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andysuter

Lying and NVFL

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In this recent report verdict, the OP is punished for two things, NVFL and lying in a report.

With respect to the former, the NVFL was deemed actionable due to the OP lying in an attempt to cover up his identify. His captors clearly knew who he was but the OP continued to try and talk his way out of it. He was then shot. The OP was then punished for NVFL for lying.

My question is this..... 

Is this not a direct contradiction of what @Roland said in this report verdict over ruling. Ie that lying is not a reason for execution and does not imply NVFL? 

My Character will lie to the death if needed to maintain his identity as a secret and i am now concerned that this will mean im going to be punished for NVFL without any consideration of the characters RP stance on NVFL

Edit following Phoenix reply-

 

But if your character is one who would argue or talk their way out of any situation, even knowing the consequences is that not Ruleplay over RP?

Im being upfront here, my character will never give up his identify if questioned so I can be assured I will be facing NVFL no matter the circumstances, just because I was out numbered etc

It could also be argued that the minute the OP admitted who he was, he knew he would be executed, therefore, it is justifiable that he acted in an RP manner by taking the cover up to the bitter end. He was going to die no matter what. These rules need to give the character a way out and I feel the OP didn’t get one, other than a black screen the minute he was caught.

In response to Hofer,

Thanks for replying 😊

I personally dont feel the reports do differ. In coolmans verdict it was a result of many previous interactions and he was executed for lying and not giving up info. The same can be translated to the other report, albeit much more recent interactions. In my eyes, they are the same situation, although it is agreeable that the OP did shit talk his was through it, but knowing the character myself from IC interactions, I know that’s exactly what he would do.

I think in this instance the rules took precedence over RP which is a concern for me

Final Edit @Hofer

Ok thanks guys. Personally I think you got this one wrong on the NVFL thing (hes bang to rights on the other!) because if a character would shit talk to the death, the rules are preventing them from doing so for fear of NVFL. I personally know a number of characters in the server that would do the same. Its an apocalypse after all, not everyone should be made to kiss the feet of their captors becasu ethats what the rules say you must do.

But thanks for the replying. 😊

Edited by andysuter

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The reason the NVFL was given was due to the fact that after being threatened with his life, the OP insulted the hostage takers when in such a situation where your life is at risk, you should be more respectful towards the people that could literally end it with the snap of their fingers.

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Hello @andysuter

The reports you have link differ from one another, even though they do seem similar at first glance.

In the latest report the OP had just recently been in a firefight with Anarchy, and was also part of the initiations if you've seen the proof provided in that report.

In the video posted about the initiation as well you can see that he is threatened to tell his real identity. This is where the comparison stops. The reason he was killed was not because of his lying or hiding his identity, it was because he insulted Anarchy while being threatened not to do that, stopped talking for a second while he was being threatened, and continued to to insult them after Norway was done threatening.

He was killed because he insulted 8/9 hostile people while being held at gun point and being theatened.

My long and detailed verdict explains this.

10 minutes ago, andysuter said:

My Character will lie to the death if needed to maintain his identity as a secret and i am now concerned that this will mean im going to be punished for NVFL without any consideration of the characters RP stance on NVFL

You don't have to worry about this, as long as you act humble properly and don't insult your hostage takers/the hostile party. As long as you value your own life.

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9 minutes ago, andysuter said:

My Character will lie to the death if needed to maintain his identity as a secret and i am now concerned that this will mean im going to be punished for NVFL without any consideration of the characters RP stance on NVFL

 

Hofer and Phoenix have more then covered the ground above and in the verdict on why the report in your question was verdicted as it was.

 

In regards to the specific line quoted above: You are more then welcome to lie to the death. As Roland states in the verdict he overturned, the attackers are allowed to threaten to kill you if you don't follow through, it just must be an empty threat. As per Rolands quote,  they just can't actually kill you for lying. You will not be punished for NVFL for lying.

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15 minutes ago, andysuter said:

In response to Hofer,

Thanks for replying 😊

I personally dont feel the reports do differ. In coolmans verdict it was a result of many previous interactions and he was executed for lying and not giving up info. The same can be translated to the other report, albeit much more recent interactions. In my eyes, they are the same situation, although it is agreeable that the OP did shit talk his was through it, but knowing the character myself from IC interactions, I know that’s exactly what he would do.

I think in this instance the rules took precedence over RP which is a concern for me

Not giving up your identity is fine. 

Laughing in the face of 8+ angry people you are lying to, calling them dumb? That's NVFL.

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