trade Union come to Grishino to request them to join as Trade Union supporters (Not literal members, we don't do that.)

2. It's not in their interest, after some time, they initiate on @Challenger, we come and kill them all. ACTIONS CAUSE REACTIONS.

3. 2 Day's later, @OxeN is on the airfield and is initiated on immediately by 15 men from Grishino, again they are all killed by @Challenger & @OxeN. ACTIONS CAUSE REACTIONS.

4. I decide enough is enough and organise a planned attack as a sign of Trade Union dominance, we initiate & kill all the non compilers, which, sadly, is every one of them.

5. @Burak claims to be KoS'd when two men had seen him immediately run with his gun out once they initiated multiple times together. If you felt you were KoS'd why did you not immediately make a report regarding KoS? ACTIONS CAUSE REACTIONS.

6. Once the attack was over, I gave them a choice via the radio thread: 

Spoiler

7. However their chosen Trojan horse was non other than a 2.3 report. They realise that their own beloved character stories and way of life is under pressure, my character my story mentality, they decide to create a 2.3 report in order to solve their IC problems by OOC means, proof here: 

Spoiler

 

3 hours ago, Burak said:

However after report it got calm down.At least it worked a bit i guess.....

 

 

 

8. Also, I would appreciate it if you didn't slander me like that @Burak, I have been here for almost 6 years, if I was an avid rule breaker like you say, I wouldn't be here right now. I would like an apology for that slander.

People need to understand, as a group, you must choose your decisions extremely carefully, you choose your battles, in this case, you and your group/allies chose the wrong battle to take and resort to OOC means to undo your mistakes.

Deal with the consequences you have caused by non other that YOUR OWN DECISIONS.

Don't play with fire, burn your hand and blame the fire.

I am done responding to this report, I would like to remind staff of my wishes to counter report with False report.

Dasvidaniya.

Edited November 5, 2019 by Ryan Shepherd